An idea

Talovar

I would like to know if we could a band list for trials of planes. Not every card should be band, however it would be a better event in my mind if there where cards that could not be used.

bk1234

I don’t think cards should be banned. Many players have put almost 6 years into building their collections and they should be able to use them in open legacy events — especially ones they pay to enter. 

We have standard events and block restricted events to limit collection use. 

If you are unable to compete in TotP, it’s probably a good idea not to invest your currency in this event until you build a better collection. 

Talovar

I very much disagree with your response, and insulting to me. 

ambrosio191

TotP was never intended to be accessible to the entire game population.  It's supposed to be for people who need/want mana jewels more than crystals. It's intended to be difficult, because mana jewels are more valuable than crystals.  It's the closest thing we have to end game content.  Banning cards to make it easier goes against the whole point of the event. 

You should not be playing TotP if you do not have a collection that can support it.  You should not invest your crystals into an end game event if you are not at the end game.

Talovar

I disagree is you ambrosio. Not do you under my argument. Thank you go away now! 

BongoTheGrey

I disagree with this idea.

Tezzeret

Nahhh  

ambrosio191

critman said:

bk1234 said:

I don’t think cards should be banned. Many players have put almost 6 years into building their collections and they should be able to use them in open legacy events — especially ones they pay to enter. 

We have standard events and block restricted events to limit collection use. 

If you are unable to compete in TotP, it’s probably a good idea not to invest your currency in this event until you build a better collection. 

Personally I'd agree that there should be some events with no banned list.

But is it right that the most common event in the game is an unrestricted Legacy event?

Wouldnt the most common event in the game be legacy training grounds, followed by standard training grounds?  Legacy only because it's been around longer.

Tremayne

@critman - I think the balance is much more in favour of standard than what you argue. My perception is that a lot of the coalition events are standard, sprinkled with a few (boringly long) legacy events.

Plus there are is very little material on the puzzle side of MTGPQ, which is where the devs could mix it up a lot more in regards to specific sets. Yes, I’m looking at the long abandoned story mode.

BTW @Talovar I do not agree with banning cards in TOTP.

BongoTheGrey

The thing is that TotP is not an event for new players. It was designed like that. New players (Bronze, Silver and Gold rank) have to invest 60 mana crystals and don't recover a single one. They can do it to gain 6 mana jewels in Bronze, 10 in Silver and 15 in Gold (plus the newest set pack) but that's not that good of a deal. However, if they do, I'm pretty sure that they won't be facing any "ban worthy" card and if they do it would probably be an extremely rare thing.

The problem is for players in Platinum rank that will face Omniscience and HUF/Deploy all day. But I don't think that a Platinum level player qualifies as a "new player". They can chose to convert 60 crystals into 20 jewels and recover 30 of those 60 crystals knowing that there would be a lot of crazy combo decks. It is random because even if you have an Omni loop deck you can lose against another Omni loop deck that was faster for whatever reason.

But I think that since that is the only way to convert crystals into jewels on this game, it is a risk that you have to be willing to take. It shouldn't be an easy thing to do.

bk1234

ToTP is not the most common event in the game. It’s a currency exchange event meant to be for top tier players. It’s not a good use of time or currency for other players. The fact that it isn’t a good value for anyone other than those with a huge collection of both cards and PW, should be common sense by looking at the cost vs rewards. Crystals are the main currency for cards in this game. They are necessary for building both your card and PW collections. 

I am not sorry that you are offended at my comment. Saying cards should be banned from a digital game is frankly, obtuse. If a card is overpowered, it should be rebalanced. That’s the wonderful thing about digital versus paper. They can change some lines of programming and do that. If an event is overpowered, we can look at things like block restrictions or using Standard format to balance it out. This is why, in coalition events, PvE is legacy and and PvP is standard and block restricted — balance. There was a time when we had legacy coalition  PvP and that was very hard on players like you. However there will always be legacy individual events. This is because as much as they do to balance the game for newer and mid level players, they also need to offer something to say thank you for loyal veterans — many of which have been here since the first month of the game, almost 6 years ago, building their collections. These players also deserve a place to use all of their cards and enjoy the investment they have put in the game. What they get is an event they have to pay for. 

I am a week 1 player and have a top tier collection and I don’t choose to play this event because I make enough jewels on other events to get a few vanguards each set and I make a ton of crystals which gives me a good bank of crafting orbs and keeps me in a decent standard collection. Remember, games like this are as much about resource management as they are about building decks and matching gems — unless you have a lot of money to spend. I am a social worker in the US; I do not. 

