Changing Meta, ft. Main Event Hulk

DrDevilDinosaur
DrDevilDinosaur Posts: 436 Mover and Shaker
in MPQ General Discussion

I've seen it suggested that Main Event Hulk could represent an attempt by the developers to change the current 4* meta, with particular regard to the prevalence of Grocket. Essentially the line of thought is that Grand Entrance could potentially remove the Strike tiles. That's... well, that's it. Grocket's role in the current meta is basically to generate a bunch of Strike tiles at the start of the match and Hulk destroys a bunch of tiles at the start of the match. I think that the idea the Hulk was meant to counter Grocket is sound, but I also think that implementation of Grand Entrance that we have doesn't really counter Welcome to the Team. Also, in my opinion, Grocket's not the core of this team (it's Medusa), which is another reason why Grand Entrance won't disrupt the meta.

The team that I'm alluding to as top of the current meta is, of course, Grocket/Gamora/Medusa. It's fast and it's virtually "AI-proof" since it doesn't really rely on an Active abilities. If Grocket just straight up didn't exist, you could achieve very similar results with Cloak&Dagger/Gamora/Medusa. If I was going to disrupt the meta, I'd work on something to counter Medusa.

I've got a few ideas, but I want to bring this back to Hulk. Let's assume that the meta shifts anyway and take a look at the most recent additions - Rogue, Hulk, Nightcrawler. Each of them have at least one fairly expensive ability which I think could be indicative of a slower meta (which the developers have wanted for a while; and yes, points based progression requires fast teams, but also consider that these characters would have been developed alongside the planned swap to win based PvP). Additionally, Rogue & Hulk have larger than average health pools, Rogue & Nightcrawler have damage mitigation, and Hulk has his burst healing. All of these are factors for slowing down matches.

I don't think Hulk heralds the end of the Grocket/Gamora/Medusa meta, however I think he could very easily rise to prominence if there's a new character released soon which breaks up that team.

Comments

  • Sandmaker
    Sandmaker Posts: 208 Tile Toppler
    The problem is that, in the history of this game, a meta has never been broken up by the introduction of a counter character. The only thing that's ever changed the meta is power creep from new characters or nerfs to an OP character.  
  • DyingLegend
    DyingLegend Posts: 1,203 Chairperson of the Boards
    Thing/Vulture/Iceman  or really any team with Thing in it disrupts that team. As far as I'm concerned everyone can keep using the meta team. 
  • STOPTHIS
    STOPTHIS Posts: 781 Critical Contributor
    DyingLegend said:
    Thing/Vulture/Iceman  or really any team with Thing in it disrupts that team. As far as I'm concerned everyone can keep using the meta team. 
    Grocket/Carol at 5/5/3/Deadpool at 5/5/3. Potentially health pack heavy (but what isn't against this team?), but you'll knock out the team in 4-5 turns without needing to fire a power.

    As for the topic at hand, MEHulk isn't going to be changing any meta with his super expensive powers. Though I do love his purple.
  • JHawkInc
    JHawkInc Posts: 2,605 Chairperson of the Boards
    TME Hulk has three powers that benefit from having strikes on the board. If anything, he encourages the R&G/Guardian meta.
  • DyingLegend
    DyingLegend Posts: 1,203 Chairperson of the Boards
    STOPTHIS said:
    DyingLegend said:
    Thing/Vulture/Iceman  or really any team with Thing in it disrupts that team. As far as I'm concerned everyone can keep using the meta team. 
    Grocket/Carol at 5/5/3/Deadpool at 5/5/3. Potentially health pack heavy (but what isn't against this team?), but you'll knock out the team in 4-5 turns without needing to fire a power.

    As for the topic at hand, MEHulk isn't going to be changing any meta with his super expensive powers. Though I do love his purple.


    The first move the enemy team makes will cause thing to make his 5 defense tiles at 330 I think which negates all the damage allowing you to clear out the strike tiles. Once vulture gets airborne, this charges icemans blue so you can stun Medusa and the rest if team. Vulture will constantly be in the air avoiding gamora'stun and other damage. It's my goto team for fighting the meta
  • STOPTHIS
    STOPTHIS Posts: 781 Critical Contributor
    DyingLegend said:
    STOPTHIS said:
    DyingLegend said:
    Thing/Vulture/Iceman  or really any team with Thing in it disrupts that team. As far as I'm concerned everyone can keep using the meta team. 
    Grocket/Carol at 5/5/3/Deadpool at 5/5/3. Potentially health pack heavy (but what isn't against this team?), but you'll knock out the team in 4-5 turns without needing to fire a power.

