Do something, anything to fix clearance level sniping.

Wumpushunter

Right now in CL6 there are 7 people in the top 10 with multiple leveled 5 stars. Because they cant compete in their own levels they drop down and steal rewards from people playing in the right CL. If your reading suggestions, do something.  There have been a half dozen suggestions to fix the problem over the 150 days or so I have been playing my favorite is the CLs you cant use certain characters. In CL 6 for example 5 stars and champed 4 stars would be locked out.

Bowgentle

You know that currently they're playing against overscaled enemies?
So they don't have any advantage over you.
The reason you see them on top of your bracket is because they know how to play PVE.
They would be there also if you lock out their 5s and 4s.

MarkersMake

Uh... 

Clearing time for 5* rosters is significantly lower than for 3* or (usually) 4* rosters, even after you factor in 5* scaling. So it's not terribly accurate to say they have no advantage over the OP. 

And no, it's not just "they know how to play PVE" better. 

Bowgentle

MarkersMake said:

Uh... 

Clearing time for 5* rosters is significantly lower than for 3* or (usually) 4* rosters, even after you factor in 5* scaling. So it's not terribly accurate to say they have no advantage over the OP. 

And no, it's not just "they know how to play PVE" better. 

No it's not.
A 4* softcapped roster can easily grind circles around me, especially when his boosted Rulk one-shots everything.

DarthDeVo

Bowgentle said:

You know that currently they're playing against overscaled enemies?
So they don't have any advantage over you.
The reason you see them on top of your bracket is because they know how to play PVE.
They would be there also if you lock out their 5s and 4s.

 Maybe, but they also likely have both a broader and deeper roster that can allow them to overcome the scaling disparities. But probably the biggest advantage is having 4* Thor already for the essential node points. 

If I had to wager, I'd bet most players who actually belong in SCL 6 lack that character on their roster. To my knowledge, this is the first time she's been offered since vaulting began, so it's likely the newer players naturally in SCL 6 don't have her rostered. And is she even a progression reward in SCL 6? If not, players with her on their roster at that level will have a clear advantage over those who don't all event long. 

broll

The fix is wider gaps in rewards.  It's been said over and over.

Wumpushunter

7 of 7 with five stars doing perfect 4 node clears faster than any one else is not because they are better at PVE. And it seems vaguely insulting.

DarthDeVo

Bowgentle said:

MarkersMake said:

Uh... 

Clearing time for 5* rosters is significantly lower than for 3* or (usually) 4* rosters, even after you factor in 5* scaling. So it's not terribly accurate to say they have no advantage over the OP. 

And no, it's not just "they know how to play PVE" better. 

No it's not.
A 4* softcapped roster can easily grind circles around me, especially when his boosted Rulk one-shots everything.

Also, how many Rulks, champed or otherwise, do you think  are on the rosters of those who actually belong in SCL 6? Yeah, 5* rosters have higher scaling, but they also likely have some tools (like champed and boosted Rulk, BP+Thano5) to overcome that deficit. 

I'm not gonna lie, when I glanced at the rewards and saw that T10 in SCL 6 gets one cover of each color for Vulture, same as SCL 7 and 8, I was tempted. But, I consider that unfair/unsportsmanlike to those in SCL 6. Same reason I try to avoid triple or even double tapping someone in PvP. I'll typically only do it if I'm in queue purgatory and as a last resort. And as I mentioned earlier, I don't think there's the blue 4* Thor in progression, which I need. 

Bowgentle

DarthDeVo said:

Bowgentle said:

MarkersMake said:

Uh... 

Clearing time for 5* rosters is significantly lower than for 3* or (usually) 4* rosters, even after you factor in 5* scaling. So it's not terribly accurate to say they have no advantage over the OP. 

And no, it's not just "they know how to play PVE" better. 

No it's not.
A 4* softcapped roster can easily grind circles around me, especially when his boosted Rulk one-shots everything.

Also, how many Rulks, champed or otherwise, do you think  are on the rosters of those who actually belong in SCL 6? Yeah, 5* rosters have higher scaling, but they also likely have some tools (like champed and boosted Rulk, BP+Thano5) to overcome that deficit. 

I'm not gonna lie, when I glanced at the rewards and saw that T10 in SCL 6 gets one cover of each color for Vulture, same as SCL 7 and 8, I was tempted. But, I consider that unfair/unsportsmanlike to those in SCL 6. Same reason I try to avoid triple or even double tapping someone in PvP. I'll typically only do it if I'm in queue purgatory and as a last resort. And as I mentioned earlier, I don't think there's the blue 4* Thor in progression, which I need. 

