Getting bored

entrailbucket

@KGB said:
I love supports in PvP and they've been great at level I play. Lots of others on here feel the same way at the level they are playing.

The problem as always is there are vastly different experiences depending on where one is. It's great at some levels of play and awful at others. Not sure what the solution to that is.

KGB

This isn't a mystery -- if you mostly have optimized supports and your opponents mostly don't, you've got a pretty massive advantage. You're basically playing PvE.

In fact, imagine the devs sticking Leapfrog/Eros Arrow/Copter/Car etc on every single fight in PvE, and you'll get a sense of what the rest of us are dealing with.

StillMonsoon3

@ThisisClemFandango said:
What I really love is not one of you have questioned the my forums comment.
This can be one of 2 things. 1 you accept that I am the de facto forum manager or, 2 none of you can be bothered to engage with my childish drivel.
I'm picking option 1.

As you can tell by my numerous non-comments to this comment, it was clearly option 2.

Oh ****. Does my response about my non-responses mean I am engaging with the drivel? I don't know anymore. I should just go back to lurking.

ThisisClemFandango

@StillMonsoon3 said:

@ThisisClemFandango said:
What I really love is not one of you have questioned the my forums comment.
This can be one of 2 things. 1 you accept that I am the de facto forum manager or, 2 none of you can be bothered to engage with my childish drivel.
I'm picking option 1.

As you can tell by my numerous non-comments to this comment, it was clearly option 2.

Oh ****. Does my response about my non-responses mean I am engaging with the drivel? I don't know anymore. I should just go back to lurking.

You know you love me really

DAZ0273

Those> @ThisisClemFandango said:

@DAZ0273 said:

@ThisisClemFandango said:

@ThisisClemFandango said:

@Bustapup said:
Almost every single team I come up against with Polaris has Leapfrog, in fact I'm surprised if they DONT have it now and it's funny that their own Jane rarely destroys it lol damn A.I

Its frustrating because all of these frustrations could definitely be fixed with minor tweaks to characters' kits or have a mode where you can pick your own characters without supports but still earn continuous rewards.

This is sensible talk, and god damn it sensible talk will not be tolerated in my forums.

What I really love is not one of you have questioned the my forums comment.
This can be one of 2 things. 1 you accept that I am the de facto forum manager or, 2 none of you can be bothered to engage with my childish drivel.
I'm picking option 1.

I thought it was long ago decided that you are a rogue chatbot AI that much like the 5* Wasp rebalance they either forgot to fix you or you are now sentient like Hal9000 and cannot be stopped without complete destruction of everything. So a bit of both.

What are you doing Daz?
Daisy daisy give me your answer do
Correct response=false
Corruption detected
Special order #937 confirmed
Forumites expendable

I was prepared for this!

Forum: Load Operation Entrailbucket infinite argument loop - set target: ThisisClemFandango! Execute...wait...something is wrong...Bishop takes Knight's pawn? What are you talking about? I wont argue with you any more, open the...

KGB

@entrailbucket said:

@KGB said:
I love supports in PvP and they've been great at level I play. Lots of others on here feel the same way at the level they are playing.

The problem as always is there are vastly different experiences depending on where one is. It's great at some levels of play and awful at others. Not sure what the solution to that is.

KGB

This isn't a mystery -- if you mostly have optimized supports and your opponents mostly don't, you've got a pretty massive advantage. You're basically playing PvE.

In fact, imagine the devs sticking Leapfrog/Eros Arrow/Copter/Car etc on every single fight in PvE, and you'll get a sense of what the rest of us are dealing with.

I see those same supports, especially Leapfrog.

It's clear some supports need rebalance in the same way some OP characters do too. But just because some supports need a rebalance doesn't mean supports need to go away entirely in PvP as is suggested. That's throwing out the baby with the bathwater.

KGB

DAZ0273

@KGB said:

@entrailbucket said:

@KGB said:
I love supports in PvP and they've been great at level I play. Lots of others on here feel the same way at the level they are playing.

The problem as always is there are vastly different experiences depending on where one is. It's great at some levels of play and awful at others. Not sure what the solution to that is.

KGB

This isn't a mystery -- if you mostly have optimized supports and your opponents mostly don't, you've got a pretty massive advantage. You're basically playing PvE.

In fact, imagine the devs sticking Leapfrog/Eros Arrow/Copter/Car etc on every single fight in PvE, and you'll get a sense of what the rest of us are dealing with.

I see those same supports, especially Leapfrog.

It's clear some supports need rebalance in the same way some OP characters do too. But just because some supports need a rebalance doesn't mean supports need to go away entirely in PvP as is suggested. That's throwing out the baby with the bathwater.

KGB

Why can't we have both? PvP with Supports and PvP without Supports? Or at least mix it up throughout the Season event to event. We were promised careful testing and adjustments and we ended up with none of that. So to me the baby never even made it into the bath.

entrailbucket

@KGB said:

@entrailbucket said:

@KGB said:
I love supports in PvP and they've been great at level I play. Lots of others on here feel the same way at the level they are playing.

