Sidewinder (Seth Voelker) 4*

@bluewolf said:
Prediction: assuming a nerf is coming, it hits as the next season begins in 4 weeks.

(I didn’t originally think of that timing.)

That allows them to fully see what happens when everyone can get him by favoriting him etc.

Too long? Sure, but it seems likely nonetheless.

I feel like waiting that long is going to put a lot of players in a bad situation, and put the devs in a bad situation regarding compensation as well.

PvP right now is maybe 75% Chasm Sidewinder, and when the Chasm boost week ends I think it's going to stick around to some extent. Players who don't have him are going to feel pretty forced into spending some resources on him, even if we know he's disappearing shortly. The alternative is just taking a full season off, and I doubt most would do that.

Now, you've got a bunch of folks who spent money or resources into acquiring him, and they're going to expect compensation for the nerf. If they do it today, he's not even in tokens yet, so at the very worst you only offer refunds to the people who bought his bundles.

@Codex said:

@entrailbucket said:

@revskip said:
I suspect a nerf will be coming in on this one. I know folks who did 2000 wins in SHIELD Sim this past season just doing 1 turn wins with Sidewinder. I personally am already up to 100 wins in the Rogue PvP with the vast majority of those wins happening before the other team ever gets to make a match. Those kind of metrics probably catch some eyes.

I ran Chasm (550) M'baku (470) Sidewinder (272 or something) with both cascade supports and leapfrog -- boosted +2 TU every fight, against mostly 550/550/550.

Against non Chasm teams I usually won (mind you, against full 550 5* teams) before they could move the board at all, and sometimes even before they woke up from the stun. Any cascade killed one or more enemies.

Sidewinder just has to be bugged. There is no way this is intentional.

The only "full" 550 team I saw was 3a5Namor chasm baku. The rest had at most two 550s with at the most a lvl 290 Sidewinder.

I was just thinking about this, and I'm not sure why I didn't realize it then. The matchmaking algorithm tries to find fights appropriate for your roster, and hides opponents that are too weak.

When I started in sim, near the very end, there were a bunch of poor unfortunate folks running weak teams like 550 Shang-Chi/m'Thor/Riri, and of course the game is going to give me those fights over Sidewinder teams -- the Sidewinder teams are running a 4* who's barely 270 (or even less). The game was hiding them because it thought they were too weak for me, and it was still able to find tons of "appropriate" fights made up of 3 550 5*. Once it ran out of those, it started showing me the "weak" Sidewinder teams.

I bet this is also why I never see the Iron May teams in sim. This is actually a pretty serious flaw in the current matchmaking algorithm -- it thinks all 5* are better than all 3* and 4*, and they've broken that rule recently.

Hey @S0kun any chance we can get hobgoblin looked at pre or post release, his numbers seem very very low

@S0kun said:
Thanks everyone for sharing your thoughts on Seth's kit and obviously his Yellow. We've made some adjustments to slow him down a little without making this rebalance feel too much like a nerf with the updated numbers found in the OP.

TLDR; His Yellow will require 8 TU AP to reach max potential vs the original 5 TU AP.

These changes will go into effect sometime tonight around 10pm PST.

Hey when you overwrite the old numbers in the original post it makes it harder to compare the new/old numbers and actually see what changed.

I would wager it doesn't really change anything at all (it miiiight add an extra turn to a fight here or there).

The napkin math (assuming the comment about 8 TU rather than 5 and nothing else changes):

• 1,525% / 5 = 305% per TU that it is currently
• 1,525% / 8 = 190.6% per TU after
• The 5 TU was already a given, you were basically getting that to set him off. So now, when you do, his buff will still be 953% (which is ludicrously higher than the norm). Start with a few TU and you will also be doing match ending damage and maxing it out on your first move.

Is the intent that this is only temporary while the full rebalance is being looked at? No one else in the game can come close to him... and he's a D List villain at best.

That said, I appreciate the hot off the press news, even if I don't understand it. Hopefully the next few characters block 98% of match damage, because that's what it's going to take to stop this guy.

@ThisisClemFandango said:
Hey @S0kun any chance we can get hobgoblin looked at pre or post release, his numbers seem very very low

Sorry, no resources to spare. The team is busy working on a support that gives TU at the start of the match

@WhiteBomber said:
I would wager it doesn't really change anything at all (it miiiight add an extra turn to a fight here or there).

The napkin math (assuming the comment about 8 TU rather than 5 and nothing else changes):

• 1,525% / 5 = 305% per TU that it is currently
• 1,525% / 8 = 190.6% per TU after
• The 5 TU was already a given, you were basically getting that to set him off. So now, when you do, his buff will still be 953% (which is ludicrously higher than the norm). Start with a few TU and you will also be doing match ending damage and maxing it out on your first move.

Is the intent that this is only temporary while the full rebalance is being looked at? No one else in the game can come close to him... and he's a D List villain at best.

That said, I appreciate the hot off the press news, even if I don't understand it. Hopefully the next few characters block 98% of match damage, because that's what it's going to take to stop this guy.

Yeah this is barely anything lol

This isn't a character that has been out for a long time (chasm, mthor) where people will be upset at a nerf. Sidewinder is crazy and most people are WANTING a nerf. Moving from 5tu to 8tu but keeping the same gigantic boost is nothing.

If you're hell-bent on giving him a 1500% boost have it spread out over 30 AP. Or, better, cut the max boost from 1500 to something less insane, like 500%, but still have it spread out over AP.

Right now, if I start the match with 3-4 TU ap, a boosted 5 is doing over 100k easy. I think my boosted mthor hit for 225k turn 1 but that might've included a charged tile.

@entrailbucket said:

@BlackBoltRocks said:
What're the odds on 2* Daredevil having a passive Sonar ability that reduces all enemy match damage by 99%

They could make this insanely overpowered guy and he'd have ZERO impact on the Chasm/Sidewinder teams -- he's dead before his passive even turns on.

All the more reason to get players to get him up to lv550 asap.

@TheXMan said:
For a character with match damage reduction (like Juggernaut), how is that calculated? If he reduces 90% but Winder boosts 1500%, how does that work out?

If I were to guess it would be (Match Damage x 1500%)/90%. Still not great for Juggs, but he might survive a hit.