Soo... No more rebalances?

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Comments

  • Vhailorx
    Vhailorx Posts: 6,085 Chairperson of the Boards
    edited June 2022
    HoundofShadow said:
    I think that would be largely subjective and depends on your goals. Okoye, Thor, Polaris and the likes have spoilt the game. We can't turn back the clock to remove all the damage they have done to this game.  As long as players use them as a reference to judge characters, they will be disappointed with releases most of the time. I think some players are already giving up on waiting for the "best" characters and are opening up to "fun" characters. 
    This is a perfectly fine opinion to have, but I doubt it is the consensus opinion. I suspect many fewer people would play this game if the characters you name were removed.

  • Vhailorx
    Vhailorx Posts: 6,085 Chairperson of the Boards
    edited June 2022
    KGB said:
    HoundofShadow said:
    I think that would be largely subjective and depends on your goals. Okoye, Thor, Polaris and the likes have spoilt the game. We can't turn back the clock to remove all the damage they have done to this game.  As long as players use them as a reference to judge characters, they will be disappointed with releases most of the time. I think some players are already giving up on waiting for the "best" characters and are opening up to "fun" characters. 
    I can't comment for everyone, but for me those characters (along with Grocket/Juggs) have SAVED the game for me rather than spoiled it. That's because I have a finite amount of time to play (family/job/real life commitments) and the game asks a lot of time for end game play (ie fully covering latest 4/5* releases). Without those characters I'd have to give up either PvP or PvE because time needed would explode quickly so as far as I am concerned they have not damaged the game in the least.

    KGB

    It's certainly true that the time commitment necessary to be competitive in this game, or even to keep pace with the 5* release schedule) would go way WAY up if these characters were nerfed/removed and the game's current scoring systems were left unchanged.

    And that is a major consideration for a game that asks players to complete 50-70 matches a day to get full progression rewards (let alone the play scheduling necessary to get good placement).
  • HoundofShadow
    HoundofShadow Posts: 8,004 Chairperson of the Boards
    I should be more clear about what I meant by "damage done to the game."

    While R4G, Thor, Okoye, and other typical teams have made pves a faster clear; however, they caused players who are used to playing such meta teams to constantly use them as the measuring yardstick for judging the worthiness of abilities.

    Standards based on meta characters' abilities such as the number of turns and aps/damage etc are being used to judge all other releases to beat the record. It's like your potential partner constantly using Elon Musk's, Mark Zuckerberg's or Bill Gates' wealth as a standard to judge whether you are considered bottom-tier earners or top tier earners. Considering that majority of people in this world won't reach such level of wealth, your potential partners' choices would be very very limited. Likewise, expecting majority of characters to beat or match the standard set by meta will limit your choices in the game. This side effect is very obvious because the common question being asked is, "Why should I use this character's ability when the current meta can do a better job?"  

    In Line (I guess) or in Reddit, the typical advices dished out to newbies are characters worth using are Polaris, R4G, Okoye, apocalypse etc. New players (in reddit) who think otherwise and doesn't want to get on the meta train get pounded on by "expert players" in reddit. Such advices, while "saving players' time", stifle their abilities to solve problems like beating difficult or puzzle nodes. It also brings us another problem where players complain about how 90% of characters are sitting untouched on their roster and how they want the dev to force them to use these untouched characters.

    And this brings us to pvps. It is said you reap what you sow and pvps are one good proof. Because players recommend chasing only meta characters, who do players see at the top? Meta characters. And then they complain about seeing the same team over and over again, and blame the dev for not solving these problems. Who was the one who keep asking players to chase only meta teams? The dev or fellow players?

    And lastly, it brings us to this thread. Why waste the dev time by asking them to buff or rebalance characters when the typical standard used are whether they pair well with meta or worth using over meta? I would rather they focus on implementing Support in pvps or community pves because it has more impact.
  • Timemachinego
    Timemachinego Posts: 492 Mover and Shaker
    HoundofShadow said:
     ...

    And lastly, it brings us to this thread. Why waste the dev time by asking them to buff or rebalance characters when the typical standard used are whether they pair well with meta or worth using over meta? I would rather they focus on implementing Support in pvps or community pves because it has more impact.

    I was mostly with your point until you swing around to this, no one in their right mind wants supports in PVP. They're already a deeply broken system and would just push the meta-bias even higher. Do you honestly want to deal with immortal polaris/brb teams or an Apocalypse that can put out his buff on turn one?
  • Bzhai
    Bzhai Posts: 506 Critical Contributor
    Timemachinego said:
    HoundofShadow said:
     ...

    And lastly, it brings us to this thread. Why waste the dev time by asking them to buff or rebalance characters when the typical standard used are whether they pair well with meta or worth using over meta? I would rather they focus on implementing Support in pvps or community pves because it has more impact.

    I was mostly with your point until you swing around to this, no one in their right mind wants supports in PVP. They're already a deeply broken system and would just push the meta-bias even higher. Do you honestly want to deal with immortal polaris/brb teams or an Apocalypse that can put out his buff on turn one?
    Not to mention top pvp players will have 5* infinity stones and create a wider divide. If the devs wanted to allow supports in pvp it should be in a separate event with its own special rules and handicaps. And it should not count towards season scores and participation should be optional.
  • JimboJambo
    JimboJambo Posts: 132 Tile Toppler
    It's not reasonable to criticise the players for advising newbies to chase the best characters. Of course there are lots of interesting niche characters in the game but if someone asks me who is the best 4*,  I'm not going to tell them to focus their efforts on Dazzler or Jubilee, just because they happen to have a unique set of powers. 

    That said, I welcome rebalances for any 5*s even if it doesn't make them meta. I use them all in PVE and I had to resort to whales in the recent Thor, Valkyrie, Hulk 5* node, because Kingpin did nothing of any use. Not sure that there is much point in rebalancing 4*s at this stage, that does seem like a waste of devs time and effort.
  • KGB
    KGB Posts: 3,236 Chairperson of the Boards
    Timemachinego said:
    HoundofShadow said:
     ...

    And lastly, it brings us to this thread. Why waste the dev time by asking them to buff or rebalance characters when the typical standard used are whether they pair well with meta or worth using over meta? I would rather they focus on implementing Support in pvps or community pves because it has more impact.

    I was mostly with your point until you swing around to this, no one in their right mind wants supports in PVP. They're already a deeply broken system and would just push the meta-bias even higher. Do you honestly want to deal with immortal polaris/brb teams or an Apocalypse that can put out his buff on turn one?
    It doesn't have to be the currently existing supports that get used in PvPs.

    I've proposed the idea before that a new set of supports gets created for PvP. These supports would have only 2 powers, 1 on offense and 1 on defense.

    KGB
  • HoundofShadow
    HoundofShadow Posts: 8,004 Chairperson of the Boards
    We got a new dev team and they are going to fulfill your wish of rebalancing. My thought process has to be reset to a new state now.  :D
  • Domitronas
    Domitronas Posts: 179 Tile Toppler
    Praise the RNGesus my prayers have been heard! 
  • Jacklag
    Jacklag Posts: 316 Mover and Shaker
    MoosePrime said:
    People didn't like the Starlord rebalance?  It was only a numbers adjustment, increasing damage and reducing costs.
    I thought it was underwhelming. Starlord was supposed to be more of a support character and his rework made his match damage too high (maybe his health as well), while the active powers are still meh. The purple power should probably have been tampered too so at least it wasn't exactly the same as the 3* version. It could steal more tiles, or cost less to be more spammable, or better yet improve the tiles after stealing them.

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