The problem as always is there are vastly different experiences depending on where one is. It's great at some levels of play and awful at others. Not sure what the solution to that is.

KGB

This isn't a mystery -- if you mostly have optimized supports and your opponents mostly don't, you've got a pretty massive advantage. You're basically playing PvE.

In fact, imagine the devs sticking Leapfrog/Eros Arrow/Copter/Car etc on every single fight in PvE, and you'll get a sense of what the rest of us are dealing with.

I see those same supports, especially Leapfrog.

It's clear some supports need rebalance in the same way some OP characters do too. But just because some supports need a rebalance doesn't mean supports need to go away entirely in PvP as is suggested. That's throwing out the baby with the bathwater.

KGB

Oh no, I don't want them removed only from PvP. I'd much, much prefer them rebalancing supports overall.

Removing them from PvP just allows them to go on existing in PvE, enabling turn0 wins, and making most of them pretty useless (nobody even cared about Leapfrog until it showed up in PvP!).

I think supports can be an extra tweak or enabler for certain teams and strategies that otherwise wouldn't work. They can add depth to the game and give us more choices in the teams we run. I think they were a cool idea that just never got properly implemented.

KGB

@DAZ0273 said:

@KGB said:

@entrailbucket said:

@KGB said:
I love supports in PvP and they've been great at level I play. Lots of others on here feel the same way at the level they are playing.

The problem as always is there are vastly different experiences depending on where one is. It's great at some levels of play and awful at others. Not sure what the solution to that is.

KGB

This isn't a mystery -- if you mostly have optimized supports and your opponents mostly don't, you've got a pretty massive advantage. You're basically playing PvE.

In fact, imagine the devs sticking Leapfrog/Eros Arrow/Copter/Car etc on every single fight in PvE, and you'll get a sense of what the rest of us are dealing with.

I see those same supports, especially Leapfrog.

It's clear some supports need rebalance in the same way some OP characters do too. But just because some supports need a rebalance doesn't mean supports need to go away entirely in PvP as is suggested. That's throwing out the baby with the bathwater.

KGB

Why can't we have both? PvP with Supports and PvP without Supports?

Why not both simultaneously and let players pick on a per battle basis?

You equip supports to your team as normal. Then on the pre-battle screen where you see your opponents team add a button/checkbox that says 'support enabled'. If you leave it enabled then supports are in the battle for both sides. If you uncheck, supports are disabled for both sides. Note on retal, the player gets to also pick supports enabled or not so you'll need to always have supports on your characters for retals (unless you don't care or maybe makes baking easier...).

Voila, you can used them as desired. Enemy team has leapfrog and you don't have an AOE, you can uncheck supports.

KGB

entrailbucket

@KGB said:

@DAZ0273 said:

@KGB said:

@entrailbucket said:

@KGB said:
I love supports in PvP and they've been great at level I play. Lots of others on here feel the same way at the level they are playing.

The problem as always is there are vastly different experiences depending on where one is. It's great at some levels of play and awful at others. Not sure what the solution to that is.

KGB

This isn't a mystery -- if you mostly have optimized supports and your opponents mostly don't, you've got a pretty massive advantage. You're basically playing PvE.

In fact, imagine the devs sticking Leapfrog/Eros Arrow/Copter/Car etc on every single fight in PvE, and you'll get a sense of what the rest of us are dealing with.

I see those same supports, especially Leapfrog.

It's clear some supports need rebalance in the same way some OP characters do too. But just because some supports need a rebalance doesn't mean supports need to go away entirely in PvP as is suggested. That's throwing out the baby with the bathwater.

KGB

Why can't we have both? PvP with Supports and PvP without Supports?

Why not both simultaneously and let players pick on a per battle basis?

You equip supports to your team as normal. Then on the pre-battle screen where you see your opponents team add a button/checkbox that says 'support enabled'. If you leave it enabled then supports are in the battle for both sides. If you uncheck, supports are disabled for both sides. Note on retal, the player gets to also pick supports enabled or not so you'll need to always have supports on your characters for retals (unless you don't care or maybe makes baking easier...).

Voila, you can used them as desired. Enemy team has leapfrog and you don't have an AOE, you can uncheck supports.

KGB

They probably don't offer that option because they want to sell us all supports, and supports are a big part of defensive teams -- far more important than they are on offense.

"Supports in PvP" isn't a problem at all, though. The actual problem is that the supports are either far too powerful and game-warping, or incredibly weak and never worth using. If we had more options, better counterplay, and (much) better balance between them, then there'd be no need for a setting to turn them on or off.

(BTW, if they're going to give us a setting for PvP, can I have a setting where I turn off supports in PvE? Nobody else can use them unless I'm using them! How would that work out?)