Event Suggestion: Infinity Wave

AkoniAkoni Posts: 313 Mover and Shaker
Players fight in the ultimate contest of endurance by defeating unrelenting & seemingly unending waves of enemies. All battles will be against waves of enemies. The more enemies the player defeats, the more points they get. The more points, the more rewards. 

Event Type: PVE

Length: 3 days

Event Levels
Like other events, players will be required to select a level (1-10). The level chosen will determine the type of enemies they battle and how powerful those enemies are. Players who select lower levels (i.e. 1-3) will battle against minions and lower rarity characters (i.e. common through rare). In contrast, players who select high levels (i.e. 9-10) will see all rarities (i.e. common through epic) with a greater skew towards the most rare.
The event level also determines how quickly enemies get stronger with no imposed cap on how strong they can get. Players who select level 1 will see the strength of their enemies go up slowly. For example:
  • wave 1 = level 23
  • wave 2 = level 38
  • wave 3 = level 55
  • and so on... 
Players who select level 10 will see the strength of their enemies go up faster. For example:
  • wave 1 = level 23
  • wave 2 = level 60
  • wave 3 = level 100
  • and so on...
As the goal for the player is to defeat as many as possible, the goal for devs is to structure the waves in a manner that the player will inevitably lose at some point.

Bonus Points/Wave Bonuses
It is generally bad practice to design something that players can't win, but if losing is a known reality of the event and the goal is to last as long as possible, the feelings associated with that loss can be mitigated. The addition of bonus points for defeating particular waves can also be included to give players that sense of victory, event though they may be on their last leg. Bonus points have been given in the past in wave battles, but they largely go by unnoticed due to the font size on the screen. 

Event Structure
The event will consist of 3 nodes. Regardless of the chosen level, each node will be structured slightly differently and will provide players with the same general challenge, but with different experiences. Each node may also require players to come up with different strategies and, therefore, different teams. 
                                                                           NODE 1
The first node will have enemies start off at a lower level (i.e. 23) and steadily get stronger wave after wave. Enemies will be comprised of minions (i.e. Maggia, Sentinels, Doombots, etc.) with a few characters sprinkled throughout. The number of enemies will vary from 3 to 6 per wave. For example:
  • wave 1 = 3 minions
  • wave 2 = 6 minions
  • wave 3 = 3 minions, 3*Doctor Doom
  • and so on...
The first node will also provide the fewest points among the 3 available nodes. 
The cool-down timer for node 1 will also be the shortest among the available nodes at about 4 hours (or whatever devs deem appropriate).
                                                                           NODE 2
The second node will have enemies start off at a lower level (i.e. 23) and steadily get stronger wave after wave. Enemies will be comprised of minions (i.e. Maggia, Sentinels, Doombots, etc.) and other characters. The number of enemies will vary from 1 to 6 per wave. For example:
  • wave 1 = 6 minions
  • wave 2 = 4*Professor X, 2*Wolverine, 1*Storm
  • wave 3 = 3 minions, 3*Luke Cage, 3*Iron Fist
  • and so on...
The second node will provide more points than the first node, but less points than the third node.
The cool-down time for node 2 will be longer than node 1's cool-down timer, but shorter than node 3's cool-down timer at about 6 hours (or whatever devs deem appropriate).
                                                                           NODE 3
The third node will have enemies start off at a lower level (i.e. 23) and steadily get stronger wave after wave. Enemies will be comprised of characters with a few minions (i.e. Maggia, Sentinels, Doombots, etc.) sprinkled throughout. The number of enemies will vary from 1 to 4 per wave. For example:
  • wave 1 = 3*Wolverine, 4*Elektra, 3*Scarlet Witch, 3*Daredevil
  • wave 2 = 1 minion, Shuri, 4*Black Panther
  • wave 3 = Prowler, Medusa
  • and so on...
The third node will provide the most points among the 3 available nodes.
The cool-down timer for node 3 will also be the longest among the available nodes at about 8 hours (or whatever devs deem appropriate).

What are the community's thoughts about this one? Obviously, I like it. Does it sound like something you would play or does it sound dreadful?
Click "Like" if you think this would be a good event.
Click "Insightful" if you find it intriguing.


  • KelvinkhrKelvinkhr Posts: 96 Match Maker
    The idea is definitely different from what we usually get in PVE. I can see something like that being done. Very interesting concept
  • AkoniAkoni Posts: 313 Mover and Shaker
    @fight4thedream (or any mod/admin)

    Would it be possible to move this discussion to MPQ Suggestions and Feedback? I intended to post it there as it is the appropriate location. I am only now noticing that I posted it in the wrong place.
  • fight4thedreamfight4thedream GLOBAL_MODERATORS Posts: 1,350 Chairperson of the Boards
    **Mod note: Moved to MPQ Suggestions and Feedback

    On a personal note, interesting idea! The only issue I see with it is that there are already established PvE Wave teams, namely Okoye/Thor/Sabertooth or 4* Human Torch or BRB/Kitty/Polaris, who would make light work of the event. You mentioned that eventually players are supposed to lose so I am curious what kind of counter measures you had in mind when it comes to these sorts of teams? 
  • TheghouseTheghouse Posts: 249 Tile Toppler
    Between every round, the board and all AP for both teams would need to completely reset (like how the AI team resets in Sinister Six) to prevent winfinites or complete board control situations that negate the purpose of the event.

