Roster Slot changes the reality and what to do now

Unknown

The roster slot seems to be similar to shields in that it's probably not originally intended to be a big money maker but turns out to be one, and I'm pretty sure roster slot is considerably bigger than shields at least based on the last known revenue breakdown so if they haven't gotten rid of shields they're obviously not going to get rid of roster slots cost either. It'd seem like there has to be a better opportunity to make money as opposed to something that seems to punish you for collecting but just like shields I don't think they've thought about what other sources of revenue/play mode can possibly replace the revenue they make from roster slots, so they've no incentive to change it.

There might be so long term negative ramfications with the way roster slots work but that's a very long term deal. Just like how alliance slots costing a huge amount of HP was always going to have a long term negative consequence but it took at least half an year before it caught up, I think roster slots will take even longer to catch up so ignoring the problem probably works for now.

I think people do buy too much roster slots in general, though that just further reinforces D3's stance of not budging on the slot costs.

Wonko33

I have a hard time complaining for my situation because it is self inflicted, I like to collect and I get attached to characters I've played a lot with when I started ( I just can't sell my IM35, but now I feel justified because of tacos)

But every time I pay for a new roster spot , it's my own pathology problem for keeping bagman and Moonstone and.....

The problem more for early players I think, there is no way they can get the HP fast enough and they mess up their transition to 3* by selling them. It's more than not just not adding the character it's the PvE essential nodes that slows them down too

Phaserhawk

Phantron wrote:

The roster slot seems to be similar to shields in that it's probably not originally intended to be a big money maker but turns out to be one, and I'm pretty sure roster slot is considerably bigger than shields at least based on the last known revenue breakdown so if they haven't gotten rid of shields they're obviously not going to get rid of roster slots cost either. It'd seem like there has to be a better opportunity to make money as opposed to something that seems to punish you for collecting but just like shields I don't think they've thought about what other sources of revenue/play mode can possibly replace the revenue they make from roster slots, so they've no incentive to change it.

There might be so long term negative ramfications with the way roster slots work but that's a very long term deal. Just like how alliance slots costing a huge amount of HP was always going to have a long term negative consequence but it took at least half an year before it caught up, I think roster slots will take even longer to catch up so ignoring the problem probably works for now.

I think people do buy too much roster slots in general, though that just further reinforces D3's stance of not budging on the slot costs.

yeah, I'm done buying for awhile. I will just start selling off my 1* and 2*. Even when I can use them in Heroics I don't, I usually just use my 3*, and the fact they said they are increasing the number of heros useable will help, but I"m not spending $ until they fix it. The more people follow suit the more effort we can put on them to change it. And I do agree Deadpool Daily could fix some of these issues if they are indeed thinking about adding roster slots as a prize or actually giving guarenteed HP but right now I"m not seeing much other than a $ grab.

slidecage

Phaserhawk wrote:

Yeah, until they start seeing a decline on HP with the veterans who refuse to pony up is the only time they plan on doing anything.

Here's the other way they could fix the Roster Slot issue without fixing it directly. Quit making characters mandatory. Stop the 1* tournaments or the need to have 2*'s, and change PvE essential nodes as well as PvP featured character, how about featured characters? My suggestion would be color comps. This week is yellow/red/blue 3*, so as long as the character you are using is a yellow/red/blue 3* So C.Mags, IM40, Captain America then you are good to go. This is also nice because you could rotate if you had multiple.

they will never see a major decline in HP sales until the Newbie pool drys up. I mean 20 bucks on a sale can get you around 10 to 12 slots when you first start out.

IamTheDanger

It's been a while, so dont remember exactly how it works. But, IIRC, slots go up by 50 Hp every 3 or 4 spots. That is, until you reach around 100 slots. Then they go up 100 Hp every slot. My next one is 3,500 Hp. A 4* cover is 2,500 Hp. Thats $25 USD for my next one. But since I'm not going to sell old characters that I've put so much time, iso, and Hp into, I have only one choice, to just accept it. I did sell one of my BW team up since it was lvl 1 with only 5 covers, (= 500 iso, so not a big loss). But I will not sell a maxed 1* or 2* for 1/10th of what I put into them. My opinion, a roster slot should not cost more than a 4* cover.

I understand, Demiurge is a business, they need to make a profit. But after a certain point, there really should be a cap. To just keep going up indefinitely is ridiculous. What happens when the cost of slots is several times what a player can earn in 2 weeks time? The only way to get new characters will be to sell old ones.

Dauthi

I also don't think there is a problem right now since you don't need to collect every character, you want to. I got rid of useless 2*s/1*s and with 53 roster slots I still have extra room for specifically built characters to send out as TUs. I am pretty sure I make more than enough HP to keep up with the cost if I had to also.

I do believe it may be a problem in the distant future, but definitely not now.

