Getting a bit sick of MPQ... kinda

Palookaville

Been playing MPQ for a few years and I do still like the game, honest!

But...

but some things are really annoying me. I made the mistake of leveling my OML to 451 a few months ago and ever since then the game is just not as much fun. I don't have any other championed 5* characters (I have a couple at 420) but because of my OML, when I play PvP it seems all I get to face is *needed character* plus Gambit and Thor or Gambit and Black Bolt (or throw in Chavez on occasion)

Fair enough, nothing new there, been that way for a while. So I move over to the SHIELD simulator. Problem there is even at SHIELD clearance level 7 (the lowest I can choose) people usually have a team of two (or three) five star characters and Chavez (or maybe Capt Marvel if I am lucky) which is all fine and dandy, but I have a whole boat load of championed 4* characters that I want to use, but I can't.

Well, I can, but every time I do, one decent cascade and the match damage from a 5* character kills off my 4* pretty quickly.

I just leveled up Lockjaw, Nico and Yondu but I can't use them, because they cannot compete with 5*s

So anyway, after the complaining, my question is this.

How can I use my 4* characters on a regular basis?

Do I need to sell my OML and hope that is enough, or now that I have 4 or 5 characters over level 400, have I completely screwed myself out of playing with (and against) 4* characters?

IceHockey333

The title of this thread is misleading, your question is completely different. Ask the question in the title and you might get answers easier.

Jrlrma

The reson you see champed 5s in sim is because oml is champed. You can either dump him and move back to 4* tier in pvp keep him and try to manage or dump pvp altogether. 

CT1888

Even if you sell OML, I'm pretty sure your characters at 420 will still mean you see a lot of 5*s.
Who are your high covered 5*s?

shardwick

You may as well just stick it out. For all we know they may be working on something that makes transition to the 5* tier easier or maybe a way to disable 5s in pvp for those that want to play in 4* land without selling their 5s to do it.

This is just pure speculation on my part. 

Quebbster

The fivestar tier is like any other tier, when you first move into it you are limited to using a few characters over and over and over... but it gets better once you get more fivestar champions and get some options to choose from.

What other fivestars do you have at a high level?

Regarding the fourstars, they can be useful in the fivestar meta if they are both boosted and at a high champion level - they don't have the match damage the fivestars do, but on the other hand their Powers hit incredibly hard.

Also, there is no reason whatsoever to choose a lower SCL in SHIELD simulator as your chosen SCL does not affect your matchmaking - it only affects what rewards you fight for and against who. Since Simulator only has progression rewards, you are only getting less rewards choosing a lower SCL without any benefit.

Alsmir

1. 5* tier is all about Gambit right now.
2. Unless you have some non-latest 5* almost fully covered, you might forget abouth completing them. Classic tokens are so dilluted that going for any classic 5* is a joke.
3. Even with Gambit you will face teams with Gambit + Bolt (or Thor). Even when you get top tier characters you will face whales with extra champ levels. Match-maker isn't broken, it designed to force you into spending more.

Best you can do is hoard tokens and wait for another overpowered 5* to enter latest tokens.

Calnexin

Abandon all hope, ye who enter PvP.

I've got two champed 5's, neither of whom are Gambit.  As such, I can sometimes get to 575 before hitting the Gambit wall.  It requires a pretty heavy grind, though, because even manipulating my MMR by only using one of them still gets me attacked (and quickly defeated) by single-Gambit champions.  Shield hopping to 600 is very depressing.

I've mostly given it up, but then I'm recently post-Iso, so I don't *need* the rewards, per se.

BoyWonder1914

Stories like yours are what has prevented me from jumping to the 5* tier voluntarily. I plan on eventually making the transition, but not until:

1) 2-star farm going strong - CHECK

2) 3-star farm going strong - In Progress. Of the 47+ 3-stars, I have 30 at 266, another 5 at 260+, and everyone except the most recent 3 (Elektra, Gambit, Angel) are 240+. This is unfortunately slowing everything else down, because I get 3-star covers so often, and I don't want to keep selling them so that I can focus on 4s. I want to champ all the dupes that are fully covered so I can farm the rewards, THEN I'll get back to my 4s. 

3) All classic 4-stars champed, and to be ahead of the 4-star release schedule - In Progress. Still need to champ Ghost Rider, Mr. F, Venom, Spider-Woman, Flaptain, and of course Howard & DD. 

I hear you guys talk of this "post-iso" phase, and I don't want to concern myself with 5-stars until I'm in it. Gambit does happen to be one of the few 5-stars I already have fully covered, and I've even sold a few potential champ levels, but I'm still not looking forward to HAVING to use him in PVP. I was actually considering starting to put at least a little iso into my 5s once my 4s starting coming along and they changed PVE to be SCL-based scaling, but then I remembered 5-star MMR in PVP. 

