newbie question about oscorp: heroic

rkd80

Hi folks,

Just a few days into the game and playing in this PvE. Doing ok, but do not have patch. I noticed that the final award (50k points or so?) results in Patch. So this may be a dumb question, but why is the final reward for an event the very same character that is required to complete that event? I can do most of the nodes, but several require patch - which seems like a cruel catch 22.

Thanks!

Unknown

Because you need 13 covers of patch to 'complete' him. So, people that have earned Patch in the past, will still want more of his covers.

Also, that last reward is a farce. A carrot that none ever touches unless the devs screw up their point system calibrations.


As such a new user, you're not meant to compete for all the prizes and rewards. Just get what you can and move on to the next event.

Unknown

rkd80 wrote:

Just a few days into the game and playing in this PvE. Doing ok, but do not have patch. I noticed that the final award (50k points or so?) results in Patch. So this may be a dumb question, but why is the final reward for an event the very same character that is required to complete that event? I can do most of the nodes, but several require patch - which seems like a cruel catch 22.

That final progression reward is just for show, it's a well established trend that it never gets handed out. Just consider it the pot of gold at the end of the rainbow.

If you participate often in events, you'll slowly build up a pool characters that will allow you to enter those restricted nodes. Sometimes they get handed out as placement rewards, with a bit of luck you'll also get them from event tokens. If you are really desperate you can also spend money to buy event tokens, chances to pull Patch are pretty low though, a little above 1% if I remember correctly.

rkd80

Interesting. So for a new player the forum is a bit of an interesting paradox.

On one hand, there is a ton of information and guides/tips that have definitely steered me in the right direction. I already made a lot of mistakes in the beginning, still paying for that.
On the other hand, there are many warnings and reality checks.

Hard to separate the two.

So you are saying it is basically impossible to get 50k points (which is what appears to be required for him?).

All this talk about scaling, rubberbanding and stacking is making my head explode - even after reading the definitions it still makes no sense ;(

Unknown

rkd80 wrote:

I was under the impression that after a certain point in the story, PvE is really the only way to move forward. However after reading the discussion about this event - I am wondering what the fuss is all about? Someone obviously places in the top ranks and gets him, no?

After a certain point, events are the way to move forward. (Not all events are PvE. Some of them, like the currently running Season 1 event, are PvP.)

You also seem to be confusing rank rewards with point rewards. The Patch cover you're talking about is a point reward-- it's possible for the event to end with no one having reached that point value.

There are also ranking rewards, which just rank everyone in a given bracket based on how many points they've earned, and then hands out prizes accordingly. IIRC, the Oscorp event will hand out covers for the new 3 star version of Daken to the top 150-ish finishers (and it gives out 2 covers to people in the top... fifty, I think?).

Unknown

rkd80 wrote:

I was under the impression that after a certain point in the story, PvE is really the only way to move forward. However after reading the discussion about this event - I am wondering what the fuss is all about? Someone obviously places in the top ranks and gets him, no?

It's actually both PvE and PvP that allow you to progress. There are two types of reward, progression reward and placement reward. Progression rewards you get during an event for collecting a preset number of points, placement rewards at the end of an event based on how many points you collected compared to other players. So even though the good progression rewards are unattainable, putting effort into events may still get you a placement reward.

rkd80

Moghwyn wrote:

rkd80 wrote:

I was under the impression that after a certain point in the story, PvE is really the only way to move forward. However after reading the discussion about this event - I am wondering what the fuss is all about? Someone obviously places in the top ranks and gets him, no?

It's actually both PvE and PvP that allow you to progress. There are two types of reward, progression reward and placement reward. Progression rewards you get during an event for collecting a preset number of points, placement rewards at the end of an event based on how many points you collected compared to other players. So even though the good progression rewards are unattainable, putting effort into events may still get you a placement reward.

I see. So what is the realistic progression reward? I am finding the placement awards to be far more confusing since they are influenced by the community. My rankings change all the time. Which is fine in SHIELD and other PvP where I am routinely slaughtered, but a bit less clear in PvE.

Unknown

Progression reward is rarely gotten right in PvE. Usually when they're reachable it's way too easy due to rubberbanding but of course nobody actually complains about progression rewards being too easy. On the other end when they're not too easy to get they're often flat out impossible to get and that sucks too.

I feel that as long as there is rubberbanding D3 is probably loathe to give out any decent progression reward because the rubberband means if one guy can get it, almost everyone else can get it too and I'm pretty sure D3 is not in the business of handing out all the progression rewards to everyone. They should consider putting some rubberband-less events that actually have good progression rewards for a change of pace, though it is entirely possible that metrics tell them nobody likes the original Heroic Oscorp event which is exactly that (good progression reward, no rubberbanding).

Unknown

Phantron wrote:

They should consider putting some rubberband-less events that actually have good progression rewards for a change of pace, though it is entirely possible that metrics tell them nobody likes the original Heroic Oscorp event which is exactly that (good progression reward, no rubberbanding).

And horrific scaling. You forgot the horrific scaling.

A rerun of the original Heroic Oscorp without either the scaling or the tinykittying-over they did this time would probably be as well-received as any Heroic will be (i.e., people hate them); but we can judge based on the two that they've run that Heroic Oscorp means that they will be implementing a new mechanic as badly and incompetently as humanly posssible.