Sadly, boosted Rulk does nothing against 5* scaling.
Yes, mine does 28K with 18 green, but the 451 Venom I'm up against has 66k health.
BP/Thanos? 15K court death against those enemies isn't going to do wonders, either.

Seriously, don't talk about 5* scaling unless you have first hand experience with it.

FokaiHI

I just champed my second 5* and seeing KP and Sentry at 50k health was kind of shocking in DP vs MPQ. I don't think the clear times on the harder nodes are any faster. Let alone the fact that I am only 2 deep at 450 and Thano5 at 420. I use way more health packs now than my 4* roster ever did. With 30+ champed 4*s, I can alternate characters without using to many packs. I won't sandbag below SCL8, but the devs should not allow choosing SCLs. I think your roster should automatically slit you in. 

DarthDeVo

Bowgentle said:

DarthDeVo said: 

Bowgentle said:

MarkersMake said:

Uh... 

Clearing time for 5* rosters is significantly lower than for 3* or (usually) 4* rosters, even after you factor in 5* scaling. So it's not terribly accurate to say they have no advantage over the OP. 

And no, it's not just "they know how to play PVE" better. 

No it's not.
A 4* softcapped roster can easily grind circles around me, especially when his boosted Rulk one-shots everything.

Also, how many Rulks, champed or otherwise, do you think  are on the rosters of those who actually belong in SCL 6? Yeah, 5* rosters have higher scaling, but they also likely have some tools (like champed and boosted Rulk, BP+Thano5) to overcome that deficit. 

I'm not gonna lie, when I glanced at the rewards and saw that T10 in SCL 6 gets one cover of each color for Vulture, same as SCL 7 and 8, I was tempted. But, I consider that unfair/unsportsmanlike to those in SCL 6. Same reason I try to avoid triple or even double tapping someone in PvP. I'll typically only do it if I'm in queue purgatory and as a last resort. And as I mentioned earlier, I don't think there's the blue 4* Thor in progression, which I need. 

Sadly, boosted Rulk does nothing against 5* scaling.
Yes, mine does 28K with 18 green, but the 451 Venom I'm up against has 66k health.
BP/Thanos? 15K court death against those enemies isn't going to do wonders, either.

Seriously, don't talk about 5* scaling unless you have first hand experience with it.

Fair enough. You are right, it isn't something I've dealt with.

I'm gonna guess that most of the rosters that naturally belong in SCL 6 are 3* rosters, with gaps in their roster that don't allow for as efficient clears as a more developed roster.

Could a 4* roster outflank you? Sure. But a roster with no useable 4*s when you have all the boosted ones champed; a roster with an incomplete set of 3*s, with a handful of champs that may or may not be boosted/useful?

All I'm suggesting is that the breadth and depth of a vet roster can still trump a newbie roster, despite scaling, and make enough of a difference for placement. 

But I will concede, I have no experience with 5* scaling, and I'm making a lot of assumptions when it comes to the kind of roster that naturally belongs in SCL 6. The average SCL 6 roster could be more developed than I think. 

I just don't think OP's concerns should be so abruptly dismissed. It's got to be frustrating to be trying to advance your roster and vets swoop in and suck up all the good rewards for the event. But, as @broll alluded to, the incentives to play in 7 or 8 aren't enough to outweigh playing in 6, and that is probably what should be fixed. 

Bowgentle

DarthDeVo said:

Bowgentle said:

DarthDeVo said: 

Bowgentle said:

MarkersMake said:

Uh... 

Clearing time for 5* rosters is significantly lower than for 3* or (usually) 4* rosters, even after you factor in 5* scaling. So it's not terribly accurate to say they have no advantage over the OP. 

And no, it's not just "they know how to play PVE" better. 

No it's not.
A 4* softcapped roster can easily grind circles around me, especially when his boosted Rulk one-shots everything.

Also, how many Rulks, champed or otherwise, do you think  are on the rosters of those who actually belong in SCL 6? Yeah, 5* rosters have higher scaling, but they also likely have some tools (like champed and boosted Rulk, BP+Thano5) to overcome that deficit. 