I decided this week, based on your post to play ToTP. I chose my weakest color, blue. I played it with a standard S3 deck. I was able to win all 8 of my matches, 2 on each node with only having to refresh my health once. Perhaps the problem isn’t your opponent’s cards. If I can win these matches all the way through with a well balanced standard deck, perhaps it’s the decks you’re using. There’s a good recent thread about building a top tier deck. That might be of help. 

https://forums.d3go.com/discussion/85514/persils-checklist-for-building-rank-1-decks

[MOD MIC ON]Also as the mod, I’m going to respectfully ask OP not to reply to every comment he disagrees with telling users things such as “thank you go away now”. This is trolling. You opened a conversation. Please be open to people not feeling the way you do. If you can’t disagree with them respectfully, do not respond. We frequently have different opinions here, but we do not dismiss each other. Future violations will result in warnings. The link to the forum rules is at the top of the forum if you need to review them. [BK]

Stormcrow

bk1234 said:

I chose my weakest color, blue.

Now THERE'S a sentence you don't see every day.

More on topic, yeah, Trial of the Planes definitely has always been a cesspit of the most broken degenerate OP Legacy nonsense and if you're unfamiliar with it and don't realize that's what you're walking into, I'm sure it's an unpleasant surprise. Not sure what they can do about that though, without fundamentally changing the nature of the event - maybe just a disclaimer that pops up when you're about to spend the crystals to join it that says "Unless you are absolutely, 110% certain that you definitely know what to expect and definitely want to do this, do not do this."

I do agree that it's fine as is and that actually, it's good to have a really competitive place for those kind of high-powered late-game shenanigans. Legacy Training Grounds doesn't count because it's so wide-open and low-stakes that matchmaking could put you up against anything from an expert Omniloop to somebody using default Nissa with the default Nissa deck or anything in between.

madwren

bk1234 said:

Saying cards should be banned from a digital game is frankly, obtuse. 

Please be open to people not feeling the way you do. If you can’t disagree with them respectfully, do not respond. 

It's reasonable to expect you set a good example. Please don't exacerbate the issue by using inflammatory language like "obtuse" in response to his opinion.  

Something more constructive might have been, "Banning cards may make sense in a paper format, but I feel in a digital game it isn't necessary.  Instead, they could simply rebalance cards as they have in the past in order to adjust their power level." 

Thank you.

madwren

As stated above, Trial of the Planes was created as a currency conversion mechanic, and it's been very effective.  

That being said, even as a player who has every card in the game, it's easy to understand why newer players are frustrated by the prevalence of certain cards in Legacy.  It's similar to how paper Magic eventually realized they should create Type 1.5/Type 1.X formats. At some point, I feel it's in the game's benefit to freshen up old events, just as it's beneficial to develop new ones. 

Some of the more interesting events are those with limited cardsets; having a new event (or modified existing event) with, say, everything from Amonkhet onwards would be intriguing and potentially lower the entry point/player frustration level. If nothing else, it would present a different set of challenges for both new and old players. 

bk1234

madwren said:

bk1234 said:

Saying cards should be banned from a digital game is frankly, obtuse. 

Please be open to people not feeling the way you do. If you can’t disagree with them respectfully, do not respond. 

It's reasonable to expect you set a good example. Please don't exacerbate the issue by using inflammatory language like "obtuse" in response to his opinion.  

Something more constructive might have been, "Banning cards may make sense in a paper format, but I feel in a digital game it isn't necessary.  Instead, they could simply rebalance cards as they have in the past in order to adjust their power level." 

Thank you.

I am entitled to my opinion and was done being patented more than 25 years ago. If you read my signature, I have the right to express it in whatever manner I wish when I am posting normally.  

Thank you. 

DragonSorcerer

Talovar said:

I would like to know if we could a band list for trials of planes. Not every card should be band, however it would be a better event in my mind if there where cards that could not be used.

@Talovar, an idea, aspire to reach the level of your competitors rather than having the rules changed to bring them down to yours.

TomB

madwren said:
Some of the more interesting events are those with limited cardsets; having a new event (or modified existing event) with, say, everything from Amonkhet onwards would be intriguing and potentially lower the entry point/player frustration level. If nothing else, it would present a different set of challenges for both new and old players. 

I really like this sort of idea, though I probably still wouldn't pay to play it if they priced it like TotP...

Mainloop25

The whole point of Totp when it was created was for it to be extremely difficult for players that didn't have really strong decks yet. 

Mainloop25

critman said:

Perhaps TOTP should come with a label in game which states 'This event is for experienced players'?

Totally agree

andrewvanmarle

I disagree with talovar's idea of a ban list, that would be horribly bad. 

I agree with Sht...eh.....Critman'sidea of a label to show that an event is extra dangerous. 

It's like expecting to beat the dragon nest with a starter deck 

Julie71

I do not think totp should have banned cards.   jmo I play all nodes to test decks, master cards. I know if I can beat the last set of nodes my decks can beat any greg pvp coalition battle