Bowgentle

BoyWonder1914 said:

Stories like yours are what has prevented me from jumping to the 5* tier voluntarily. I plan on eventually making the transition, but not until:

1) 2-star farm going strong - CHECK

2) 3-star farm going strong - In Progress. Of the 47+ 3-stars, I have 30 at 266, another 5 at 260+, and everyone except the most recent 3 (Elektra, Gambit, Angel) are 240+. This is unfortunately slowing everything else down, because I get 3-star covers so often, and I don't want to keep selling them so that I can focus on 4s. I want to champ all the dupes that are fully covered so I can farm the rewards, THEN I'll get back to my 4s. 

3) All classic 4-stars champed, and to be ahead of the 4-star release schedule - In Progress. Still need to champ Ghost Rider, Mr. F, Venom, Spider-Woman, Flaptain, and of course Howard & DD. 

I hear you guys talk of this "post-iso" phase, and I don't want to concern myself with 5-stars until I'm in it. Gambit does happen to be one of the few 5-stars I already have fully covered, and I've even sold a few potential champ levels, but I'm still not looking forward to HAVING to use him in PVP. I was actually considering starting to put at least a little iso into my 5s once my 4s starting coming along and they changed PVE to be SCL-based scaling, but then I remembered 5-star MMR in PVP. 

Champ Gambit, and ONLY Gambit, run him with a boosted 4.

Don't touch any other 5, don't level them.

You should have a brilliant time in PVP with that setup.
Shame you already sold Gambit champ levels.

BoyWonder1914

Bowgentle said:

BoyWonder1914 said:

Stories like yours are what has prevented me from jumping to the 5* tier voluntarily. I plan on eventually making the transition, but not until:

1) 2-star farm going strong - CHECK

2) 3-star farm going strong - In Progress. Of the 47+ 3-stars, I have 30 at 266, another 5 at 260+, and everyone except the most recent 3 (Elektra, Gambit, Angel) are 240+. This is unfortunately slowing everything else down, because I get 3-star covers so often, and I don't want to keep selling them so that I can focus on 4s. I want to champ all the dupes that are fully covered so I can farm the rewards, THEN I'll get back to my 4s. 

3) All classic 4-stars champed, and to be ahead of the 4-star release schedule - In Progress. Still need to champ Ghost Rider, Mr. F, Venom, Spider-Woman, Flaptain, and of course Howard & DD. 

I hear you guys talk of this "post-iso" phase, and I don't want to concern myself with 5-stars until I'm in it. Gambit does happen to be one of the few 5-stars I already have fully covered, and I've even sold a few potential champ levels, but I'm still not looking forward to HAVING to use him in PVP. I was actually considering starting to put at least a little iso into my 5s once my 4s starting coming along and they changed PVE to be SCL-based scaling, but then I remembered 5-star MMR in PVP. 

Champ Gambit, and ONLY Gambit, run him with a boosted 4.

Don't touch any other 5, don't level them.

You should have a brilliant time in PVP with that setup.
Shame you already sold Gambit champ levels.

I'm pretty sure I can take your word on that. Shame, I shouldn't have been so stubborn lol

Palookaville

Apologies if my post title was misleading, that was not my intention.

For those who asked, my other 5* characters are Thanos, Hawkeye and Silver Surfer at 435 and Daredevil and Black Panther at 420 (other 5*s are sub 270) One day I went mad and sold a bunch of championed 3*s and used the ISO to bring some other 5*s closer to my OML, but like it has been said, getting those illusive final covers feel close to impossible. (managed to get blue Silver Surfer a couple of times when that is the color I have maxed out) 

It's funny, when I used mainly 3* characters in PvP, I hit 900 points nearly every time, when I moved up to 4* characters, I leveled out at 800 or so, now with using my OML, I hit 575 and then stop. I could fight on, but I know I will be hit multiple times and end up going backwards overall (I usually get hit 3 or so times while I head up to 575)

I personally think that fighting 5* characters would not be so bad if it was not for 

a) The match damage they create killing off anything less than another 5* quickly
b) It's always the same characters. If you saw Green Goblin, Doc Ock, Captain America and whatnot every so often, you can play with that. But every time it is Gambit + Thor/BB - which for me is insta-skip.

Like I said, I don't want to quit the game, I just want to be able to use my roster of characters. I have 150+ of them, and the game seems pointless if you only use the same 2 or 3 every game.

Dormammu

I've said it a thousand times: the 4-star tier is MPQ's sweet spot. It offers:

1) The largest pool of characters and strategies
2) Max-champed 3-stars are still viable to use, increasing your pool
3) Champed 5-stars are rarely seen in PvP
4) Under-covered 5-stars are everywhere in PvP and easy fodder
5) Gambit doesn't exist

We still have our problems, like Grocket/Gamora/Medusa occupying 4 out of 5 nodes in the simulator, but at least they're easy to counter compared to the Gambit meta.

