This is so ridiculous...

Unknown

I am in the awful transition from two to three star, with a couple of 100+ three star heroes. I thought this was pretty good, and was enjoying levelling.

Sadly, the last week has shown me what a ridiculous situation I am now in. My roster is nowhere near good enough to break 500/600 in PvP, so no chance of reward there. Ah well, there's always PvE, which used to be my favourite part of the the game.

But no. This scaling nonsense has killed it for me. I can take on one wave of enemies, ranging from level 25-115, then the next wave, all level 150 and above simply crush me. No chance of reward there either. Why has it gone so wrong? Surely the point is to reward progression in the game, not punish it?

And now I gather PvP only works when roster is kept to level 94. What? Come on, developers, make this game have some sort of worthwhile enjoyment for a player like me, and so many others, or I will walk, itunes gift cards in hand...

Unknown

575 is actually pretty good for your roster in PvP. You get 50 and an event token. How much higher did you expect to progress with a 2* roster exactly?

PvE is another beast. Scaling there does get a bit out of control, but the best rosters in PvE are all level 94 characters. Depending how far over 100 your characters are, you are actually in the sweet spot before scaling gets to be out of control. You have no idea what I would give for level 150 enemies.

In short, you are getting the rewards you deserve. You maybe finish for 1 3* cover in events, and you get progression rewards up to your ability. The sheer number of characters means you are going to cover characters very slowly. Take those and turn them into a solid 13 cover 3*. Then level him to 166. Then go from there.

DD-The-Mighty

Lerysh wrote:

575 is actually pretty good for your roster in PvP. You get 50 and an event token. How much higher did you expect to progress with a 2* roster exactly?

PvE is another beast. Scaling there does get a bit out of control, but the best rosters in PvE are all level 94 characters. Depending how far over 100 your characters are, you are actually in the sweet spot before scaling gets to be out of control. You have no idea what I would give for level 150 enemies.

In short, you are getting the rewards you deserve. You maybe finish for 1 3* cover in events, and you get progression rewards up to your ability. The sheer number of characters means you are going to cover characters very slowly. Take those and turn them into a solid 13 cover 3*. Then level him to 166. Then go from there.

Really? what do you have to say to a player who has multiple 114-150 3*s but cant even stay in top 100 to get a single 3* cover due to the disgusting flood of max teams and whaled up 4*s? what is "their level"?

simonsez

DD-The-Mighty wrote:

Really? what do you have to say to a player who has multiple 114-150 3*s but cant even stay in top 100

I would say learn how to use shields. I've seen CStorm/MnMag formations with over 900 points, so it can't be impossible to make T100

Unknown

In PvE there are a lot of enemy teams that fight way above or way below their level and you can't just look at the level number to determine how hard it is. There's relativley few Juggernaut and Daken in Iso 8, but there are also some really cheap villian & goon combo so it's sort of a wash. All the essential super high level goon only nodes are pretty much cakewalk for Captain America, even the 2* version can beat them if you start out boosted in red (to account for extremely bad luck where you're not able to lockdown the board before you get wiped on one of their abilities).

Unknown

DD-The-Mighty wrote:

Lerysh wrote:

575 is actually pretty good for your roster in PvP. You get 50 and an event token. How much higher did you expect to progress with a 2* roster exactly?

PvE is another beast. Scaling there does get a bit out of control, but the best rosters in PvE are all level 94 characters. Depending how far over 100 your characters are, you are actually in the sweet spot before scaling gets to be out of control. You have no idea what I would give for level 150 enemies.

In short, you are getting the rewards you deserve. You maybe finish for 1 3* cover in events, and you get progression rewards up to your ability. The sheer number of characters means you are going to cover characters very slowly. Take those and turn them into a solid 13 cover 3*. Then level him to 166. Then go from there.

Really? what do you have to say to a player who has multiple 114-150 3*s but cant even stay in top 100 to get a single 3* cover due to the disgusting flood of max teams and whaled up 4*s? what is "their level"?

I'd say you probably didn't want to level characters to 150 until you were ready for 3* land. Also I'd say that 150 is 1250 HP away from being a 166.

DD-The-Mighty

simonsez wrote:

DD-The-Mighty wrote:

Really? what do you have to say to a player who has multiple 114-150 3*s but cant even stay in top 100

I would say learn how to use shields. I've seen CStorm/MnMag formations with over 900 points, so it can't be impossible to make T100

nah. shield hopping is kinda janky. effective but busted in its execution. Doing it for anything less that top 10-5 is a waste of money. but if you wanna shield hop with MN mags/storm combos more power to ya.

Lerysh wrote:

I'd say you probably didn't want to level characters to 150 until you were ready for 3* land. Also I'd say that 150 is 1250 HP away from being a 166.

good point. in hindsight I shoulda hoarded until i could blast to 166. Though im never going to spend HP on iso. Not while they keep hiking slot prices. maybe if they really deliver on their promises of manageable daily 3* covers and normalize the rosters, until then, I'm patient.

