Can we talk about the Grind?

heybub
heybub Posts: 290 Mover and Shaker
in MPQ General Discussion
So, I've been playing this game every day, non-stop, for over 3.5 years now, and it really is great (I mean, I only put 150 hours into Skyrim....), but is there something that can be done about the grind?  I don't know what this game was before I joined, but right now it's all about grind through nodes 5x times, for each node, every day, to get the max rewards.  And I'm not even trying to make rank, grinding out 2 points per win...

it's getting kind of boring...Sure, the devs have added characters like Grocket and Thanos to speed it up a bit, but in the end, I'm playing pretty much the same characters over and over again trying to beat X more nodes before the clock ends (I pretty much play PVE, but it is somewhat similar in PVP, just less stress).  I rarely get the feeling of any kind of accomplishment or even a challenge.  The only time is Deadpool Crash of the Titans where I have an under-leveled 4* and somehow manage to eek out a victory, but these times are rare.

I'm not saying they should overhaul the game, but maybe they could add some new events where the levels are really **** hard.  Each node would be a 1 time finish (with multiple rewards = 6 normal node wins).  They would be difficult enough that not everyone will be able to beat them all (but everyone should be able to finish a couple),  might take multiple tries to win, and would take some roster creativity to finish.  For example, maybe one node would have a super high level Vulture, and one would need Archangel Air Superiority to make the battle winnable.  Maybe the node is a 8 level wave of terror, and points/awards are given out based on how far up you make it.  Maybe it is an inf wave where each level gets harder and harder.  You might have to make it up to lvl 6 to get all the rewards, but the person who can make it to level 25 would get enough points to get #1 rank.   

Obviously, this would all have to be thought out carefully, and even if it is done well, everybody will complain.

What are your thoughts on this?
 
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Comments

  • Dotproduct
    Dotproduct Posts: 217 Tile Toppler
    I'm wondering if the hatred for fighting Dark Avengers could be abated if they all had 'boss' style powers that would require more strategy to defeating them?
  • HoundofShadow
    HoundofShadow Posts: 8,004 Chairperson of the Boards
    edited April 2018
    Grinding, based on what I understand, came from players wanting to clear nodes within the shortest timeframe possible. This results in them using the same typical characters over and over again for almost all of the PvEs. Grinding results in  boredom.

    Even with your suggestions, the game will still end up being a grind, and it does not solve grinding problem. It only alleviates the symptoms.

    You have a choice. Besides the essential nodes and Join Forces node, you have the freedom to choose whatever characters that you want to use in PvE. You have the choice not to use the same characters.

    Instead of using Thanos and G4R to clear easy nodes, why not use 1* and 2* instead?  As for the rest of the nodes, use 3* or other 4* to challenge yourself. Ultimately, the players make the choice on who they use in each match. If you consciously use the same characters to clear every or most of the nodes for every PvE just because you want to finish it as soon as possible, it ends up being a grind.

    To make PvE challenging, we can

    1) add in more hazard tiles with various effects,
    2) introduce new goons or new bosses with various new abilities, such as:

    a) modify sub where every villians and goons are immune to stun
    b) your attack/strike/protect tilesare reduced to one
    c) if any of the characters have less than 50% hp, they take extra 100% damage.

    Etc....

    Again, some players are going to complain about wasting healthpacks.
  • Magic
    Magic Posts: 1,199 Chairperson of the Boards
    It's FTP - it will always be grindy. But what we need is a puzzle mode - something that will give great rewards but will not be a super easy to solve. 

    As it stands the only Puzzle part we have now is the LT node in Deadpool Daily Quest every 5 days. And it was a fun puzzle challenge when it was introduced. Now it's a challenge only if you don't have the 4* championed. We need more nodes like this.

    Meet conditions - get a prize. 
  • Calnexin
    Calnexin Posts: 1,078 Chairperson of the Boards
    edited April 2018
    I also feel the grind.  It's become more of a chore - something I do while I watch TV or exercise, but doesn't really occupy my attention or entertain me.  The only enjoyable part is opening packs hoping for 5* covers, but at the moment I'm stymied there because I'm saving up CP for direct purchase.

    At this point, adding new characters or going back and "challenging myself" with the old ones is not going to keep me engaged.  New PvEs in the same format aren't all that exciting.  Maybe a little in the first run, if I get surprised by a special tile and have to incorporate them into my strategy.

    A few things I'd like to see in the game that would make it overall more enjoyable

    - SR-based skipping/autocomplete.  Anyone past the 100 SR mark finds DDQ a joke.  Maybe they occasionally have trouble on a crash.  Make that stuff skippable or let the AI play out the match for you if you're past a certain point in certain events or nodes.  Maybe damage the characters used as if they'd lost a match as a cost-of-entry feature.  If the win is a foregone conclusion, why make us play it out?  I'd like to see that stretch to PvE as well, but that would require addressing the timing-based placement feature.

    - Play-based goals.  Award bonus prizes for achieving certain things during a match.  Things like no characters damaged, fired all active powers, end with 30 blue AP, use no 5* in an event, etc.  Give us a bonus for doing things out of the norm.

    - Something about high-end PvP.  Maybe nerfing Gambit will fix things, but I don't know.  I personally have never really enjoyed the matching/penalty for playing format very much, but it was at least tolerable before match variety went down to 2-3 options.
  • animaniactoo
    animaniactoo Posts: 486 Mover and Shaker
    For me, the major question isn't whether the game should be a grind. To me, that answer is obvious. Of course it should. It's a marathon, not a sprint.

    The question is - from a sustainability and QoL standpoint, how much time should players need to grind on a daily basis to keep pace with current development or at least slightly exceed it if they've been playing for less than 2 years?