I'm not gonna lie, when I glanced at the rewards and saw that T10 in SCL 6 gets one cover of each color for Vulture, same as SCL 7 and 8, I was tempted. But, I consider that unfair/unsportsmanlike to those in SCL 6. Same reason I try to avoid triple or even double tapping someone in PvP. I'll typically only do it if I'm in queue purgatory and as a last resort. And as I mentioned earlier, I don't think there's the blue 4* Thor in progression, which I need. 

Sadly, boosted Rulk does nothing against 5* scaling.
Yes, mine does 28K with 18 green, but the 451 Venom I'm up against has 66k health.
BP/Thanos? 15K court death against those enemies isn't going to do wonders, either.

Seriously, don't talk about 5* scaling unless you have first hand experience with it.

Fair enough. You are right, it isn't something I've dealt with.

I'm gonna guess that most of the rosters that naturally belong in SCL 6 are 3* rosters, with gaps in their roster that don't allow for as efficient clears as a more developed roster.

Could a 4* roster outflank you? Sure. But a roster with no useable 4*s when you have all the boosted ones champed; a roster with an incomplete set of 3*s, with a handful of champs that may or may not be boosted/useful?

All I'm suggesting is that the breadth and depth of a vet roster can still trump a newbie roster, despite scaling, and make enough of a difference for placement. 

But I will concede, I have no experience with 5* scaling, and I'm making lot of assumptions when it comes to the kind of roster that naturally belongs in SCL 6. The average SCL 6 roster could be more developed than I think. 

I just don't think OP's concerns should be so abruptly dismissed. It's got to be frustrating to be trying to advance your roster and vets swoop in and suck up all the good rewards for the event. But, as @broll alluded to, the incentives to play in 7 or 8 aren't enough to outweigh playing in 6, and that is probably what should be fixed. 

Oh, OP's concerns are totally valid - once we finally get CL-based fixed levels.
Which should have happened weeks ago.

DarthDeVo

I'll be honest, if/when they switch to SCL-based scaling they DON'T open SCL 9 and/or 10 or DON'T adjust the rewards significantly for SCL 8, I may be done. 

I already probably play too much as it is, but I feel it's somewhat justified because I think I do well enough in PvE placement in SCL 7 for the amount I play. 

If it suddenly gets way easier for 5* champ rosters to take all the placement rewards in SCL 7 because there's nothing worth playing for in SCL 8, and I'm left playing about the same amount as I used to but getting significantly less rewards and therefore not seeing as much progress, I'll likely not consider it worth my time to play anymore. 

MarkersMake

Bowgentle said:

MarkersMake said:

Uh... 

Clearing time for 5* rosters is significantly lower than for 3* or (usually) 4* rosters, even after you factor in 5* scaling. So it's not terribly accurate to say they have no advantage over the OP. 

And no, it's not just "they know how to play PVE" better. 

No it's not.
A 4* softcapped roster can easily grind circles around me, especially when his boosted Rulk one-shots everything.

I did say "usually" didn't I? 

Unless you're saying that *most* 4* players are dirty softcappers?

Sm0keyJ0e

5* scaling absolutely sucks. Just finished the Venom Bomb sub without any healthpacks left and I finished 8th behind (mostly) 4* rosters. I went as fast as I could. I am in cl8, mind you, but as someone else pointed out--it doesn't matter which clearance level you join. The current **** system scales your enemies to your MMR. Venom with 80k health and Moonstone with 78k health AND feeder goons is NOT FUN. The devs absolutely need to address this. They have ran tests, which by all accounts have been successful (if the rewards were proper)... they need to make these the new norm (fixed scaling).

I am not playing PVE competitively anymore. It's just not fun. It's tiring, feels like work, and frankly I'd rather have my teeth cleaned.

Wumpushunter

Even full 4 star champ rosters shouldn't be dipping down as far as 6.

TPF Alexis

Wumpushunter said:

Even full 4 star champ rosters shouldn't be dipping down as far as 6.

A big part of the problem is that most of the SCLs become pointless very quickly, with a big chunk of the Players clumped in situations where they have access to, and need the rewards from, SCL 7-8. If there are going to be only 8 SCLs, then 4* Players should be in SCL 6, with 5* transitioners in SCL7 and fully 5* Players in SCL8.

Wumpushunter

And 3 star players play where? CL 5 where the reward does absolutely nothing to progress anything but a 2 star farm?

TPF Alexis

The rewards need to be reworked, too, I'll give you that. Because as it stands, we've basically got everyone from high level 3* on up fighting it out over SCL7-8, and all the lower SCLs become basically irrelevant other than to snipers after a few months, maybe a year, tops.