What if we had a new kind of shield in PvP?

MarkersMake

DuckyV wrote:

If someone has to pay 300-500 in HP just to reach 900, then they aren't ready to hit 900.

So... Only champed 4* rosters are "ready" to win 4* covers? That's... interesting.

Because apparently it will take about 300-500 hp for a 3-4 transitioner who has every 3* but strange and Thanos champed to be able to hit 900.

How many fully covered 4*s do you think he *should* have before he's ready to win a 4* cover?

EDIT - just to be clear, I'm talking about this post (viewtopic.php?f=6&t=56602). Aesthetocyst laid out a cost of 750 or so, but let's say it'll only take half that.

acescracked

Why are you guys always trying to turn this game into candy crush?

Alot of players like the competition aspects of the game both in pve & PvP. You've got DDQ if you're a little frightened of conflict and competition. D3 should run gauntlet for you guys more often. Have fun with those last nodes that can only be beat with whales.

wirius

DuckyV wrote:

If someone has to pay 300-500 in HP just to reach 900, then they aren't ready to hit 900.

Another factor not considered in is how does this effect alliance scores? Is the person with this special shield included in alliance scores as well? If not, then why would their alliance want them on their team? They'd just be eating up a slot and not contributing. If they can contribute to the alliance's score, it becomes crazy unfair as they have free reign to score as much as they want since they aren't capable of being targeted.

Maybe your roster is very good. For those transitioning into the 4* with simply 3* champs, it can take quite a bit of shield hopping.

And no, this shield eliminates you from getting ranking rewards from pvp, and also any contribution to an alliance. There are plenty of alliances out there that do not compete in pvp, and would not be bothered by this. So again, if you like to be competitive, get in a competitive alliance, just like now. If not, this helps those that dislike being competitive.

More people playing, and paying, that do not affect the competitors in this game, seems like a pretty good thing for the health of the game as a whole.

fmftint

MarkersMake wrote:

DuckyV wrote:

If someone has to pay 300-500 in HP just to reach 900, then they aren't ready to hit 900.

So... Only champed 4* rosters are "ready" to win 4* covers? That's... interesting.

Because apparently it will take about 300-500 hp for a 3-4 transitioner who has every 3* but strange and Thanos champed to be able to hit 900.

How many fully covered 4*s do you think he *should* have before he's ready to win a 4* cover?

As has been said before, blame 10 @575. Unless it's a highly desired cover, a majority of 3-4 players just won't push on to 900

TheWerebison

acescracked wrote:

Why are you guys always trying to turn this game into candy crush?

Alot of players like the competition aspects of the game both in pve & PvP. You've got DDQ if you're a little frightened of conflict and competition. D3 should run gauntlet for you guys more often. Have fun with those last nodes that can only be beat with whales.

1) Not really a helpful post
2) Actually kinda trying to turn this game into Puzzle Quest. Perhaps you've heard of it, it came out long before Marvel Puzzle Quest, and was a strictly PvE game.

Also it had some modes which actually involved trying to solve a puzzle instead of just combat, and that was neat, too.

wirius

acescracked wrote:

Why are you guys always trying to turn this game into candy crush?

Alot of players like the competition aspects of the game both in pve & PvP. You've got DDQ if you're a little frightened of conflict and competition. D3 should run gauntlet for you guys more often. Have fun with those last nodes that can only be beat with whales.

By the tone of your post I suppose you find the idea threatening somehow? The shield should not affect competitive players in any way. Its not about fear about competition. There are times where it is difficult to time shield hops properly. Sometimes I just want to play the game on my free time, and not schedule being on at particular hours throughout the day.

Remember, the shield isn't free. Ideally it should be more expensive than an average shield hop expenditure, meaning you can make it a meaningful choice. If I have the time and the roster, I'll likely shield hop. But if I know I only have limited time to play, or don't have the correct roster this time, I might shell out some HP.

Its about having an extra option. Typically this is a good thing overall for players in a game. Don't worry, its not going to affect the competitors who have the time or passion for that side of the game.

MarkersMake

fmftint wrote:

As has been said before, blame 10 @575. Unless it's a highly desired cover, a majority of 3-4 players just won't push on to 900

I think you might have your cause and effect backwards.

TheWerebison

Well, this has been moved to the Suggestions forum, so we can all let our discussion die in obscurity now. XD

MarkersMake

aesthetocyst wrote:

In regards to a specific player's situation. And it was 900. Advised them to be prepared to spend up to 900hp to be sure of hitting 900 based on how they described their current circumstance.

