Consensus on Star Lord rework

Vhailorx

I am starting to hear enough chatter here on the boards and via my alliance family about star lord to think that his rework is close to IM40 levels of improvement. he seems to be a part of so many team suggestions and just generally has a significant amount of buzz.

Is he now a top flight support character? Is he even better? PVE only? It seems like his passive would have some defensive value in PVP since it will force a human player to play differently, a la JG's passive.

Is this the best 4* rework since September 2014 when Xforce Wolverine was turned into the best character in the game?

Also, if true, then I think it reinforces the idea that demi should REALLY consider paying some veterans consulting fees to pick their brains every once in a while. We have been saying that SL's yellow should be passive literally since early 2015 when he was released!

mpqr7

I think the new SL is wonderful.

I have to say, I really enjoy the new reworks. IW is super fun, as is Cho. The reworks have made the characters a lot of fun to play with, and they are a lot more useful.

I think the key to the reworks is:

1) Make powers easier to use. This could be by making them passive, lowering the AP cost or removing barriers that prevent them from working.

2) Get rid of defense.. improve offense!

tiles are cool for match damage from 4*s or below, but they don't protect against powers or 5* match damage, so it's fine to add them for one move, but the rest of the moves are better with offensive improvements such as or more damage.

That's what they did with those heroes, and it worked well!

thisone

Brilliant against goons in pve. Probably superior to im40. Especially when you have goons sticking cd on yellow tiles.

In pvp I'd rather have im40 feeding peggy/ice/thor if I want to finish a fight quick.

I love his red. Easy to get 6 cd out and hit for max damage. Purple ain't too shabby either very useful in certain situations. I have definitely used 5/5/3 and 3/5/5 to good effect. I

Overall yes he's better than im40. Best rework? So far. Yes.

I'd add the starlord/im40/strange team is pretty close to perfect for pve. Although sometimes against goons you run out of yellow tiles for recharge

MPQ_Daywalker

I use my championed Star-Lord every day in nearly every PVE battle. He's especially useful against goons since you know your power costs will be reduced in 2 to 3 turns when a goon's countdown tile gets created. I bring along whoever is boosted and enjoy their powers at lower AP costs. I regularly use his red as well (I always run him at 3/5/5) and generally bring along a better/cheaper purple user. If you bring anyone else who creates countdowns (XFDP, IM40, etc.) those are great to fire off right before his red power as well. He doesn't replace IM40 for AP generation, since the AP he generates is random, but they're actually a fun pair to use (I used IM40, SL and Teen Jean on many nodes in Hearts of Darkness recently).

In PVP I use him only if the opposing team has someone with a cheap, spammable power. Otherwise it takes too long for his passive to get activated, and I find myself just leaving matches for the enemy to make so they can fire off a power -- and that's a really weird tactic. I tend to use him much more in SHIELD Simulator than regular PVP, since I can build a team around him a bit more.

mega ghost

I love the reworked Star-Lord, whereas the old version was so bad that getting his covers made me actually grow a slight distaste for the character outside of the game itself. I just posted this in another thread:

mega ghost wrote:

My new go-to team is Jean Grey, Kingpin, and Star-Lord. Kingpin and Star-Lord alone are a devastating pair when facing off against goons as Kingpin's yellow makes Star-Lord's red a cheap one-hit kill machine in most situations, and Star-Lord's yellow passive fires almost every turn and makes getting everyone's attacks out easy. That includes Jean Grey's purple and green, her purple which of course also eliminates enemy countdowns, strikes, etc.

Vhailorx

thisone wrote:

Overall yes he's better than im40. Best rework? So far. Yes.

Just to quibble a tiny bit. It may well be the best rework in a long time. But it's not the best ever. XFW's second(?) rework took him from a joke tier 4* to hands down the best character in the game by a long mile. New SL would have to be better than GG, IM46, and BB to match that rework!

