What do I do?!?

RTA3000

I’m a currently 4* player with one 5* champed, Okye. I’ve got favourites waiting on ghost rider to get him up to champ but slugging through The Hood and 4* ghost is getting me knowhere.ive got kitty at 3 5 4 and enough saved covers to bring it to the holy 13. My usual combo is Okeye, Medusa and whoever I think depending on the rotation of MPQ. Do  I sacrifice the covers to champion her?

tiomono

Kitty definitely speeds up the game. Okoye is an outstanding single 5* though with the heal and ramping up her teams damage. Hard call. 2 5* champs will make your versus s bit tougher. And kitty okoye is not a super gelling combo.

ThaRoadWarrior

I can assure you that Gho5t Rider is upper middle tier, and he doesn't really play that well with Okoye (I'm in the reverse scenario with GRRR champed and Okoye at 6/4/1). I've been chasing Jessica Jones via Chavez since January (started at 285, currently at 321 after 4 months of BHs. I had my 5* bh set to Okoye and got 2 yellows in that time). 

I don't know in your situation if I'd trade the covers or keep them on Kitty - but she will benefit exactly 0 from being paired with Okoye. Putting Medusa between them could be interesting though - match Entanglement a few times and then let it ride.

Do you have any other 5*s waiting with a reasonable amount of covers?

Straycat

Having Gritty as another option should make things a little more fun. They don't work together that well, but they both do great as the main part of a team.  I would say swap the covers, but I think a good compromise would be to just max level Kitty and see how she plays. She'd probably still be strong enough to get by if you're really opposed to trading in 3 covers.

DAZ0273

Gritty is clearly on the Devs radar with all the anti-Grocket measures being released so who knows what PvP will look like once people have champed Sabretooth - he will play nicely with your Okoye though! If PvE is your thing then obviously a functioning Gritty will help a lot there.

Phumade

DAZ0273 said:

Gritty is clearly on the Devs radar with all the anti-Grocket measures being released so who knows what PvP will look like once people have champed Sabretooth - he will play nicely with your Okoye though! If PvE is your thing then obviously a functioning Gritty will help a lot there.

I've seen a few champed SAbreOkoye combos out in the wild.  Its a good combo for those High Health 5e / Hard 3 nodes as well.  In fact I would say SabreOkoye is a slightly more reliable partnership than Gritty.  If the strikes get dropped to fast, Its hard to recover from or you've stalled and basically ruined your finishing times.  Whereas SabreOkoye might be a turn or two slower,  but just as good at dealing multiple 20k nukes.

SabreOkoye is solid favorite against an equal sized Gritty in pvp, but it all boils down to where the strikes setup.  Sabre's 3x3 explosion is just as likely to destroy potential matches (including cascading match 3s.)  for you as destroy enemy strikes.  and if those 3x3 drop the strikes to the bottom row, you just have a devil of a time to matching them away.  So its not an autopilot response, but it can definitely stop Gritty dead in her tracks.

Without premade strikes, Kitty is pretty much useless.  Overall it just boils down to how reachable the strike tiles are.

sinnerjfl

ThaRoadWarrior said:

I can assure you that Gho5t Rider is upper middle tier, and he doesn't really play that well with Okoye (I'm in the reverse scenario with GRRR champed and Okoye at 6/4/1). I've been chasing Jessica Jones via Chavez since January (started at 285, currently at 321 after 4 months of BHs. I had my 5* bh set to Okoye and got 2 yellows in that time). 

I don't know in your situation if I'd trade the covers or keep them on Kitty - but she will benefit exactly 0 from being paired with Okoye. Putting Medusa between them could be interesting though - match Entanglement a few times and then let it ride.

Do you have any other 5*s waiting with a reasonable amount of covers?

GRRR actually does play well with Okoye, what are you on about? His red with TU in the bank will murder about anyone who makes a few matches. Black also works with Okoye. His only power not being affected by her passive is green.

Vhailorx

Phumade said:

DAZ0273 said:

Gritty is clearly on the Devs radar with all the anti-Grocket measures being released so who knows what PvP will look like once people have champed Sabretooth - he will play nicely with your Okoye though! If PvE is your thing then obviously a functioning Gritty will help a lot there.

I've seen a few champed SAbreOkoye combos out in the wild.  Its a good combo for those High Health 5e / Hard 3 nodes as well.  In fact I would say SabreOkoye is a slightly more reliable partnership than Gritty.  If the strikes get dropped to fast, Its hard to recover from or you've stalled and basically ruined your finishing times.  Whereas SabreOkoye might be a turn or two slower,  but just as good at dealing multiple 20k nukes.

SabreOkoye is solid favorite against an equal sized Gritty in pvp, but it all boils down to where the strikes setup.  Sabre's 3x3 explosion is just as likely to destroy potential matches (including cascading match 3s.)  for you as destroy enemy strikes.  and if those 3x3 drop the strikes to the bottom row, you just have a devil of a time to matching them away.  So its not an autopilot response, but it can definitely stop Gritty dead in her tracks.

