Master Token Valuation.

Ctenko

I really don't like the 450 CP option. I mean... I don't like the Thanos modern option either, but 700 more HC is like, just 6 extra dollars That's... not a lot. Not in the scheme. Sure, I'll pick that up, since I just have it sitting about. But 450 CP. That's, a month of HARD grinding and purchases? Or there about? My math could be off. 
60 from Daily
88 From a week long,
160 from a 3 and 4 day event Twice.
40 from a 4 day. 22 from a boss. (No one gets EVERY CP from a Boss Event.)
80 From all the PVP's. That's about 450. I think. 

One Thanos cover 175 CP (First color, with a feeder.)
25k Iso 25 CP
12k RISO, 60(Ish Worth just over twice as much?)
4, Support, Advanced  100cp (Worth a latest pull each? Maybe?)
Master cover 90? Is a master support cover worth 90 CP? Really? 

Maybe, what has ever been offered 2 ever master tokens, and then this Vault? So, maybe i am undervaluing it currently. 1 in 300, assume a 240 pull base to catch it? Just gonna add the 200 to the daily deal. So 5 40 packs and your deal for the sixth... 80,000 coins worth. 4 starks, per? Wish I had jumped on that Rocket and Groot now, if that is the rate to get one. Maybe a Master token is worth 450CP alone. Only 18 Legendaries worth. 

Thoughts on valuation? What is a Master Support Token worth?

Phumade

honestly,  you need to value the 

5* thanos @ 250cp  (thats really the going price for a classic.  trying to tie to feeders is wrong, because maybe the other person doesn't have a gamora)

So its really

25k Iso 25 CP
12k RISO, 60(Ish Worth just over twice as much?)
4, Support, Advanced  100cp (Worth a latest pull each? Maybe?)
Master cover 90? Is a master support cover worth 90 CP? Really? 

for 200cp.  Is that worth it?  meh who really knows.  but for me personally.

200cp =8 LT == 7 4* covers and 1 5*.


so the trade off is

1 r4 support,  1r3 support, and 3 r2 supports or 

7 4* covers and 1 5* cover


personally the ability for me to selectively choose which 5* tank which colors is probably worth more than 1 extra 5* cover and 7 surplus 4*

bluewolf

If you buy this deal, odds are pretty good you get a Black Order Support. Does a Villain only Support do something significant for your roster?  If not, it’s an easy pass to me. 

Still here?  The cost of all Support resources is what they are charging now. All resources in the past have slowly increased after an initial rollout phase, and it seems likely that this will happen again.   200CP is likely to get you a 5* cover.  If the Supports are more valuable than a Latest 5 cover, go for it. But later you may wish you had waited.

Neither iso nor riso is worth using CP on for me.  If you pull any dupe Supports, your conversion rate is effectively more riso for your CP spent.

Ctenko

Well, no, because on a 250 classic from that store, you get 50k iso, Here you only get 25 k. also the cover is not the entire expenditure, you are getting 50k Iso. So, the valuation is different. But you're saying that master token is worth 200 alone? 

Ok, I can jive on that. 

200?

Ctenko

bluewolf said:

If you buy this deal, odds are pretty good you get a Black Order Support. Does a Villain only Support do something significant for your roster?  If not, it’s an easy pass to me. 

Still here?  The cost of all Support resources is what they are charging now. All resources in the past have slowly increased after an initial rollout phase, and it seems likely that this will happen again.   200CP is likely to get you a 5* cover.  If the Supports are more valuable than a Latest 5 cover, go for it. But later you may wish you had waited.

Neither iso nor riso is worth using CP on for me.  If you pull any dupe Supports, your conversion rate is effectively more riso for your CP spent.

I am almost certainly going to pass, But I am looking for what a market valuation on a Master support is worth. maybe just to avoid FOMO, maybe to keep my mind busy. but regardless of, I would not spend CP to obtain ISO or RISO, they have a valuation. For you it sounds like the cost for ISO RISO is actually more than I cost it at. Especially since ISO is the limiting factor of this game, rather than covers. Especially when you start getting to the end point. 

But what is a Master Support token, not a Black Order or what have you, just as a cost. What is that worth to you? We all value everything differently, I'm just wondering what that one token is worth. 

Hadronic

Ignoring the Iso difference

I look at this deal as basically a standard HfH classic of 250cp

with a forced additional buyout of 200cp for the Rice and 5 Support Tokens

No thanks

bluewolf

OK:  Supports are not worth spending CP on to me. Will I use HP?  Yes. I have a good flow there. CP are what I need to complete 5’s and use them in the game.

A support will not open a node to you. It will not let you champ a 5 and crush a PVE event.  It simply helps you - probably only a little - once you have the characters you needed.  CP gets you those characters. Don’t use it on Support tokens.

Counter point:  do you already have a 460+ Gambit?  Do whatever you want with your CP. You’ve already basically won the game anyway. (Poor 5 Cap. If only more programming time had been available for your power set.)

Phumade

bluewolf said:

Counter point:  do you already have a 460+ Gambit?  Do whatever you want with your CP. You’ve already basically won the game anyway. (Poor 5 Cap. If only more programming time had been available for your power set.)

lol ya..