Unknown

If you have developed roster, there is a way for 2* to earn top100. Don't join bracket until it have ~2h left to end and race up. You will end up in partially filled one which makes much, much easier to place high. Full 500 filled rewards 100 people with 3* covers which is only 20% participants (and that 20% is usually all 3* transitioned), one with 250 still gives 100 3* placements, but it ends up being 40% of population. Doesn't work every time, but I'd say 4 out of 5 times is doable.

Square

DD-The-Mighty wrote:

nah. shield hopping is kinda janky. effective but busted in its execution. Doing it for anything less that top 10-5 is a waste of money. but if you wanna shield hop with MN mags/storm combos more power to ya.

3* cover costs 1250 hp to buy. Shield hopping yourself into top 25 (average about 600-700 points now) is a good idea. That's enough to get you into a top 100 alliance. So, about 300-600 hp in shields seems like a good price for 3 3* covers.

Unknown

Lerysh wrote:

DD-The-Mighty wrote:

Lerysh wrote:

I'd say you probably didn't want to level characters to 150 until you were ready for 3* land. Also I'd say that 150 is 1250 HP away from being a 166.

He or she should be forced to overpay for just sixteen levels, then? On a cover that shouldn't be as difficult to obtain as the developer makes it? Hmmm... interesting logic. Let me just get right on that with MY covers, then.

<$200 later, between coins and enough ISO to level...>

WOO HOO! Wait, exactly what did I just waste my money on, again?

scottee

If you can't break 500-600 in PVP, the problem is not roster strength.

A maxed 2* roster should be able to make a couple of pushes and walk retaliations to around 600. I did it recently and got to 633. Then put up a 3 or 8 hour shield till the end.

DD-The-Mighty

Square wrote:

DD-The-Mighty wrote:

nah. shield hopping is kinda janky. effective but busted in its execution. Doing it for anything less that top 10-5 is a waste of money. but if you wanna shield hop with MN mags/storm combos more power to ya.

3* cover costs 1250 hp to buy. Shield hopping yourself into top 25 (average about 600-700 points now) is a good idea. That's enough to get you into a top 100 alliance. So, about 300-600 hp in shields seems like a good price for 3 3* covers.

Last i saw only the top 5 get three covers. That's a wold of a difference from just barely hopping your way into the 25th spot, which only gets you 2. If you're one for cashing your covers, then sure hop till you pop. it'll be possibly cheaper than just buying the cover outright. Assuming you win every attack and retaliation you have Que'd up and you don't get firebombed in-between each hop.

But if you're not looking to spend HP on the neverending influx of covers you will need to get, at best, it's just a slightly safer way of gambling for a cover spot.

Unknown

Mandorallen wrote:

Lerysh wrote:

DD-The-Mighty wrote:

Lerysh wrote:

I'd say you probably didn't want to level characters to 150 until you were ready for 3* land. Also I'd say that 150 is 1250 HP away from being a 166.

He or she should be forced to overpay for just sixteen levels, then? On a cover that shouldn't be as difficult to obtain as the developer makes it? Hmmm... interesting logic. Let me just get right on that with MY covers, then.

<$200 later, between coins and enough ISO to level...>

WOO HOO! Wait, exactly what did I just waste my money on, again?

I didn't say buy ISO. I didn't even say buy HP with $$. I said 1250 HP makes him a 166. That's because 1 cover on a 150 makes a 13 cover, and then you earn iso and you have a 166.

You can earn 1250 HP over time. I didn't advocate spending a dime, just that having a guy sitting there at 150 he's probably better of buying a cover in the current system. Especially if that hero is vaulted.

Unknown

DD-The-Mighty wrote:

Square wrote:

DD-The-Mighty wrote:

nah. shield hopping is kinda janky. effective but busted in its execution. Doing it for anything less that top 10-5 is a waste of money. but if you wanna shield hop with MN mags/storm combos more power to ya.

3* cover costs 1250 hp to buy. Shield hopping yourself into top 25 (average about 600-700 points now) is a good idea. That's enough to get you into a top 100 alliance. So, about 300-600 hp in shields seems like a good price for 3 3* covers.

Last i saw only the top 5 get three covers. That's a wold of a difference from just barely hopping your way into the 25th spot, which only gets you 2. If you're one for cashing your covers, then sure hop till you pop. it'll be possibly cheaper than just buying the cover outright. Assuming you win every attack and retaliation you have Que'd up and you don't get firebombed in-between each hop.

But if you're not looking to spend HP on the neverending influx of covers you will need to get, at best, it's just a slightly safer way of gambling for a cover spot.

Top 100 alliance will net you a duplicate of the 100th placement cover. Hence 3 for 25. Top 5 actually gets you 4 covers.

DD-The-Mighty

Lerysh wrote:

DD-The-Mighty wrote:

Square wrote:

DD-The-Mighty wrote:

nah. shield hopping is kinda janky. effective but busted in its execution. Doing it for anything less that top 10-5 is a waste of money. but if you wanna shield hop with MN mags/storm combos more power to ya.

3* cover costs 1250 hp to buy. Shield hopping yourself into top 25 (average about 600-700 points now) is a good idea. That's enough to get you into a top 100 alliance. So, about 300-600 hp in shields seems like a good price for 3 3* covers.