Without premade strikes, Kitty is pretty much useless.  Overall it just boils down to how reachable the strike tiles are.

No, without fast strikes, kitty is what the devs designed her to be: a solid support character who turns enemy specials into some decent damage, can indirectly punish enemy powers with her red, and generally just makes life worse for the opposition. 

With fast strikes out on the board, she is meta. 

Saberkoye is a potentially great counter because it's a 4*/5* combo, making it a bit more accessible (to those who have access to classic 5*s), and functions passively that can start to work on turn 1 (unlike any active counter).

What still feels frustrating about gritty in PvP is that most match outcomes are largely determined by the initial board state (if the strikes are matchable, the player will win, if not, the player will at best get hurt very badly).  That level of 'predeterminism' can reduce the feeling of agency that players enjoy and makes the team a particularly furstrating opponent.

ThaRoadWarrior

I guess I should qualify that with "in the current PVP meta." GRRR slays in PVE, where you have time to use Chain Whip.

If his green worked with WF, he would be a Huge Problem, and it should based on the wording, but it doesn't. Those repeaters are immune to Kitty and do 3X match damage per tile gathered.

I don't lean on his red that much because most of the Kitty's I face just gobble the tile and hit me for mega damage. I find the stun to be more useful than the self-harm it generates. And i face almost exclusively Kitty teams that are significantly higher leveled than I am after 400pts in PVP. I can take them fairly reliably as long as Bishop isn't involved in the simulator teams.

His black is good, but inferior to Doom's in terms of both cost and reliable damage. I just champed Doom this morning, so he'll probably be my new climb 5*. 

Okoye adds to power-based damage, so anybody who is doing regular, reliable damage is going to be great with her. You're right that Chain Whip is a good mechanism for doing that, but it's not nearly as reliable as Entanglement or Flames of the Faltine for doing that damage in a match, even with those characters being down a tier. 

Phumade

Vhailorx said:

Phumade said:

DAZ0273 said:

Gritty is clearly on the Devs radar with all the anti-Grocket measures being released so who knows what PvP will look like once people have champed Sabretooth - he will play nicely with your Okoye though! If PvE is your thing then obviously a functioning Gritty will help a lot there.

I've seen a few champed SAbreOkoye combos out in the wild.  Its a good combo for those High Health 5e / Hard 3 nodes as well.  In fact I would say SabreOkoye is a slightly more reliable partnership than Gritty.  If the strikes get dropped to fast, Its hard to recover from or you've stalled and basically ruined your finishing times.  Whereas SabreOkoye might be a turn or two slower,  but just as good at dealing multiple 20k nukes.

SabreOkoye is solid favorite against an equal sized Gritty in pvp, but it all boils down to where the strikes setup.  Sabre's 3x3 explosion is just as likely to destroy potential matches (including cascading match 3s.)  for you as destroy enemy strikes.  and if those 3x3 drop the strikes to the bottom row, you just have a devil of a time to matching them away.  So its not an autopilot response, but it can definitely stop Gritty dead in her tracks.

Without premade strikes, Kitty is pretty much useless.  Overall it just boils down to how reachable the strike tiles are.

No, without fast strikes, kitty is what the devs designed her to he: a solid support character who turns enemy specials into some decent damage, can indirectly punish enemy powers with her red, and generally just makes life worse for the opposition. 

What still feels frustrating about gritty in PvP is that most match outcomes are largely determined by the initial board state (if the strikes are matchable, the player will win, if not, the player will at best get hurt very badly).  That level of 'predeterminism' can reduce the feeling of agency that players enjoy and makes the team a particularly furstrating opponent.

Kiittys red cd almost never came into play in regular pvp.  It's not a power that the AI will play well, and you'll almost always go after kitty first.  Even if she does get a red cd out.  You'll just wait to march it or one shot finish the match.

in fact the only time kitty's red helps is on offense because the AI will reliably trigger it.

Vhailorx

ThaRoadWarrior said:

I guess I should qualify that with "in the current PVP meta." GRRR slays in PVE, where you have time to use Chain Whip.

If his green worked with WF, he would be a Huge Problem, and it should based on the wording, but it doesn't. Those repeaters are immune to Kitty and do 3X match damage per tile gathered.

I don't lean on his red that much because most of the Kitty's I face just gobble the tile and hit me for mega damage. I find the stun to be more useful than the self-harm it generates. And i face almost exclusively Kitty teams that are significantly higher leveled than I am after 400pts in PVP. I can take them fairly reliably as long as Bishop isn't involved in the simulator teams.

His black is good, but inferior to Doom's in terms of both cost and reliable damage. I just champed Doom this morning, so he'll probably be my new climb 5*. 

Okoye adds to power-based damage, so anybody who is doing regular, reliable damage is going to be great with her. You're right that Chain Whip is a good mechanism for doing that, but it's not nearly as reliable as Entanglement or Flames of the Faltine for doing that damage in a match, even with those characters being down a tier. 