    As for the topic at hand, MEHulk isn't going to be changing any meta with his super expensive powers. Though I do love his purple.


    The first move the enemy team makes will cause thing to make his 5 defense tiles at 330 I think which negates all the damage allowing you to clear out the strike tiles. Once vulture gets airborne, this charges icemans blue so you can stun Medusa and the rest if team. Vulture will constantly be in the air avoiding gamora'stun and other damage. It's my goto team for fighting the meta
    It's a good team. I wasn't saying it wasn't. Just throwing out other ways to effectively take out the ever present Gamora, Grocket, Medusa. They're not hard to beat.
  • AXP_isme
    AXP_isme Posts: 809 Critical Contributor
    I don’t see MEHulk as a hard counter to that team in any way. You may get lucky but it’s totally unreliable. A hard counter would produce shields, or remove strikes or other special tiles, at the beginning of the round or perhaps nullify damage from the strikes (a la BSS). Besides which the devs always have massively overvalued random, or semi-random, tile destruction. 

    Perhaps my tinfoil hat is on crooked but I’m more concerned that the devs intention may be to make longer matches and more of them. This game is already a big enough time sink. Pretty soon there won’t be enough hours in the day. 
  • D4Ni13
    D4Ni13 Posts: 745 Critical Contributor
    I think Main Event Hulk might actually be the first step for a new combo team, and that he would work very well with some future characters. But as he is now, he definitely does not change anything. He is easily counterable and does not do that much to change something in the current meta. His abilities are expensive and so he is very slow. Personally I don't see either encourage or discourage Grockt/Gamora/Medusa usage. 
  • The rockett
    The rockett Posts: 2,016 Chairperson of the Boards
    Meh purple is great but that's about it.  
  • The rockett
    The rockett Posts: 2,016 Chairperson of the Boards
    OJSP said:
    The rockett said:
    Meh purple is great but that's about it.  
    Not when it makes 5 critical tiles and left 2 or 4 on the board..
    Ok. You got me.  LOL
  • Avalanche Kincaid
    Avalanche Kincaid Posts: 83 Match Maker
    Has no one thought that main event hulk acronym is meh?  Meh describes him perfectly
  • beyonderbub
    beyonderbub Posts: 661 Critical Contributor
    My biggest gripe about MEH Hulk in his PVP event: I know this may be confirmation bias but it seems like the AI passive always makes a helpful match for the enemy team but always makes an ineffective switch for my team
  • aa25
    aa25 Posts: 348 Mover and Shaker
    Meh is a big mess in my opinion. He is not going to open a new meta or make a change meta by himself.

    He is a bit niche with his passive that keeps slightly changing the board though. I found it's a bit irritating when you try to control the board.

    Another interesting part of him is the random ap generation of his yellow. If you manage to fire his yellow, he can potentially make a lot of ap for you. But again, for 12 ap, I would rather spend it on other powers that are more definitive.
  • White_Deth
    White_Deth Posts: 63 Match Maker
    When i first saw his power set i wrongly read his passive green as destroying a number of tiles every turn as a passive. Unfortuantely that is not the case. If however it was hed be a great counter to all tile generators but i guess it would be op....maybe. id love it though, board shake evedy turn akin to agen venom without the health or move loss and no ap drain :D
  • BoyWonder1914
    BoyWonder1914 Posts: 884 Critical Contributor
    I'm moreso frustrated that they've missed the mark yet again with Bruce Banner. Someone said this in another thread, 

    "The best Hulk in the game isn't even green, and the 2nd best Hulk isn't even Banner!"

    Random board shake/tile destruction is a double-edged sword. Yeah he can add match damage and cascades to your special tile producers, but he can just as easily match your own friendly tiles. 
    His purple has nice base damage and it's cool that he produce critical tiles, but not being able to choose where they end up can very easily lead to your opponent getting to have their way with them. It's also pretty frickin expensive. 
    His yellow is cool and all, but the randomness of it ultimately makes it less reliable than you'd like. 

    Not much about this skill set really screams "Hulk" to me. And now that this is the 3rd iteration of the Banner-Hulk, giving us now 6 in the game (including Red and She-Hulk), I doubt they're eager to try again soon. Hopefully he'll get a buff of some kind. 
  • DyingLegend
    DyingLegend Posts: 1,203 Chairperson of the Boards
    Personally i dont like the autoboard matches and instant shake up. Nothing worse then seeing a five combo ready to go only for the AI to mess it up...

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