PVP - ISO reward dependant on opponant team strength.

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Clintman
Clintman Posts: 757 Critical Contributor
edited February 2014 in MPQ General Discussion
One thing that has been gnawing at me is the reward structure of the game and where incentives are at.

Right now if I want to farm ISO to level my characters the fastest and easiset way to do this to to find the weakest team I can find and take their lunch money. I make the same reward beating up a school kid as I do beating down a MMA Prize fighter.

A better option would be to scale the amount of ISO gained by evaluating the opposing team you are facing, a Full 141 team should be 300 ISO (for example) to fight. I would not take into account the roster strength as you may be facing a tank team in a LR and should not recieve extra compensation for that.

I am thinking something like:

1* average team level 3-150 = 70-100 ISO
2* Average Team level 151-255 = 140-200 ISO
3* Average Team Level 255+ = 200-300 ISO

My first love is MMOs so I always think in the following terms. If you made the same money killing Giant Rats as you do beating Giants, you would never leave the starting zone and would spend your time farming giant rats. There needs to be incentive to take on the harder and more importantly LONGER fights.

When I play the only thing I care about is ISO generation, I really don't care about the challenge of the team I fight, I am more interested in leveling up Patch to 141 so I can see how he performs with a different make up. I have 30+ characters in my roster I want to level up, but I still make the same ISO per fight that I did with my 1* team.

Comments

  • Puritas
    Puritas Posts: 670 Critical Contributor
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    +1aaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaa
  • Unknown
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    Puritas wrote:
    +1aaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaa

    +1
  • MarvelMan
    MarvelMan Posts: 1,350
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    I posted a comment this morning along the same lines so definitely a +1.

    My thought was to use the level of the opponent faced and a multiplier to determine the ISO reward. The compensation is much for a 3x 230 fight than a tank team, which is how it should be. I like the multiplier idea better than tiers as it allows for simpler tweaking of the reward (with communication!) as exploits are discovered.
  • Unknown
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    I've been beating the drum for awhile, but the rate of ISO gain for higher level players is terrible. Especially now that the game has slowed down and PvE events have level scaling.

    Each 3 star character they pile on to us represents another mountain of battles/petty awards we have to fight in order to get them to a decent level to even try them out.


    I would have loved to leveled up DD and played around with him. But he was currently number 11 on my "to be leveled list". So, maybe by mid-October I could get to him (assuming more characters are released in that time). Sadly, Psylocke is looking the same way...


    What's the point in releasing new characters if we can't use them for months after release?
  • Unknown
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    It seems like it'd be a better idea to just tie ISO rewards to MMR. Basing them on some flawed measure of team strength just adds more undesirable metagame elements - now you have a reason to use lower-level characters because in some ways they make you a less desirable target than higher-level characters, if the measure of team strength is just the sum of character levels.

    Currently, MMR is subject to gaming because players have a lot of reason to tank; there are many upsides to maintaining a low MMR and the only downside is the time required to win a few matches before putting in a tank team (and this still has a reasonable return on investment given progression rewards). However, if match rewards increased with MMR, players would have lots of reason to choose not to tank. This would do a lot to align player incentives with the way the developers would like players to approach all matches.

    Edit: Obviously it would still be the case that you'd prefer to fight weaker teams than stronger teams, all else equal, but given the soon-to-be-implemented skip tax/bonus I'm not sure that skipping to find a weak team will still be obviously the best way to score ISO.
  • Unknown
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    Gotchaye wrote:
    It seems like it'd be a better idea to just tie ISO rewards to MMR.

    That's one damn good idea!
  • MarvelMan
    MarvelMan Posts: 1,350
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    pasa_ wrote:
    Gotchaye wrote:
    It seems like it'd be a better idea to just tie ISO rewards to MMR.

    That's one damn good idea!