I think doom will become your regular climb and your regular defensive 5*.  He is not quite as good as JJ for damage output.  But he is more sustainable with true healing, and about as good on defense (she does damage with her traps, he lengthens matches with his AP suppression and true healing). 

sinnerjfl

Vhailorx said:

ThaRoadWarrior said:

I guess I should qualify that with "in the current PVP meta." GRRR slays in PVE, where you have time to use Chain Whip.

If his green worked with WF, he would be a Huge Problem, and it should based on the wording, but it doesn't. Those repeaters are immune to Kitty and do 3X match damage per tile gathered.

I don't lean on his red that much because most of the Kitty's I face just gobble the tile and hit me for mega damage. I find the stun to be more useful than the self-harm it generates. And i face almost exclusively Kitty teams that are significantly higher leveled than I am after 400pts in PVP. I can take them fairly reliably as long as Bishop isn't involved in the simulator teams.

His black is good, but inferior to Doom's in terms of both cost and reliable damage. I just champed Doom this morning, so he'll probably be my new climb 5*. 

Okoye adds to power-based damage, so anybody who is doing regular, reliable damage is going to be great with her. You're right that Chain Whip is a good mechanism for doing that, but it's not nearly as reliable as Entanglement or Flames of the Faltine for doing that damage in a match, even with those characters being down a tier. 

I think doom will become your regular climb and your regular defensive 5*.  He is not quite as good as JJ for damage output.  But he is more sustainable with true healing, and about as good on defense (she does damage with her traps, he lengthens matches with his AP suppression and true healing). 

Small difference though, you have to deal with JJ ASAP, things can get out of hand if a few of her traps get matched.

Doom on the other hand, as long as his black is not near powered, you can just wait and not damage him. The AP steal is annoying but not that significant I find.

I'm more likely to skip JJ than Doom.

ThaRoadWarrior

I think Doom gives Kitty teams pause, since killing him clears the strikes. When he only had a few covers, I'd try to get him out front specifically to get killed on turn 2 to clear the strikes, then use GRRR to finish up. If I had a functional Lumbercap, I'd have used him instead to resuscitate

Vhailorx

sinnerjfl said:

Vhailorx said:

ThaRoadWarrior said:

I guess I should qualify that with "in the current PVP meta." GRRR slays in PVE, where you have time to use Chain Whip.

If his green worked with WF, he would be a Huge Problem, and it should based on the wording, but it doesn't. Those repeaters are immune to Kitty and do 3X match damage per tile gathered.

I don't lean on his red that much because most of the Kitty's I face just gobble the tile and hit me for mega damage. I find the stun to be more useful than the self-harm it generates. And i face almost exclusively Kitty teams that are significantly higher leveled than I am after 400pts in PVP. I can take them fairly reliably as long as Bishop isn't involved in the simulator teams.

His black is good, but inferior to Doom's in terms of both cost and reliable damage. I just champed Doom this morning, so he'll probably be my new climb 5*. 

Okoye adds to power-based damage, so anybody who is doing regular, reliable damage is going to be great with her. You're right that Chain Whip is a good mechanism for doing that, but it's not nearly as reliable as Entanglement or Flames of the Faltine for doing that damage in a match, even with those characters being down a tier. 

I think doom will become your regular climb and your regular defensive 5*.  He is not quite as good as JJ for damage output.  But he is more sustainable with true healing, and about as good on defense (she does damage with her traps, he lengthens matches with his AP suppression and true healing). 

Small difference though, you have to deal with JJ ASAP, things can get out of hand if a few of her traps get matched.

Doom on the other hand, as long as his black is not near powered, you can just wait and not damage him. The AP steal is annoying but not that significant I find.

I'm more likely to skip JJ than Doom.

As I said, Doom's offensive output is lower than JJ. so maybe you would prefer to skip here, but neither are particularly good deterrents (gritty + bishop is as good as it gets right now and even they take hits when they have enough points).

But on defense GED presents the player with a choice.  You can (A) try to down him immediately, in which case you (i) you have to overcome his healing, and (ii) might lose your special tiles, or (B) you can leave home for later, which risks him healing his allies or smacking you with (a legitimately hard hitting) black.  He is not OP, or even meta.  But he can alter gameplay in a meaningful way.  This is good character design!

GED is not a great 1st or 2nd character when designing your team.  But he is a pretty good 3rd character for some teams (e.g. thorkoye where he provides an outlet for black and extra yellow for okoye).  JJ is also good (arguably a bit better), but when you only have GRRR, and you just champed GED, I think you will end up using GED a lot. And that was the discussion topic here.

ThaRoadWarrior

To make this thread-jacking complete - GRRR is typically best spec’d At 5/3/5, but since Doom’s Black is superior for being cheaper (in black at any rate) and not having a condition on it doing 24k damage, it allows a respec of GRRR to take better advantage of red to 5/5/3. Doom’s yellow keeps the board fresh for Hell Ride also. I need to figure out who goes between them in Simulator, probably Chavez for me right now.

Daredevil217

ThaRoadWarrior said:

To make this thread-jacking complete....

Could create that “life with two non-meta 5*” thread! Give the people what they want.