Unknown

rkd80 wrote:

So what is the realistic progression reward?

Well, the top players usually reach more or less the halfway mark. The currently running Oscorp event has been a bit more generous, they initially handed out about 10k more points than they intended. So the final scores will get to around 35k, topmost progression reward being located at 50k. For you personally it really depends on your roster and how you play. Due to rubberbanding you should be able to get a decent amount of points, probably 75% of those of top players, even if you play fairly casually.

rkd80

I am about at about 19k, but 4 of the missions are unavailable to me due to lack of Patch. Others are locked out, only one success, most are green checmark now. So I guess I am done.
Ranked at about 75+, but it keeps slipping. So I'll be happy w/whatever.

Unknown

rkd80 wrote:

I am about at about 19k, but 4 of the missions are unavailable to me due to lack of Patch. Others are locked out, only one success, most are green checmark now. So I guess I am done.
Ranked at about 75+, but it keeps slipping. So I'll be happy w/whatever.

You can still collect points from those green checkmarks, there's just no 4/4 rewards left.

rkd80

I see. Also it seems like the two missions with all 3 villains (instead of goons) just got harder? They started at level 30+ and are now 40+. THat pretty much shuts out new players instantly.

Unknown

rkd80 wrote:

I see. Also it seems like the two missions with all 3 villains (instead of goons) just got harder? They started at level 30+ and are now 40+. THat pretty much shuts out new players instantly.

There's a couple of scaling factors, as you beat more missions the enemy levels rise, and as other players beat missions the levels rise as well.

(Don't mention seeing level 40 enemies... It gives the veterans seeing level 340 enemies traumatic stress disorder )

Unknown

That's scaling, they get harder for everyone. Yours are lvl 40, mine are, holy **** I should have grinded them down earlier, 211- that shuts out mid-tier players just as effectively

Basically, the more you play (and win) the harder the missions get - that's your personal scaling.
The more the player community as a whole plays and wins, the harder the missions get - that's community scaling.

Add the two together and towards the end of every event you reach levels that your team can't crack, except with a lot of luck and tons of boosters.

rkd80

Now I understand the scaling! I must have read that guide 5 times and it still made no sense until now. So is there a way to avoid that or mitigate that in any way? I think I understand why reaching 50k points is impossible!

Now if I can just figure out stacking, tinykittying (or whatever) and rubberbanding, I will be all set! I swear, this forum requires a whole new language!


SOrry for mentioning level 30! Lol

gambl0r312

Carthl wrote:

That's scaling, they get harder for everyone. Yours are lvl 40, mine are, holy **** I should have grinded them down earlier, 211- that shuts out mid-tier players just as effectively

Basically, the more you play (and win) the harder the missions get - that's your personal scaling.
The more the player community as a whole plays and wins, the harder the missions get - that's community scaling.

Add the two together and towards the end of every event you reach levels that your team can't crack, except with a lot of luck and tons of boosters.

And this is why the devs won't be removing scaling, because the scaling causes people to spend money buying boosts (via the buyable Hero Points or buyable amounts of ISO-8) i.e. temporary advantages that cost money.

Anything that reinforces this will be kept, anything that gets in the way of the community spending more will be removed (see MMR changes to reduce the effects of tanking and easy ISO-8, points and bracketing shenanigans in the PvP tourneys, etc.)

Unknown

rkd80 wrote:

Now I understand the scaling! I must have read that guide 5 times and it still made no sense until now. So is there a way to avoid that or mitigate that in any way? I think I understand why reaching 50k points is impossible!

Now if I can just figure out stacking, tinykittying (or whatever) and rubberbanding, I will be all set! I swear, this forum requires a whole new language!


SOrry for mentioning level 30! Lol

Eddiemon's guide is pretty good, what part of it are you not understanding? Deciding how to play really depends on knowing how those "new language" factors interact.

The first thing to know is that the amount of points you get for beating a mission depends on how far behind the leader you are. Since players are getting more points as the event goes on, playing as late as possible gives you more points.

Each circle ("node") gives out its points in decreasing "stacks." So the first time you beat it, it could be worth 1000 points (plus some bonus depending on how far behind the leader you are), the second time, 750, then 500, then 250, then 1. However, after the refresh time (which is usually either 8 or 12 hours), a node's points will move up one level on that scale.

So, for example, you beat a node at 10:00 am, it gives 1000 points. You beat it again at 10:15 am, it gives 750 points. Now it's worth 500 points. At 10:00 PM, it will be worth 750 points again, and at 10:15 pm, it will be worth 1000 points.

As you can see, to get the MOST points out of the nodes, after you've played a session, it's best to wait until they refresh to their maximum value before you play them again!

There is another wrinkle, though: scaling. Whenever you beat nodes, and as the other players beat nodes, the enemy levels of your nodes increase. So if you try to wait too long in order to get maximum points, or if you try to beat all the nodes a bunch of times to squeeze all the points out of them, your levels may get too difficult to beat!

There's been some discussion from the company about what makes your levels increase and decrease, and a lot more theorizing: it seems like winning fights quickly without taking damage makes your levels increase faster, and taking a lot of damage and having characters die makes them increase slower (and, very rarely, even go down!) But nobody's really certain exactly how the scaling is determined.