Gambit doesn't need to be nerfed; the other 5*s need to be fixed.

JSP869

OJSP said:

JSP869 said:

@Pants1000 I see 400+ Gambits, and others, but with my own Gambit being only 390 and still needing 4 more covers, I'm not going to take on champ'd 5*s, so I skip them and continue looking for targets I know I have a fighting chance against.

I’ve been wondering which one is you in that alliance, with you saying you have a lvl 390 Gambit, I found your roster. You won’t see championed 5*s until you break MMR, very rarely before. Your Versus experience is totally different to someone with championed 5*s.

I see the 400+ level and nope out of those matches, but it looks like they're not Champions until they're 450+. Of course they could still be fully covered, I just not champed. I'll have to pay closer attention to the actual level of the next 400+s I see. Still not going to take them on of course. I don't mind a challenge, but a match I can't actually win is not challenging.

OneLastGambit

Hola, 

I weighed in on the original thread about this and Sat in the don't nerf camp. I gave rational arguments about why he didn't need it which sounded very similar to the arguments in this thread. 

After a couple of seasons extended play with him I have changed my mind and will admit that I was wrong. For pve it's completely irrelevant he's a massive massive help and pretty much ensures I can speed clear on cl9 with no need for even one health pack. 

In PvP however.... If you don't have gambit then you will lose. His red gen is silly and at the same time his drain prevents your opponent from firing anything. His purples invalidates every other character power in the 5* tier which creates a CD or special. So that Hawkeye I spent ages building because I'm a big fan is completely useless. Even when paired with coulson for speed because gambit can even overwrite his fortified tiles. 

In PvP gambit is a real problem because he prevents the use of so many characters which are fun and really reduces your roster to paperweights

Like I said in pve there's no complaints because he makes the game ridiculously easy. But he destroys pvp. 

I started in the don't nerf camp but I have now pitched my tent in the nerf camp. 

Take away his red gen, and ap drain and make purple overwrite attack,protect and strike instead everything and he will be fine. Very usable without invalidating everyone else.

hopper1979

Here is the argument for the nurf and not the buff.  Right now with the exception of Gambit a boosted 4 team can beat a 5 team it is difficult but not impossible .  A maxed 5 team can still get beaten by a maxed gambit with no other 5's.  If you boost the 5's so no 4 star teams can win anymore you have destroyed pvp or you need to buff all the 4's as well and so on and so on.  If you fix/nurf Gambit so he is beatable under normal conditions than problem solved.  One fix vs a total overhall that is why they will eventually nurf.  Now having said that it sucks for those of you who have him completely covered, I still do not know how they missed how good he was before releasing him.  

Either way something has to be done, I play enough pvp to get the 2000 points in the simulator and 4000 points for the season.  I used to get 7500 points in a season, pvp is no fun anymore.  He is broken and having a negative impact on the game at this point.  There has been power creep in the 5's for a long time but he broke the mold. 

Hadronic

hopper1979 said:

I still do not know how they missed how good he was before releasing him.  

It was intentional and planned cause capitalism

ZeroKarma

Hadronic said:

hopper1979 said:

I still do not know how they missed how good he was before releasing him.  

It was intentional and planned cause capitalism

He was released because everyone voted for the character and he was made this powerful so that people would stop hoarding everything after Ock and Starlord were in tokens. 

hopper1979

I just don't think he was play tested enough, I'm not that cynical to buy the other theories

Straycat

This idea is fundamentally wrong. Instead of balancing the character we should unbalance all of them? Thats not how it works. 
How would you buff all the rest? Give them all a passive that fuels there own AP with no conditions? That would break everything. That AP gen mechanic can work for a character if its balanced out by something, i.e. nerf Gambit. They should still buff the bad ones, but leaving Gambit as he is would be a mistake.

JSP869

hopper1979 said:

I just don't think he was play tested enough, I'm not that cynical to buy the other theories

I have to agree with this. The number of obvious bugs that make it to 'live' tells me they're either not doing enough testing, or that their release strategy is to just go live, regardless of bugs and/or how broken a character may be, and just add those bugs to the "To Do" list.

