Is Wasp the worst 5* ever?

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Steve111
Steve111 Posts: 160 Tile Toppler
i know it’s early days, but using her in the simulator pve was eye opening. It’s like she wasn’t really there. She placed some wasp tiles on the board that did nothing, did 2k damage once and let the others do the heavy lifting. 

She he just takes up space, is a passenger and doesn’t contribute to the team. 

Or or am I using her incorrectly? 
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Comments

  • TPF Alexis
    TPF Alexis Posts: 3,826 Chairperson of the Boards
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    She had better match damage than my 4* I had alongside her. That's about it.
  • Sim Mayor
    Sim Mayor Posts: 309 Mover and Shaker
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    I only have 5 covers in 2 powers for her, so I wasn't expecting much, but yeah, aside from soaking up a lot of health packs because her match damage always put her in front, she was pretty useless.
  • Jaedenkaal
    Jaedenkaal Posts: 3,357 Chairperson of the Boards
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    I mean, Doc Ock with 1-2 covers wasn't much better. Superior Science is at least a stun, I guess.
  • sinnerjfl
    sinnerjfl Posts: 1,274 Chairperson of the Boards
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    Yes, she is the worst.
  • Spoit
    Spoit Posts: 3,441 Chairperson of the Boards
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    All I know is that she's giving banner a run for his money
  • thedarkphoenix
    thedarkphoenix Posts: 557 Critical Contributor
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    I think she might be, 4 wasp is far superior.

    I feel like ghost was suppose to be the 5 and wasp the 4 alt and they got switched.
  • zodiac339
    zodiac339 Posts: 1,948 Chairperson of the Boards
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    I think she might be, 4 wasp is far superior.

    I feel like ghost was suppose to be the 5 and wasp the 4 alt and they got switched.
    Dear Lord, imagine Ghost as a 5, with that passive at least doubling, or usually quadrupling, that 5* match damage.
  • Jarvind
    Jarvind Posts: 1,684 Chairperson of the Boards
    edited July 2018
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    Nobody will ever be worse than Banner. Banner is the only character with a mechanic that is actively detrimental to your team.

    Note to devs: This is not a challenge, please do not make an effort to prove me wrong.
  • zodiac339
    zodiac339 Posts: 1,948 Chairperson of the Boards
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    Jarvind said:
    Nobody will ever be worse than Banner. Banner is the only character with a mechanic that is actively detrimental to your team.

    Note to devs: This is not a challenge, please do not make an effort to prove me wrong.
    Only? Both versions of Gambit hurt their teammates in some way (blocking powers or literally damaging them). Sentry and Ragnarok both damage teammates. Phoenix creates pretty strong enemy attack tiles if you spam recklessly. Carnage red and black. I am Grrrrroooot! (matching the bomb for you). Kingpin’s finger. Dazzler’s absence. Lots of detrimental stuff.
  • Jarvind
    Jarvind Posts: 1,684 Chairperson of the Boards
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    zodiac339 said:
    Jarvind said:
    Nobody will ever be worse than Banner. Banner is the only character with a mechanic that is actively detrimental to your team.

    Note to devs: This is not a challenge, please do not make an effort to prove me wrong.
    Only? Both versions of Gambit hurt their teammates in some way (blocking powers or literally damaging them). Sentry and Ragnarok both damage teammates. Phoenix creates pretty strong enemy attack tiles if you spam recklessly. Carnage red and black. I am Grrrrroooot! (matching the bomb for you). Kingpin’s finger. Dazzler’s absence. Lots of detrimental stuff.
    Those are tradeoffs for mostly-positive powers, though. Banner's auto-matching so reliably wastes every good match and eats up all your friendly tiles that there's basically no upside to it. Yes, it does a piddly amount of damage, but it's so completely not worth it.

    The only power that comes even close to that level of phenomenal suck is the pre-rework version of Eddie Brock's passive.
  • TheHungryPet
    TheHungryPet Posts: 229 Tile Toppler
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    I sadly confirm that the perceived power level of 5* Wasp is somewhere around Dr. Ock. It would help to automatically let her create swarm tiles up to a certain threshold like Peter Parker. This would somewhat lessen the impact of her powers removing swarm tiles. 

    At the current state, too cumbersome, too slow and even when the stars align, the damage numbers are insignificant.
  • jamesh
    jamesh Posts: 1,600 Chairperson of the Boards
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    She's definitely one of those characters that feels useless at low numbers of covers: the rate at which she locks covers is so low that I've never had the ability transform.  It's not as bad as Agent Venom where a low-cover version actively sabotages your team, but it doesn't really help build interest in the character.

    So she doesn't actually get useful fully covered?
  • theomen
    theomen Posts: 99 Match Maker
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    Wasp looked very weak on paper, so I wonder what the thinking was behind her design?

    That said, I wouldn't be surprised if they buff her to strengthen her up a bit (like they did with 4* Wasp) and she accidentally becomes the new meta.
  • himatako
    himatako Posts: 269 Mover and Shaker
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    She's basically a rehashed of the old Invisible Woman's design. It didn't work then, so I don't know why they think It would work now. This only shows that IW design before was so bad that even putting those powers in a 5-star cannot save them. 
  • Jaedenkaal
    Jaedenkaal Posts: 3,357 Chairperson of the Boards
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    himatako said:
    She's basically a rehashed of the old Invisible Woman's design. It didn't work then, so I don't know why they think It would work now. This only shows that IW design before was so bad that even putting those powers in a 5-star cannot save them. 
    Even old IW could make herself invisible...
  • himatako
    himatako Posts: 269 Mover and Shaker
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    himatako said:
    She's basically a rehashed of the old Invisible Woman's design. It didn't work then, so I don't know why they think It would work now. This only shows that IW design before was so bad that even putting those powers in a 5-star cannot save them. 
    Even old IW could make herself invisible...
    Gosh, you're right.  Now I really really want to know the design process that led to this result...
  • ZootSax
    ZootSax Posts: 1,819 Chairperson of the Boards
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    The fact they gave Wasp a burst heal instead of a true heal only adds insult to injury...
  • sinnerjfl
    sinnerjfl Posts: 1,274 Chairperson of the Boards
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    Her locked Swarm tiles seem to be incredibly easy to remove as well. Not sure why.
  • Tensuun
    Tensuun Posts: 98 Match Maker
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    I think my Alliance leader said it best: "Wasp has the strength of the support character with none of the functionality, since she doesn't do a whole lot for others."

    I'm still interested in getting more covers for her; a five-star who can reliably(?) increase her own match damage by 50% could be really good if I spend the iso-8 to level her, and I think this forum tends to skew negative on theorycraft.

    But even in my own theorycraft, she winds up as a support who needs a support. Maybe it's because I only have it at rank 1, but her blue AP steal seems to need help from a cost-lowering support character like 4* Star-Lord or Shuri, and her black and yellow abilities are too expensive to use even with that. I still think Carnage and either Medusa or Mister Fantastic could be good with her (a team I'd naturally refer to as Minimum Carnage), but they'd still struggle to compete with rosters that included... almost any 5* besides Wasp. :/

    I did try to get as much use as I could out of her in her Essential nodes in Simulator; I used Star-Lord to reduce the cost of her blue (16 AP to make four countdowns and steal 8 AP), then Hood to make sure they all resolved. The result was... sad; it's still likely this is all just because my Wasp is 1/0/0 lv255, but even with the bonus to match damage, Wasp just wasn't doing a lot for me.