But yes, most likely, said player should be able to do it cheaper, and with some practice, will be able to lower that probable cost a good deal.

Yeah, I skipped some steps there.

You said 900 hp to keep 900 points through event end. Take off 1 shield (75 or 150 hp) if he just wants to hit 900 points for the cover, and we get to 750 or 825 hp. Cut either of those in half due to practice/experience and we are smack dab in the middle of the 300-500 range.

Either way, ducky is pretty much saying that specific guy isn't ready to win a 4* cover yet. Which... I mean... Who is? You're only "ready" to win it if you don't need it anymore?

wirius

aesthetocyst wrote:

As for the OP, this is a terrible idea.

The reason 3* and below players have so much trouble hitting the progressions they want is because few are willing to shield, and far too many are playing indiscriminately. Through unthinking play, they are collectively conspiring against each other and themselves to hold each other back.

So you want to be visible but not lose points when hit. This is just another iteration on the "let's make shielded players visible" meme that's been trolled out many, many times, and is still just as unworkable.

Every player that can be qd but not debited will inflate the points in the slice. Scores overall would rise. To maintain distributions, the devs would have to in turn raise progressions, or alter the scoring mechanics again (back to a 50pt maximum?) to deflate scores. Result ... those buying these shields because they needs them have to work much harder to get where they are going even while using the shields. In fact, players who don't need the shields now have to work harder, too! Those who need these shields but are not buying them are now even farther from hitting those goals.

You've made PVP progression explicitly P2W for a large chunk of the playerbase. Progression, P2W! Of course placements are P2W, but progression? Criminy, well done.

Congrats, in an effort to get something for nothing, you broke a whole game mode for everybody.


If not prepared to do what it takes to get your roster to where you want it to go, then just make peace with that and move on.

I think you just contradicted yourself. You just mentioned that 3* players aren't willing to shield for progression, which is spending HP, which is paying to win for progression. So this already exists in the game. Most players need to shield to get progression points.

Also, if being visible is a problem, then we can have the players not visible except for retaliations. Either that or it shrinks the slice pool. I'm actually opening this up to discussion, and haven't stated it must be done a particular way. If you peruse my earlier posts, I suggest points from these shielded players could be worth half as much for example. I'm glad you're pointing out potential problems, do you think there are ways to fix this?

Also don't think about this as if EVERYONE is going to use the shield. If the shields are around 600hp or higher, I doubt more than a low percentage will spend the HP. D3 can use this pricing tool to ensure only a certain percentage actually use the shield. Don't forget, using the shield takes you out of the progression ranking for both you and your alliance as well. This is mostly a change for more causal or time restricted players, not a person like yourself. As people develop their roster, they'll still come wanting to know how to do PvP cheaper. The competitive game will continue.

Crowl

MarkersMake wrote:

fmftint wrote:

As has been said before, blame 10 @575. Unless it's a highly desired cover, a majority of 3-4 players just won't push on to 900

I think you might have your cause and effect backwards.

You would think that a far more likely scenario would be that more people stop at 575 because it is an achievable target for people with lesser rosters who might have otherwise only gone for 300 and and a couple of tokens in the past because they knew that the 3* and 4* covers were beyond them.

The idea that 575 should be blamed for anything seems a curious suggestion to me, you would think that it would serve as a good next step into pvp for people rather than anything detrimental.

Heartburn

DuckyV wrote:

If someone has to pay 300-500 in HP just to reach 900, then they aren't ready to hit 900.

Another factor not considered in is how does this effect alliance scores? Is the person with this special shield included in alliance scores as well? If not, then why would their alliance want them on their team? They'd just be eating up a slot and not contributing. If they can contribute to the alliance's score, it becomes crazy unfair as they have free reign to score as much as they want since they aren't capable of being targeted.

time is a factor, some people have the roster just not the time, this game is a complete time suck. Also, what defines "ready"? do you need to have the character maxed to earn this reward? should you? i think anyone with multiple maxed 3* should be able to easily earn a 4* reward and should be more along the lines of 700 pt, then 900, the last reward before you enter in the swarm never to be seen again. but that is just me, and how i think you should be able to progress your roster. anyways i stopped playing pvp mostly, with the occasional season to get 4000. there are much funner games out there to waste so much of my free time on this.

lol i would pay like 500 hp each to get a story mode where it was one and done with no ranking, or maybe make it a VIP benefit.