I think I'd like to be a play tester because I'd like to think it would mean I'd have a 'test account' (separate from my own account, of course) with maxed, fully covered versions of every character in the game, and full access to every PvE event including sub-events at all times. How else would you be able to test the proposed changes to a character and how it may impact the upcoming event without full access to every character in the game. Except I'm also a bit of a perfectionist (which is not a good trait to have when you can't live up to your own high standards), so it would also greatly annoy me if I was finding and reporting bugs then seeing those same bugs not only make it to live but go unfixed for years.

Look at how long we've had the "passive ability/wave node" bug, where any passive ability that procs from anything you do, whether it's match green (Daken), match 4 (Mockingbird, Loki, etc.), match  5 (Jean Grey), deal a certain amount of damage (Storm, Captain Marvel, Hulk, Deadpool, etc.) will proc if you KO the mob in the wave node immediately preceding the character with that power. This bug has been around for a long, long time, and they still haven't fixed it. This bug annoys me as a player, it would annoy me even more if I was a bug tester, and even more so if I was the one that found it and first reported it.

cschwinge

Does the "slowness" of Gambit really matter with all of the suppression he has?

I'd say that making his purple not overwrite countdown tiles isn't enough.

Adding an "AP held" requirement to the AP drain from the enemy would keep it from killing the early game. IE: At the start of the turn, gain 2 Red AP and 2 Purple AP. If you have more than 8 Red or Purple AP, destroy 2 enemy AP from a random color. If you have more than 8 Red or Purple AP, allies cannot fire abilities of that color.

A 6 AP swing with no conditions is just too powerful

ZeroKarma

cschwinge said:

Does the "slowness" of Gambit really matter with all of the suppression he has?

I'd say that making his purple not overwrite countdown tiles isn't enough.

Adding an "AP held" requirement to the AP drain from the enemy would keep it from killing the early game. IE: At the start of the turn, gain 2 Red AP and 2 Purple AP. If you have more than 8 Red or Purple AP, destroy 2 enemy AP from a random color. If you have more than 8 Red or Purple AP, allies cannot fire abilities of that color.

A 6 AP swing with no conditions is just too powerful

He needs a drawback. You can put black at 5 BUT... you can’t have purple remove CD’s or red doesn’t generate AP from destroyed tiles. 

As as it is now, there are no drawbacks to his use and he is therefore an auto-add. 

entrailbucket

Everybody who disagreed vehemently with me back in November or whatever and has since changed their mind...I will accept flowers and fruit baskets as apology gifts.

Gambit needs a huge nerf just to bring him in line with the rest of the top-tier 5*s.  It was obvious then and it's obvious now.  I don't know why nothing was done about it back then, and if they had acted quickly it wouldn't have become such a big problem, but hopefully they'll do something about it soon.

ViralCore

Gambit needs to be nerfed! Slowing him down isn't a nerf when he is actually better now that he destroys ap.  Anybody with a full roster realizes now that he makes every other character useless. The best PVPs for the past few seasons have been the 3* Gambit ones, you could use any 5* combo and it showed that the rest are balanced.

j0nats

evryone has good points.  however you guys failed to consider what outright nerfing gambit would do to those who did get him, and is their only option at the moment.

it is unfair to discount their effort/monie to get Gambit.  Sure nerf/rework gambit.  but give these people time to enjoy their new toy; or be able to save enuf for a new meta character after gambit

entrailbucket

j0nats said:

evryone has good points.  however you guys failed to consider what outright nerfing gambit would do to those who did get him, and is their only option at the moment.

it is unfair to discount their effort/monie to get Gambit.  Sure nerf/rework gambit.  but give these people time to enjoy their new toy; or be able to save enuf for a new meta character after gambit

People who only have Gambit knew he was overpowered, and knew that this game has a history of extreme nerfs to overpowered characters.  They have already had 6 months to enjoy their toy, they can sell him for 50¢ on the dollar when he's made useless and try to chase whatever the next copycat team is (5* Thor + someone, I assume).

AlexNapalm

Whatever happens to Gambit, I'm pretty sure he won't be made useless.