Where Have All the Mathboys Gone

Problem:

Steve has 1 max champ Namor3 and 1 Namor3 with 10 champion levels. If Steve ascends Namor now:

  • How many resources does Steve miss out on by not max champing the 2nd 3star?
  • How many less covers does Steve need to get Namor3 to 4star max champion?

Apologies for continuing to beat this horse with questions, but I could not find the math everyone did back when this was most relevant, and mostly it was for 4stars.

I am trying to determine if I ascend early during the 3star phase as I want him pushed to 5 ASAP, but I am not sure of the math for what is missed, or how many covers I actually skip by avoiding the 3star max max. I will for sure be ascending the 4-5 variants early.

Thanks for your help!

Comments

  • KGB
    KGB Posts: 3,361 Chairperson of the Boards
    edited 4 February 2025, 20:58

    Easiest part to calculate is how many fewer covers you need if you go max/min route. The answer surprisingly is none :)

    1) max/max on your pair of 3s takes you 113+113=226 covers and you get an ascended 4 at 303 1/3. You then need 67*3-1=200 more covers to get to 370 for a total of 426 covers.
    2) max/min on your pair of 3s takes you 113+13=126 covers and you get an ascended 4 at 270. You then need 300 more covers to get to 370 for a total of 426 covers.

    For the 2nd ascended 4 (the one you plan to use to ascend the 370 you made above) to 3->5 ASAP takes 113+13=126 covers.

    So there is no difference in number of covers needed.

    The difference in rewards is simply the champ rewards on a 4 from 270->303 vs champ rewards on a 3 from 166-266. I believe the 166-266 rewards are slightly better (someone will post this soon or you can look it up from the champ tables) but nothing earth shaking.

    KGB

  • WhiteBomber
    WhiteBomber Posts: 462 Mover and Shaker
    edited 4 February 2025, 22:15

    Aaaah, OK, so the ascend early or not only actually matters for 4stars (assuming I'm reading the math right)! If so, there is no reason not to max max the first 3 star so you get the extra rewards.

    Thank you so much the for the hasty response KGB! I will run him max max for 3star progression (at least for the first 4star).

  • stef_focus
    stef_focus Posts: 121 Tile Toppler

    @KGB said:

    So there is no difference in number of covers needed.

    The difference in rewards is simply the champ rewards on a 4 from 270->303 vs champ rewards on a 3 from 166-266. I believe the 166-266 rewards are slightly better (someone will post this soon or you can look it up from the champ tables) but nothing earth shaking.

    KGB

    As I understood and experienced, when you max/max a 3* and get a 303 ascended 4*, you get the champ rewards for the 270-303 4* levels during the ascension, so going the max/min route you use the same amount of covers, but get less rewards overall (you will miss out on the 166-266 3* rewards). You do get the 3a4 (3* ascended to 4*) earlier, so for some that is a consideration.

    The math changes when you start ascending to 5*, as the 4* levels cost 3 covers, but only count as 1 "cover" after ascending to 5*. So if you put 12 covers on a 3a4, it will gain 4 levels (3 covers per level), but after ascension those 4 levels of the 3a4 will amount to 1 extra level on the resulting 3a5. If instead you ascend without using those 12 covers, they will net you 3 extra levels on the 3a5 (4 covers per level), so for ascending 2 3a4's to a 3a5, it makes sense to go the max/min route.

  • WhiteBomber
    WhiteBomber Posts: 462 Mover and Shaker

    Thank you for the extra clarification @stef_focus, you just explained the part I will be avoiding; I will max max the first 3stars since there is no drop in rewards, them max min the 2nd so I don't waste the levels and can get him to 5 star sooner.

    I never put much thought in to the math of the 2nd ascension of the lower star levels, but it definitely makes sense. Thank you both! Hopefully you'll get to play my Namor3-5 sooner!

  • Waddles_Pines
    Waddles_Pines Posts: 1,244 Chairperson of the Boards

    @stef_focus
    Do you know the best way to go about 4a5?
    Max/max
    Max/min
    Other...

    Thanks.

  • BriMan2222
    BriMan2222 Posts: 1,396 Chairperson of the Boards

    @Waddles_Pines said:
    @stef_focus
    Do you know the best way to go about 4a5?
    Max/max
    Max/min
    Other...

    Thanks.

    Depends on what you want out of them. If you want to maximize rewards then Max/max. If you want to get them to 5 star to use them then max/min.

    Personally, I like to get them to 5 star asap and not worry about the missed rewards.

  • Waddles_Pines
    Waddles_Pines Posts: 1,244 Chairperson of the Boards

    Isn't there an edge case that you want to have the 2nd 4star at a certain level to get max retro rewards from new 5stars?

  • Scofie
    Scofie GLOBAL_MODERATORS Posts: 1,444 Chairperson of the Boards

    The second 4* should be 300 really as this also deals with the secondary feeder rewards. 292 is fine for the primary feeder, I think.

  • Timemachinego
    Timemachinego Posts: 526 Critical Contributor
    edited 5 February 2025, 21:34

    Additional math question: Assuming you have a 3 star at 266, how many additional covers would it take to ascend it to 5* and how much would that cost in swaps? Yes, I'm asking you to do my homework for me :p

  • WhiteBomber
    WhiteBomber Posts: 462 Mover and Shaker
    edited 5 February 2025, 21:49

    Minimum Route
    4star 1
    1. 1 additional level 266 3star to make your first 4 star = 113 covers and 120k iso
    2. Max max 3stars ascended to 4star at level 303 to 4star max champion (67 x 3) = 201 covers

    4star 2
    4. 1 additional max champ 3star = 113 covers and 120k iso
    5. 1 final champion 3star (not maxed) = 13 covers and 120k iso (do 14 covers minimum for the LL)

    Total = 440 additional covers and 360k iso

    I think this is right?

  • stef_focus
    stef_focus Posts: 121 Tile Toppler

    @WhiteBomber said:
    Minimum Route
    4star 1
    1. 1 additional level 266 3star to make your first 4 star = 113 covers and 120k iso
    2. Max max 3stars ascended to 4star at level 303 to 4star max champion (67 x 3) = 201 covers

    4star 2
    4. 1 additional max champ 3star = 113 covers and 120k iso
    5. 1 final champion 3star (not maxed) = 13 covers and 120k iso (do 14 covers minimum for the LL)

    Total = 440 additional covers and 360k iso

    I think this is right?

    Yup, that's my math as well (and yes 441 for the additional LL token is indeed smarter)

  • trenchdigger
    trenchdigger Posts: 169 Tile Toppler

    And take the second 4 up one level for 3 covers for another extra LT. You get one back on the 5*, so a net cost of 2 covers and 300 ISO.
    Also (and apologies if this sounds picky), but I think your step 2. should be 200 not 201 covers as you get credit for the full 100 covers when you max max, so goes to 303 and 1 cover. Therefore only need 66*3 + 2 more covers = 200 covers.