TLCstormz

Again.......you all are not looking at this as a NEWER player experience. Please. Try it.

esoxnepa

I am a collector, and I'm at 64 slots right now. I worked as a Software Engineer for many years, so I want to help support the game (I've spent around $220 for the year). Right now, there doesn't feel like there is anything "fun" to buy to support the game.

The addition of the DDQ has me really wanting to purchase some HP to show them how much I appreciate the addition of such a positive event. Then I start thinking about what I will spend the HP on. I'm currently ISO bound on leveling characters, so there is no reason to buy covers. The packs of covers are a terrible buy, and aren't even exciting to open. Even if I were to decide what to spend it on, there is no way to indicate it is to encourage features like DDQ and not just to cover my shields under the awful cooldown system.

So at some point, I will probably buy some more roster slots to support the game. Until then, I will trim the excess teamups characters I have stored.

Dauthi

TLCstormz wrote:

Again.......you all are not looking at this as a NEWER player experience. Please. Try it.

With Deadpool's Dailys now implemented I don't see an issue there either.

IamTheDanger

One thing that might be making the devs reluctant to change anything is the fact a lot of players will demand refunds. If they put a cap on slots at 1,500 Hp, then players that paid more than that will complain. (Remember the alliances all being made 20 members).

As for me, if they did put a cap on it, then I would not ask for a refund. I'll go on record here and now, saying that in the event D3 caps roster slots, I do not want a refund. The purchases I have made in the game were my decision. My choice to have extra roster slots.

But thats just me. Someone will always be upset no matter what happens. If they leave everything exactly as is, some players will be upset. If they change it, others will be upset. After the alliance upgrade incedent, Demiurge/D3 will need to handle this very carefully. If they were to go with the whole price cap, I would think 2,500 Hp, (cost of a 4* cover) would be as high as I would go. Or the ideas about making the cost go with the of the cover. Like 250 hp for slot, but it will only hold 1* characters. Then 500 hp for 2*, 1,250 hp for 3*. And 2,500 hp for slots that will only hold 4*. Or they could make it so that 1* slots hold only 1* characters, but 2* slot holds 1 and 2*. Then 3* slots hold 1*, 2*, and 3*. While the 2,500 hp slots hold any and all characters, 1*, 2*, 3*, or 4*.

Spoit

TLCstormz wrote:

Again.......you all are not looking at this as a NEWER player experience. Please. Try it.

That seems to be the main way that the devs are hearing the questions though. So....?

fmftint

IMO they need to cap roster size or slot cost. If they don't want people having ever character there needs to be a hard cap on roster size, cost even escalating is not enough of a deterrent

Unknown

TLCstormz wrote:

Again.......you all are not looking at this as a NEWER player experience. Please. Try it.

From a new player perspective, D3 seems to want to make money from roster slots and getting people to purchase hp. You're almost acting like none of us were stuck at 7 roster slots and had to wait a month to make up the hp to get enough for the 3 bundle. In fact, d3 has made it worse with multiple triple roster slot packs. A new roster will only earn at most 1 taco token a day, which is about 85 HP a week.

The reality is that nothing has really changed. The hardcore can still go f2p and earn hp to buy roster slots. The whales will whale. The very new players get their stuff handed to them to start. The rest of us in mid-tier have to either pay cash or make hard decisions about roster slots and token hoarding. The pain is intentional. I've probably thrown out 2 dozen beast covers, and 2-5 covers each of other older 3* just because I didn't have room at the time. To get rid of the pain, you either pay money or grind hp. Otherwise you deal with the pain of throwing away a cover forever.

simonsez

TLCstormz wrote:

Again.......you all are not looking at this as a NEWER player experience. Please. Try it.

The price of roster slots for new players are way cheaper than what people with full rosters have to pay. But the HP that is awarded via daily rewards, DDQ and PvE don't scale based on how long you've been playing. So I really don't see how NEWER players are having a harder time.

Azoic

Yah, I think it is absurd that they think the 2% chance of getting 250hp will address the roster problem. I have received one since the launch of it, while needing 3-4 slots in the meantime.

And agreed...it is not fun just spending money (and/or hp) to buy slots. I have purchased 2 10-packs before--one for my birthday, the month I started, and one just a few days ago for the DPD pack in hopes of ldaken. Now, while the first pack yielded something, the second gave nothing but 2*. I will never, ever buy a pack again, despite it actually being exciting opening up the cards.

IMO, reduce the cost of roster slots by a lot, and then give 10-packs a guaranteed drop of two 3*'s or better, which might increase sales of those, as they are at least a bit exciting---even more so for newer players whom do not have all fully leveled 3*'s like a lot of the vets, and could use about any cover they get.

Unknown

Since it is an artificial resource they can set it at whatever price point they want and as long as people buy them they are earning revenue. If you look at it from an economics perspective the price should be high enough to get a ROI (a player buying a roster slot should cost D3/demiurge almost nothing so pure profit). The other side of the coin is to set the price low enough that many people will actually buy them.