Daredevil217

BoyWonder1914 said:

Stories like yours are what has prevented me from jumping to the 5* tier voluntarily. I plan on eventually making the transition, but not until:

1) 2-star farm going strong - CHECK

2) 3-star farm going strong - In Progress. Of the 47+ 3-stars, I have 30 at 266, another 5 at 260+, and everyone except the most recent 3 (Elektra, Gambit, Angel) are 240+. This is unfortunately slowing everything else down, because I get 3-star covers so often, and I don't want to keep selling them so that I can focus on 4s. I want to champ all the dupes that are fully covered so I can farm the rewards, THEN I'll get back to my 4s. 

3) All classic 4-stars champed, and to be ahead of the 4-star release schedule - In Progress. Still need to champ Ghost Rider, Mr. F, Venom, Spider-Woman, Flaptain, and of course Howard & DD. 

I hear you guys talk of this "post-iso" phase, and I don't want to concern myself with 5-stars until I'm in it. Gambit does happen to be one of the few 5-stars I already have fully covered, and I've even sold a few potential champ levels, but I'm still not looking forward to HAVING to use him in PVP. I was actually considering starting to put at least a little iso into my 5s once my 4s starting coming along and they changed PVE to be SCL-based scaling, but then I remembered 5-star MMR in PVP. 

I am in almost the exact same boat as you (eerily so) and disagree with Bow.

- Will have no iso but 58 4* champs tomorrow (Howard, Mr. F, Brock, Thor, Quake, and Thing left).
- My 3* game isn't as strong as yours.  I don't want to sell originals and only have 3 dupes champed, MANY approaching 266 though.
- Max-covered Thor, DD, Gambit, and Green Goblin.  Have tossed one champ level of the latter three.

The reason why I wouldn't do the just champ Gambit move is because the developers have said they are going to nerf him.  Seeing how they gutted the 3* and OML I would be weary about champing him and ending up in the OP's exact position.  Plus I agree with this:

Dormammu said:

I've said it a thousand times: the 4-star tier is MPQ's sweet spot. It offers:

1) The largest pool of characters and strategies
2) Max-champed 3-stars are still viable to use, increasing your pool
3) Champed 5-stars are rarely seen in PvP
4) Under-covered 5-stars are everywhere in PvP and easy fodder
5) Gambit doesn't exist

We still have our problems, like Grocket/Gamora/Medusa occupying 4 out of 5 nodes in the simulator, but at least they're easy to counter compared to the Gambit meta.

I think your original plan to transition is a good one.  For me, I want to get Jess max-covered and then level all my 5s evenly over time once I finish off the four-tier and have a good head start on the 3-tier.

Jwallyr

PVP is broken. MMR is only one part of the issue. *shrug*

tiomono

@Daredevil217

Where did the devs say they would nerf gambit?

animaniactoo

Quebbster said:

Also, there is no reason whatsoever to choose a lower SCL in SHIELD simulator as your chosen SCL does not affect your matchmaking - it only affects what rewards you fight for and against who. Since Simulator only has progression rewards, you are only getting less rewards choosing a lower SCL without any benefit.

This is one of the most broken non-sensical parts of PVP to me. What is the point of having to choose an SCL if it does little to nothing to affect your actual opposition?

Dormammu

animaniactoo said:
This is one of the most broken non-sensical parts of PVP to me. What is the point of having to choose an SCL if it does little to nothing to affect your actual opposition?

In theory it's supposed to even out placement, or at least have you competing for placement against players who have similar rosters. It also affects placement rewards. Neat theory, but in practice I found more 5-star players taking top placements in SCL7 than I do SCL9.

Just pick the highest SCL you're able in PvP, there's absolutely no benefit to doing otherwise.

Straycat

Palookaville said:

How can I use my 4* characters on a regular basis?

Just play them? You have to have a 5* to tank but you can still use 4*s.  Boosted 4*s can mostly hang with 5*s. I know we dream of a utopia where we use our entire roster, but even in 4* land you can only use the boosted list. Unboosted 4*s generally aren't strong enough to compete and using them paints a big target on you.
In sim I actually think you could use Nico and Yondu, since they have true heals and share some colors with OML. But Lockjaw will only be useful if Thor was your only other 4*. 
I wouldn't do anything too drastic to try and manipulate scaling. Could do more harm than good, especially if they make some changes in the future.

Daredevil217

tiomono said:

@Daredevil217

Where did the devs say they would nerf gambit?

Will said:

“Trying to narrow the gap between the strongest character and the rest of the pack while keeping the strongest character the strongest is what we attempted to do with the recent Gambit rebalance, and that didn't successfully shake up strategy.”

Brigby said:

“It's certainly apparent to us that Gambit (Classic)'s strength is one that's a hot-topic issue for players, and I can understand why seeing these sparse season updates can be frustrating. While I don't have any details to provide just yet, what I can say though is that it's reasonable to assume that development time usually devoted to working on season updates (character buffs, system reboot, etc etc.) has been allocated towards a different aspect of the game. Thank you all for being so patient.”

While not 100% confirmation I can’t read those and not think a big nerf is coming 

Arphaxad

They need a SCL that doesn't allow 5 stars in PvP. Since champing Doc Oc, my first 5 star champ, I haven't played PvP. It's nothing but a health pack drain now with little to no variety.