    All other answers flow from there imo. That's the starting point.

    Secondary to that comes how much content is included that doesn't have to be done on a particular clock system, or where the clock is long enough that it doesn't feel like a time crunch to get it done. IMO, this game suffers greatly from that kind of lack. Think about the prologue - I think I had some of the most fun in this game when I was playing the prologue. Beating *the nodes* and wiping out half the time and having to come back to them when I had increased my roster strength and could take them on now.
  • Ares76
    Ares76 Posts: 227 Tile Toppler
    I am only playing for 600+ days but I am also feeling a little bit tired of the PvE grind. I am watching TV serials most of the time while clearing the nodes. In my MPQ era I've watched all episodes of Friends, How I Met Your Mother, Weeds, That 70's show, Gilmore Girls. You don't have to pay much attention to those. I probably never would have watched these shows if not for MPQ. 
  • mpqr7
    mpqr7 Posts: 2,642 Chairperson of the Boards
    The rockett said:
    Playing DPD everyday is a total joke at this point and at times cannot bring myself to play the 1/2* nodes. 
    Yes!! I too have difficulty playing the 1/2* nodes of DPD, even though I'd love the 2 taco tokens and 1500 ISO. Each one of them takes so long to do though!
  • DyingLegend
    DyingLegend Posts: 1,210 Chairperson of the Boards
    Been playing for 1k days currently. The grind is real. I wish there were more single player events that challenged my roster. I also wish they would adjust tokens. I'm tired of pulling two stars when I'm working on 5 stars. I go through burnt out stages where I only play a little bit because my pulls are awful or it's just to repetitive grinding nodes 4x in  a row etc. 
  • Sim Mayor
    Sim Mayor Posts: 309 Mover and Shaker
    Jarvind said:
    heybub said:
    I mean, I only put 150 hours into Skyrim....
     
    You did it wrong. You're supposed to play through it 5 additional times, and each time tell yourself you'll play it with a different build, but just end up making another stealth archer.
    DONE. Now for the 6th playthrough where I build a slightly different house in Hearthstone...what were we talking about again?

    Oh yeah. So I just hit day 954 (yay Venom cover!) playing 2 hours per day: 1 on my bus ride to work, 1 on my bus ride back. If the 5* node is really difficult, I might play during my lunch break. I barely touch PvP, and that amount of time is almost always enough to do 6 clears of every node in PvE.

    The game provides me with exactly enough rewards to keep choosing it as my time-waster once I'm done reading email. I rarely feel the need to play it outside of this set time. So I guess I don't really see the grind? Maybe that's just me.
  • Dormammu
    Dormammu Posts: 3,531 Chairperson of the Boards
    But they just released 10 new Supports! Hasn't that mixed things up for you???
  • Punisher5784
    Punisher5784 Posts: 3,845 Chairperson of the Boards
    You can reduce the grind time with Master level 250 Supports! Just take out your wallet and empty the 300-item vault, reset the vault and do it again like 5x! Itll cost roughly 16k. Sure, your spouse may divorce you but in the long run you'll save so much grind time do you use that extra time to grind PvP!
  • udonomefoo
    udonomefoo Posts: 1,630 Chairperson of the Boards
    I wish there were more challenging matches instead of easy repetitiveness.  I don't have a single max 5* and I haven't lost a match in weeks.  Even when I play SCL9, it just takes longer.

    I'd love the option to play an easy node 4 times or a really hard one once.  
  • HoundofShadow
    HoundofShadow Posts: 8,004 Chairperson of the Boards
    If you go into a PvE with the mindset of clearing everything as fast as possible because you only care about the rewards, naturally it will become boring. 

    If you go into a PvE with a mindset of trying different characters to solve each challenge, then it would be less grindy.

    If you are someone who can't let go of the urge to collect as many prizes as possible, then it will limit your playing style. Because there's only 1 playing style: speed or high damage. 

    4 clears of PvE takes about 1hr or so. If you can let go of the urge to win the highest placement rewards possible, you could probably finish all 5 to 7 clears leisurely, breaking each session into 15 minutes play or so. If you have time restraint and yet you want to win as many prizes as possible, your play style would be limited. 

    The QoL solutions suggested in this forum usually lead to one result:  more rewards using lesser time. 
  • The rockett
    The rockett Posts: 2,016 Chairperson of the Boards
    HoundofShadow said:
    If you go into a PvE with the mindset of clearing everything as fast as possible because you only care about the rewards, naturally it will become boring. 

    If you go into a PvE with a mindset of trying different characters to solve each challenge, then it would be less grindy.

    If you are someone who can't let go of the urge to collect as many prizes as possible, then it will limit your playing style. Because there's only 1 playing style: speed or high damage. 

    4 clears of PvE takes about 1hr or so. If you can let go of the urge to win the highest placement rewards possible, you could probably finish all 5 to 7 clears leisurely, breaking each session into 15 minutes play or so. If you have time restraint and yet you want to win as many prizes as possible, your play style would be limited. 

    The QoL solutions suggested in this forum usually lead to one result:  more rewards using lesser time. 
    The name of the game is to improve your roster.  The quickest way to do that outside of whaling is to push yourself for better reward.  While it would be nice to try different teams, hey we had a PVE for that called Gauntlet that we haven’t seen for sometime.  Oh. That’s right. We had 2 PVEs like that with heroics that had limited rosters!!  Imagine if we could have those again. 

    As a 5* player, there is no reason at all to use anything less than my 5* and selected 4* unless they are Thanos fodder. While I love using 4*, unless there is a PVE that takes out 5*, a lot of us will not use them, ever.  Well expect for RG and any GOTG. 

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