If you set them at $10000 each you wont earn $10000 dollars per slot because no one will buy any, you will earn nothing.
If you set them at $0.25 a slot you might find everyone buying enough slots for everyone they want to keep and extras to boot but run the risk of players willing to have paid more for the same thing.
If you set them at a magic number that lies somewhere in between where the business is encouraging the highest amount of sales x the highest profit per sale you have the ideal pricepoint.

Maybe, they have done the modeling and really will make more money by making them prohibitively expensive but it is far from absurd to suggest they might still turn large profits by lowering the costs.

over_clocked

Give Spider-Man a counter a la Deadpool points counter. If you play Spidey daily, that earns you enough points to exchange for a new roster slot, say, every 10 days. Maybe less.
If Deadpool uses his magic points to summon whales, Peter Parker uses hard-earned points to help Aunt May pay the bills.
Edit: and to actually add to gameplay you could use a small part of the stockpiled points to true heal your party in any match you bring Spidey to.
Just change his yellow skill please, it's only good for prolonged Survival matches. I barely use it despite running Patch/Elektra/Spidey when possible. In fact Spidey feels so useless with Daredevil, 4or and LC's stun being better and with Cage putting out a guaranteed protect tile, I am switching him for IM 40 for this comp.

MarvelMan

simonsez wrote:

TLCstormz wrote:

Again.......you all are not looking at this as a NEWER player experience. Please. Try it.

The price of roster slots for new players are way cheaper than what people with full rosters have to pay. But the HP that is awarded via daily rewards, DDQ and PvE don't scale based on how long you've been playing. So I really don't see how NEWER players are having a harder time.

Dont forget that roster slots are bundled for new players. That means they have to save longer between purchases, which can lead to not having a slot when they have a cover.

The problem is that the HP awarded DOES scale. If all a new player has is 1* and 2*s, they can get a MAX of 1 Taco Token, which cuts their HP earnings from that source in half, or more. For PVE, rosters are more on even footing so its about the same but for PVP can you really say a 1* roster can make 700 as easily as a 4*? That means they cant reach that 50hp reward. Its likely a 2* will have trouble hitting 575 as well. Does it scale in parallel to the cost of slots? I have no idea, but it definitely does scale.

For the health of the game we need more players to join as people quit, and this is a significant barrier. Hopefully R72 tweaks will ease it.

simonsez

MarvelMan wrote:

For PVE, rosters are more on even footing so its about the same but for PVP can you really say a 1* roster can make 700 as easily as a 4*?

No, that's why I specifically did not mention PvP. But that's just one source of HP. And in PvP, 100 HP are up for grabs via progressions. In Prodigal Sun, you could've made 700-800 in less than a week. So like I said, I'm not seeing much hardship here for those who are willing to make the effort.

Phaserhawk

simonsez wrote:

TLCstormz wrote:

Again.......you all are not looking at this as a NEWER player experience. Please. Try it.

The price of roster slots for new players are way cheaper than what people with full rosters have to pay. But the HP that is awarded via daily rewards, DDQ and PvE don't scale based on how long you've been playing. So I really don't see how NEWER players are having a harder time.

The only way you could get this to work is to establish enviornments where you must have x characters at full level in order to enter, the reason being there is a lot of HP to win, which in turn could pay for the ever increasing roster slots. So in my example.


Room 1--I cannot enter room 2 until I have x characters maxed leveled. In Room 2 are more nodes that offer higher ISO and HP

Room 2--I cannot enter room 3 until I have x characters maxed levled. In Room 3 are even more nodes that offer even higher ISO and HP.

This goes on and on etc. Sure you could pay money to accelerate yourself into these rooms but that won't matter, the fact of the matter is that people with large rosters need more ISO and HP than a beginner, but there is not effective way to shut out that new player, unless you require them to meet a certain threshold to get into the new tier of rewards. This would allow say the max roster guy to get 20,000 ISO and 300 HP for finishing top 5 in PvP, but a low level guy would only get the 5000 and 100HP because he doesn't meet the new threshold to crack into higher rewards.

This could be done with Deadpool Daily since that's what they are pushing. They could have seperate nodes that only offer HP and ISO and that in order to enter them you must have certain lineup requirments, like 6 maxed 3*'s, the last node could be 10 maxed 3*'s and 1 maxed 4* in order to enter the node to win the 100 HP or whatever. This then would help us keep pace with the roster costs, while not flooding newbies with all the extra's they haven't earned yet. They talked about how they have to balance the flow of ISO and HP because they can't make it too much to make it overly advantageous to those just starting, but they can't make it too low either to stifle veterans. But having a Deadpool Daily side nodes that only are accesable but your roster would fix this issue, increasing the flow of ISO and HP to those that need it, and keeping newbies from accelerating way too quickly.