Kaya seem really meh

Tremayne

Finally, Kaya hit the vault. I had hoped that the lukewarm reception of her would have lead to a small buff to her. That was self-delusional.

Initially, she seems to be a new Ob Nixilis, which a different kill mechanism, since ObN is very limited in his use, I fail to see how Kaya will get a lot of play.

If you play Kaya, you need to pump your own GY and your opponent’s GY full of cards. Plenty of discard to force your opponent to do that, there is also a number of creatures and spells that allow you to discard from your own library. However, while you are doing this to your self and your opponent, you must be ready to remove anything the opponent’s gets on the field.

So Kaya requires a long match, which does not encounter a deck that gets large mana cascades, either by design or accident. If that succeeds, then her third ability will most likely kill of your opponent. But if you are mass discarding your opponent cards, then why not use an existing PW like Angrath who is a lot more versatile in the number of deck strategies he can run?

Have I miss anything regarding Kaya?

Mburn7

She is the second BW walker we have in the game.  She has more consistent mana than Sorin and better deckbuilding constraints as well.  Her abilities seem significantly worse.

Pick your poison, I guess.  

arNero

Looking at her abilities again, I gotta agree with you that her abilities are somewhat lackluster.

On the plus side, she has a board control ability at least, so if her kill spells are eluding her too long, she can still hold her own for a while. Compared to Vraska 2, this is a plus. Also, she's more durable than Sorin.

The bad news is that her 1st ability is about as **** as Vraska 2's, and her ultimate requires too much setup even if it can OTK.

Having said that, I'm currently thinking of trying to make use of that ult. Imagine putting Stitcher's Apprentice, Glowspore Shaman and Swarm Guildmage, then either or both Discovery and Notion Rain, all of which to quckly fill up your own graveyard, use her kill spells to fill up opponent's graveyard, then ult for, I dunno, 50+ damage? Also, remember that unless misprogrammed, her ultimate exiles all graveyards, then deal damage to opponent, then move those cards back to the graveyard for a second round, and at 15 loyalty, it seems quite plausible to abuse that ult.

So, my personal final verdict: She's a bit like 3c Sarkhan: So-and-so 1st and 2nd ability, but potential massive damage ult.

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NinjaE

I'll be passing on her. Just not good enough in the current environment.

Laeuftbeidir

I'll get her, because I get all of them.

Her first seems useless, her second and ult okay. I could see myself running her in an exile build, where her colors excel anyway. 

But what do you mean with "ob is limited in his use"? I mean, he's limited by his color, but that's pretty much it. He offers card advantage, control and an alternative win con? How much better could abilities be? 

Kayas biggest issue is that she can't run blue and the devs don't even seem to recognize how broken they've made blue.

Furks

For me, the problem is that her abilities force you into playing a very specific type of deck. Most successful PW just have baseline strong abilities regardless of your game plan.

Koth, kiora, Sorin they all just boost your mana gains and buff/fetch your creatures. As long as you run creatures you're good to go. 

Kaya demands you play some sort of mass mill/destruction deck which is just very limited in options. 

Stormcrow

arNero said:

So, my personal final verdict: She's a bit like 3c Sarkhan: So-and-so 1st and 2nd ability, but potential massive damage ult.

That's a pretty silly comparison. They call him "Brokhan" for a reason you know. Her first ability is basically worthless, whereas Sarkhan's lets you draw cards (never a bad thing). Her second is okay removal; exile is good but the cost restriction is limiting, especially for creatures; it's her best ability but it's still not equivalent to Sarkhan's second ability. And the biggest issue: her "potential massive damage ult" is potentially massive damage only if you're like 20 turns into the game; on turn 2 or 3 it does basically nothing whereas Sarkhan's is a game-ender no matter when you use it.

OmegaLolrus

I think she'll be some fun, but yeah, not super competitive. Not planning on buying her 'til she comes around for crystals.

Passed on Domin, probably passing on this... But I'm thinking real serious-like about Domri. I love playing beasts and he seems to like that a bit.

IM_CARLOS

Becon bolt beats Kayas ult. 

Tremayne

Laeuftbeidir said:

...

But what do you mean with "ob is limited in his use"? I mean, he's limited by his color, but that's pretty much it. He offers card advantage, control and an alternative win con? How much better could abilities be? 

...

I primarily use Ob for creatureless objectives, since his gains and colour is to restrictive, but I acknowledge his potency in this limited venue. A dual colour PW would have many more possibilities.

Tremayne

Furks said:

For me, the problem is that her abilities force you into playing a very specific type of deck. Most successful PW just have baseline strong abilities regardless of your game plan.

Koth, kiora, Sorin they all just boost your mana gains and buff/fetch your creatures. As long as you run creatures you're good to go. 

Kaya demands you play some sort of mass mill/destruction deck which is just very limited in options. 

Very much in agreement with you. Can be fun sometimes, but for me the part about finding new decks for a PW is part of the challenge and I don’t really see that with Kaya.

Tremayne

Thank you for the input everyone. So far nothing obviously missed.

most likely waiting for something better, definitely not getting any money out of me on this one.

Outersider

I've used her a few times and the one thing I actually found a bit frustrating was not able to see my opponents number of exiled/graveyard cards (don't care what they are just the amount). You almost have to sit with pen and paper to count the cards to know if you have a kill shot. 

wereotter

I've played with her and found a couple fun things you can do with her, mainly cards that work for her that don't really work as well for other planeswalkers, but I agree, she's kind of lacking compared to other planeswalkers.

I have enjoyed using her in some of the events since her second ability is decent removal, and being exile is really nice, espeically if you can work it right. Destroy Diragaz using Murder on your opponent's turn, then exile his support on your turn (but things like this really have to line up right)

Brigby

Outersider said:

I've used her a few times and the one thing I actually found a bit frustrating was not able to see my opponents number of exiled/graveyard cards (don't care what they are just the amount). You almost have to sit with pen and paper to count the cards to know if you have a kill shot. 

That's a very fair point! I'll be sure to discuss with the rest of our team and see what we can do about adding a number display for an opponent's Exile / Graveyard

madwren

The worst thing about her is the cost restriction on a second-level planeswalker ability. Guess they really got spooked by how effective NB1 is. 

Brakkis

madwren said:

The worst thing about her is the cost restriction on a second-level planeswalker ability. Guess they really got spooked by how effective NB1 is. 

I feel like the worst thing is that the only way to make effective use of her ult is to run heavy discard and if you're going that route, Angrath is far superior.

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Falizar

IDK I kind of like Chord of Calling in Rakdos, the Showstopper

Brakkis

Falizar said:

IDK I kind of like Chord of Calling in Rakdos, the Showstopper

Good thing there are multiple other Planeswalkers - Samut, Nahiri, Vraska, Brokhan, Sorin, Ajani 1, Huatli 1, and Arlinn Kord - that can do that.

There is nothing Kaya does, or can be built for, that another Planeswalker isn't better at.