    And since it is designed to eventually lose, either characters would need to auto heal (unlikely) or the event would need to give guaranteed health packs to make it viable.
  • AkoniAkoni Posts: 313 Mover and Shaker

    Valid points. What I was thinking was that each wave would get stronger and stronger. These wouldn't be your typical wave nodes. Most nodes have between 2 and 5 waves of enemies. Imagine going up against 10 waves of enemies with each wave becoming more powerful than the last. The first wave might be laughable to a player in 5* land, but by the 4th wave, they are facing off against formidable foes with maybe half of their team's health left. Yes, some characters heal, but how well does healing work when your opponent in knocking out a quarter or more of your health off of match damage alone.

    I believe MPQ has a soft cap on enemies in SCL 10, but that cap could easily be raised. More calculations would be needed, but there is no reason why a digital enemy can't reach higher levels such as 900, 2000, 5000 etc. I know it sounds ridiculous, but was there a plan to have lv550 5* characters during the game's birth? I posted a suggestion for the inclusion of 6* characters here and that was met with some push back, but if the game continues to grow, we might see many changes, including 6* characters and higher level enemies. 

    I would argue that an event like this has some benefits:
    1. Devs could test the waters with greater, more powerful characters. What are the intricacies of going up against a lv 1000 character? If there are plans to tinker with rarities/levels, this is the perfect way to test it out. 
    2. Speaking of levels, there are some players at the top who have complained of 'boredom'. I am not one of those players as I am in that transition phase between 4* and 5*. There is still plenty of excitement for me, however, I can see how someone at the top might want more of a challenge. The bragging rights associated with making it further than any other player is rather nice.
    3. They could potentially find an event that players love. If players don't like the event, they can ditch it or take it out of the rotation for a bit, but at least they will have data to mull over.

    The reason enemy AP resets on waves is to prevent just that, but player AP does not reset. The reason for doing that is to create a winnable situation for the player. Due to the randomness of tile drops, the AI can rack up an insane amount of AP through cascades. Although players can benefit from this as well, it feels unfair when it happens to the AI's benefit. To neutralize those negative feelings, enemy AP resets between rounds.

    For this type of event there is an argument for and against reseting AP.
    1. FOR- Some really interesting set-ups can occur between waves. For example, 3* Captain Marvel can be used to rack up Red AP in one wave, then the next wave featuring 4* Cyclops hits the field to use that Red AP. AP equals speed, and speed increases the chance of victory. Allowing the enemy AI to retain its AP would make the event more challenging and less boring.
    2. AGAINST- Each wave feels like a new team of enemies. Having that new team of enemies start their battle with AP feels unfair. Yes, you have amassed considerable AP, and you might have started with boosts, but allowing the enemy to jump in with AP just doesn't feel right. Also, AP equals speed, and speed increases the chance of victory. Resetting enemy AP each round means the player will be able to get through more waves of enemies.
    Since the goal of the player in this event would be to get through as many waves as possible, and the enemies get stronger after each wave, I would side with you. In this type of event, enemy AP would have to reset to give players an edge. This means that at the start, enemies would be easily dealt with, but the difficulty should ramp up fairly quickly to create challenges for the player.

    About your last point, no healing would be necessary for enemies since the focus is on waves. These waves would likely involve different enemies. In addition, we have seen waves in the Deadpool Daily with characters that are defeated and pop up later with full health.

  • TheghouseTheghouse Posts: 249 Tile Toppler
    Sorry to jump back in after quite so long, but looking at your response maybe my points were not quite clear enough.

    The board and all AP would need to reset for BOTH teams, player and AI, after every wave in order for the wave mission to have any fairness at all.  At SCL 10 levels (or higher, as this type of mode would likely be able to achieve), if the AI team starts with enough AP to fire a power, they can steam roll you before you even get to make a match.  This eliminates the fun and fairness of the game to insta-lose without any chance at all.

    If the player starts with any AP or tiles or the board, it lessens or completely removes the challenge.  If you are able to gain 30 TU AP again level 40 opponents, you can ride the Hulkoye train through tons of waves with absolutely no effort before the difficulty reaches a point where you are challenged. Similarly, if you are able to fill the board with protect tiles using BRB, Polaris, and Thanos, and you get to carry your green AP over after defeating a wave, the winfinite combo assures your turn literally never ends and you never lose.  Even with the player's AP reset, starting with a board full of protect tiles can sometimes only need 1 turn with BRBs extra AP before the winfinite combo can start up again.  There are a number of other possibilities where starting with a non-neutral board is a huge advantage.  So the board and all AP for both teams would need to be fully reset after every wave, otherwise the challenge of the event is trivialized.

    As for healing, it was not the enemy I was thinking about, it was the players team.  I never start a node expecting all my characters will get KO'd, but this type of event would guarantee I end up with 3 KO'd characters.  If I understand correctly the design is the event is to literally play until it gets so difficult you lose.  SCL 10 PVE and competitive PVP use enough health packs as it is.  I would not spend much time playing this event knowing my characters were going to end up KO'd unless they automatically healed when I finished or the event gave guaranteed health packs rewards when I finished.

    Hope that paints a better picture of what I was thinking.
  • AkoniAkoni Posts: 313 Mover and Shaker
    @Theghouse That makes much more sense. Thank you for clearing it up. I have to agree with you on this one. To be fair, I came up with this idea before Hulkoye was a thing. At this point, I have no idea if an event like this would be possible with the current game state. As I watch each release, it looks like the game is going in a specific direction, but I'm not quite sure yet. I'll have to see several more releases. Nonetheless, this concept would need some overhauling to even be possible. I'll let the wheels on this one turn in the back of my head, but I won't use up too much brain space on it for now.
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