    While I like this I think they need to clean up the MMR issues before implementing it.
  • Unknown
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    Yeah. I'd still rather crush 3 low MMR teams for 1/3 the reward than slug it out with 1 high MMR team for the full reward.
  • Unknown
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    MarvelMan wrote:
    pasa_ wrote:
    Gotchaye wrote:
    It seems like it'd be a better idea to just tie ISO rewards to MMR.

    That's one damn good idea!


    While I like this I think they need to clean up the MMR issues before implementing it.

    Those are orthogonal issues -- and I'm skeptical of considerable improvement. In the meantime would enjoy some compensation cookies for the MMR hell experience in general and for my more trouble gaining the same tournament points in particular.
  • Unknown
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    ApolloAndy wrote:
    Yeah. I'd still rather crush 3 low MMR teams for 1/3 the reward than slug it out with 1 high MMR team for the full reward.

    Sure, but we don't chose our MMR do we?
  • Unknown
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    The higher level you get the more ISO you can farm. Seems like once you got to a certain point where you could farm high lvl teams that it would just turn into a rich get richer or at least be able to separate themselves more while others are fighting through getting decreased ISO as a beginner.

    On the other hand, more ISO for me so whatever.
  • Unknown
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    pasa_ wrote:
    ApolloAndy wrote:
    Yeah. I'd still rather crush 3 low MMR teams for 1/3 the reward than slug it out with 1 high MMR team for the full reward.

    Sure, but we don't chose our MMR do we?

    Yeah, kinda?
  • Clintman
    Clintman Posts: 757 Critical Contributor
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    I have to admit I am getting kind of sick of the wellfare system mentality people seem to have in general. Everyone should not be equal, and the rich should get richer. Being rich is not a problem unless you are ultra liberal, What matters is that there is a path to get rich.

    When you are higher level, with higher level rosters you have put in the time and should be compensated for your progress. Everyone does not need to be equal, new players should not have access to the same rewards that I should have access to.

    I should be making more as I progress. It drives me nuts to lose a 4*** wolverine cover to a guy with a level 45 as his highest character with a roster of half covered 2* covers.

    Going back to my first analogy, killing snakes for the same amount of money as giants makes no sense, risk should equal reward.

    At this point where many people have 2-3 3* toons maxed out, we are not leveling toons to be able to compete, we are leveling them to have diversity and explore other areas of the game, the cost of maxing out these additional covers need to be cheaper. The ways discussed here would go a long way to improving that.
  • Unknown
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    Psykopathic wrote:
    The higher level you get the more ISO you can farm. Seems like once you got to a certain point where you could farm high lvl teams that it would just turn into a rich get richer or at least be able to separate themselves more while others are fighting through getting decreased ISO as a beginner.

    On the other hand, more ISO for me so whatever.


    Rich get richer? Come on. The more you play the more opportunities you get to earn ISO because of an increased roster size and increased levels. Placing HP and ISO in your character is considered making richer. Boosts, health packs, and shields don't last long. Poor don't get poorer. Everyone gains. everyone gets stuff. Some people have more.

    Seriously, the only way to lose a big chunk of ISO and HP is to sell your high level characters. icon_mrgreen.gif
  • Unknown
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    Bugpop wrote:
    Psykopathic wrote:
    The higher level you get the more ISO you can farm. Seems like once you got to a certain point where you could farm high lvl teams that it would just turn into a rich get richer or at least be able to separate themselves more while others are fighting through getting decreased ISO as a beginner.

    On the other hand, more ISO for me so whatever.


    Rich get richer? Come on. The more you play the more opportunities you get to earn ISO because of an increased roster size and increased levels. Placing HP and ISO in your character is considered making richer. Boosts, health packs, and shields don't last long. Poor don't get poorer. Everyone gains. everyone gets stuff. Some people have more.

    Seriously, the only way to lose a big chunk of ISO and HP is to sell your high level characters. icon_mrgreen.gif

    I don't have any problem with the idea myself. Just trying to think like they might in their meetings as to why they would or wouldn't do this.

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