Last i saw only the top 5 get three covers. That's a wold of a difference from just barely hopping your way into the 25th spot, which only gets you 2. If you're one for cashing your covers, then sure hop till you pop. it'll be possibly cheaper than just buying the cover outright. Assuming you win every attack and retaliation you have Que'd up and you don't get firebombed in-between each hop.

But if you're not looking to spend HP on the neverending influx of covers you will need to get, at best, it's just a slightly safer way of gambling for a cover spot.

Top 100 alliance will net you a duplicate of the 100th placement cover. Hence 3 for 25. Top 5 actually gets you 4 covers.

True. I calculated for the majority. Though the forum crowd loves to push for mercenary T100 alliance-hopping shenanigans. So from that angle its 3/4. but for the average its 2/3.

Unknown

Lerysh wrote:

I didn't say buy ISO. I didn't even say buy HP with $$. I said 1250 HP makes him a 166. That's because 1 cover on a 150 makes a 13 cover, and then you earn iso and you have a 166.

You can earn 1250 HP over time. I didn't advocate spending a dime, just that having a guy sitting there at 150 he's probably better of buying a cover in the current system. Especially if that hero is vaulted.

You are right; you didn't say buy with actual money. I assumed your meaning, based on how I read your post. My assumption was also based on my own experience with this game, and how I have also experienced much of what the OP is talking about.

I also think that it is a bit unrealistic to play and pay for things using ONLY the HP given by the game. The game gives you precious little HP, meanIng someone would need to save for awhile, I imagine. Again, this is based on my own experience with the game, so please correct me on that account if I'm wrong.

Unknown

Your experience will change with a solid 166 I imagine. Mine did.

Take this PvE for example: 17 subs, each of which awards 25 HP for top 30. Top 30 is doable with a 94 roster or better. That's 425 you didn't spend any to get. Plus if you top 30 each sub you PROBABLY top 50 the event, That's 50 plus the progression 50 so thats 525 for 1 PvE event. 3 of those and you get yourself any cover that you want. Not every event has as many subs with as many rewards as Brotherhood, but it's not extremely outside the reward structure either.

The key to HP accumulation is to not waste them. Don't shield PvP unless you need the top 100 cover for a character you plan to immediately use. Earn the 50 HP for 575 PvP score then let your ranking land where it lands. I do this now, except I go for the 725 (or 850) awards. Any time you don't shield is HP in your pocket. Play for ISO, and maybe placement, but don't shield or only 3 hour shield the last 3 hours of the event (to then earn 50 HP for top 50). Consider, really REALLY hard, if you want your 1* IM35 or if you want 400 HP for that roster slot. Then sell IM35.

I just bought a 2500 TGT cover with HP, at the start of the Webslinger Tournament. I'm back up 500 HP from that purchase, and I'm not shy about spending them, and that was a week ago. 500 HP a week is not a bad turn over, and means you can get any one cover you want every 3 weeks, if you save. Granted I probably place higher than a 2* roster does, but the PvE HP are actually EASIER for a 2* roster to get.

One key is your alliance. You want a top 250 alliance minimum, netting a bonus 50 HP an event. If you aren't in one, get in one. Improve your scores to where they need to be to get in one. Top 100 obviously preferred.

Unknown

You make a compelling case, certainly. However, I think your experiences and mine are about as far off as they can get. The most I've gotten from any event I've done, even the ones that I've done well in, would be fifty HP. Maybe a hundy, one time. I'm old and jaded, so I can't remember too far back. I also think this game is designed to take as much of our money as it can, so If you're netting that much HP, then kudos. Truly.

Unknown

Guys, lots of good feedback and suggestions. It does show my lack of experience in the game, as I thought getting high levels would make gameplay better, but not always the case.
I just have to be realistic about PvE and kniw not to bother entering a particular game that I will be crushed on, and focus where I can do well. At least I am managing to do quite well in the season, approaching the 2800 mark, so that means I can progress with patience. Getting to 500 in a single event is doable, and I get a lot of enjoyment from adding a cover to any character (collector mentality), so that will always make the game fun for me.
Cheers!

_RiO_

Lerysh wrote:

One key is your alliance. You want a top 250 alliance minimum, netting a bonus 50 HP an event. If you aren't in one, get in one. Improve your scores to where they need to be to get in one. Top 100 obviously preferred.

A.k.a. the old "play semi-pro or don't play at all. Casuals need not apply."-argument.
That is seriously not an OK place to be for a casual mobile game.

Unknown

On the one hand, the argument about progression and placement rewards. On the other hand, the argument for casual games. I'm not sure you can have both.

All casual games have their hardcore players. The ones who win all the things all the time. Especially in P2W models, which this is. Trying to compete with them is madness. Then you have your "semi-pros" as you put it. They will fill the top parts of the leaderboards. If you want to play casually, that's fine, but then don't complain that making top 100 for a cover is too hard. It's not too hard, it's just work.

Also, I imagine you could make it into a top 250 alliance with a play 2 hours a day during PvE refreshes and score 500 in PvP scores. I'm just sayin', Alliances play a big part in the rewards structure. Ignoring it is ignoring potential rewards you could get.