There actually a big population of post iso players with the majority of 5* champed.  So for that crowd 450 cp is probably less than 2 weeks of pve and pvp

Quebbster

For me, 450 CP is about a week and a half's Worth, I estimate my income at around 300 CP a week. About 120 from PvE, 75 from PvP, 14 from DDQ... The rest is from champion rewards, season rewards and intercepts I guess.

j0nats

but its thanos guys. arguably the 4 5s u need right now is thor gambit thanos and bolt (though u can still survive with just thor instead of bolt in pvp)

but, only thanos can speed grind cl7.   gambit super slow in pve.

so 450 still worth it for me.  

sambrookjm

Checks cover color - Black
Checks my Thanos - 5 black, 5 purple, 2 green.

Nope.

GrimSkald

It seems clear to me that the Master Support Token is the Support Equivalent of a Legendary Token.  Right now, supports seem to be valued at an order of magnitude more than their cover-yielding counterparts.  At least one order of magnitude, actually, they're super hard to get.  Similarly, RIso is probably valued at least 10X (maybe more like 100X or 1000X) as much as Iso.

I suspect this is not the situation that will last, but that is as it stands.  Since Master Tokens (and Advanced tokens, for that matter,) are only available through special offers right now, they're valued extremely high.  Please note that I don't say they're worth that much - they're worth their usefulness to you, which is actually pretty low.  But the game itself values them extremely highly right now.

rixmith

The support economy is quite different than the character economy. How many characters do you need? All of them! At least if you want to do all Essential nodes in PVE.

How many supports do you need? Really no more than the number of characters that you typically use each day. If you are a 5* player, just a few supports will cover everyone you use. For 4* players, enough for the buffed characters this week and maybe a 3* battery like IM40 or Wanda. So you'll never really need more than 6 - 8 supports.

I bought the first HfH deals and I now have 9 supports (one 5*, one 3*, five 2* and two 1*). Gambit, Thanos and Thor have pretty much permanent supports. I move Wong to whatever Blue AP user might be relevant for a PVE (AA for Webbed Wonder, Riri for Wakanda, currently Dr. Strange for HoD). The rest of my supports? I don't ever really think about them.

And, of course, I don't have enough RISO to do much with them.

My guess is that it is good to buy something at some point to get into the Supports game. One purchase will give you more supports than you will use or be able to level in the next year or two at the current RISO flow rate.

jamesh

GrimSkald said:

It seems clear to me that the Master Support Token is the Support Equivalent of a Legendary Token.  Right now, supports seem to be valued at an order of magnitude more than their cover-yielding counterparts.  At least one order of magnitude, actually, they're super hard to get.  Similarly, RIso is probably valued at least 10X (maybe more like 100X or 1000X) as much as Iso.

I suspect this is not the situation that will last, but that is as it stands.  Since Master Tokens (and Advanced tokens, for that matter,) are only available through special offers right now, they're valued extremely high.  Please note that I don't say they're worth that much - they're worth their usefulness to you, which is actually pretty low.  But the game itself values them extremely highly right now.

It's not quite equivalent to a legendary token though.  A legendary token has a 15% chance of giving you one thirteenth of a 5* character.  A master support token has a 10% chance of giving you a whole 5* support.  And given that you almost never fully cover a character from 13 random covers, the difference is probably even greater.

With that said, I would value a fully covered character higher than a support of the same rank.  So that swings the needle back in the other direction.  I suspect some of these differences were on purpose to make it difficult to gauge their value compared to existing resources in the game.

Daredevil217

My Thanos is 1/4/4. And I’ve only gotten black from Gamora. This deal was MADE for me. And still I just can’t...

Am I crazy leaving this on the table?

Over__Flow

A black thanos woukd make my thanos finally champable...(gamora already lvl 360). Still need 70 cp. I think I will buy the deal but for any other 5* cover I would have passed

Pongie

aesthetocyst said:

jamesh said: .... It's not quite equivalent to a legendary token though.  A legendary token has a 15% chance of giving you one thirteenth of a 5* character.  A master support token has a 10% chance of giving you a whole 5* support.  And given that you almost never fully cover a character from 13 random covers, the difference is probably even greater.

So much this. Players, trained on the expectations of the character economy, have yet to grasp just how different the support economy will be. 

They should be harder to get, and take longer to level, because they are forever. And they will be relevant forever. (Characters get passed by meta. Supports can just shift to the new shiny.) And there is zero waste.

Essentially, supports are distributed in several ways players always wished characters were, and are durable in ways players wish characters were.

The rarity of supports, and their fuel, reflects those differences, as well as their newness.

Also want to add that just a single 5* support is usable as soon as you pull one. All 5 ranks (6 if the condition is met) are active (even if the numbers are low till you invest in red iso to level up). Unlike 5* covers, where a single pull used to wreck your MMR and aren't really usable until you get all 3 colours (better to be closer to 9-10 covers. Unless it was OML yellow, he was usable with just the 1 cover).