Still, I will certainly dust mine off and add him to the "to champ" list now that I have him 13/13 (after sitting a 5/3/3 for months).

thanos8587

echoing the sentiments...if i see 2 or 3 goons, in comes the lord.

target nullifying 3 countdowns for only 8 purple almost eliminates the threat of high level muscles, silent strike jerks etc.

and oh yeah it does damage two turns later. and oh yeah theres that 2 cost reduction thing on just about all your other spells. really glad i have him champed. who would have thought that would ever be said. his matches against 350+ guys can be slow, but they go pretty smooth in most cases.

Fightmastermpq

He's good, but he accelerates 4* rosters much more than 5* rosters which sucks for PvE which is already unfavorable for 5*s. If his yellow boosted match damage by 20% I'd use him in almost every PvE match. The only advantage 5* rosters have is in match damage as their ability damage doesn't scale like 4*s do. So SL adding animation time to every match while only making abilities slightly more efficient is a net negative in 5* PvE compared to how much more powerful he is in getting 4* abilities off sooner.

GrimSkald

Vhailorx wrote:

thisone wrote:

Overall yes he's better than im40. Best rework? So far. Yes.

Just to quibble a tiny bit. It may well be the best rework in a long time. But it's not the best ever. XFW's second(?) rework took him from a joke tier 4* to hands down the best character in the game by a long mile. New SL would have to be better than GG, IM46, and BB to match that rework!

Still, I will certainly dust mine off and add him to the "to champ" list now that I have him 13/13 (after sitting a 5/3/3 for months).

I think that was X-Force's first rework. His original spec was ludicrously bad - they definitely had a different vision for 4*s originally. Since they had much more HP and match damage than other characters, their powers were much more expensive (you were expected to be able to gather more AP,) focusing on the long game rather than the short game. This was just the original build of X-Force and IW. But then they introduced Nick Fury and we all went "huh? That's... a lot better." Then they improved X-Force and introduced the original build of the Goddess, and suddenly no one else mattered.

Sadly, they were both nerfed into the mid-tier - not going to say they didn't deserve a nerf, but they could have stayed top tier with a little more care - so I'm not sure that buff actually counts. C'est la vie.

My own .02$ on Star Lord - he's awesome now. Great support character for whenever you fight goons or opponents with cheap powers. Bring your own cheap powers and watch Iceman stun or Nova send someone airborne for 4 AP... (Iceman/Nova/Star Lord is one of my favorite Enchilada teams.) I'd be hesitant to use him in PVP as he's not that hard to play against, but still, he's a great character for a number of uses.

Vhailorx

GrimSkald wrote:

I think that was X-Force's first rework. His original spec was ludicrously bad - they definitely had a different vision for 4*s originally. Since they had much more HP and match damage than other characters, their powers were much more expensive (you were expected to be able to gather more AP,) focusing on the long game rather than the short game. This was just the original build of X-Force and IW. But then they introduced Nick Fury and we all went "huh? That's... a lot better." Then they improved X-Force and introduced the original build of the Goddess, and suddenly no one else mattered.

Sadly, they were both nerfed into the mid-tier - not going to say they didn't deserve a nerf, but they could have stayed top tier with a little more care - so I'm not sure that buff actually counts. C'est la vie.

My own .02$ on Star Lord - he's awesome now. Great support character for whenever you fight goons or opponents with cheap powers. Bring your own cheap powers and watch Iceman stun or Nova send someone airborne for 4 AP... (Iceman/Nova/Star Lord is one of my favorite Enchilada teams.) I'd be hesitant to use him in PVP as he's not that hard to play against, but still, he's a great character for a number of uses.

I wasn't sure, but I thought he had been revised once in his red/yellow/green incarnation. But yeah, that version was comically bad. a 7-turn healing CD!? two 15ap powers! ridiculous!. Of course, his original green/black/yellow incarnation beastly! I still remember how much fun it was to play against anyone with green as strongest color. SS into multiple xforces!

And just to stay on topic: How 'bout that Star Lord?!

Straycat

He's great. He's my go to character for PVE. His yellow makes more sense as a passive. I never understood why it would reduce the cost of yellow powers when you have to use 7 yellow to activate it. And his red can do some good damage. PVP I would try to pair him with a tile creator.
Thematically he is improved too. His sucker punch makes sense, the more distractions the stronger it is. And its not a countdown, why would a surprise punch have a countdown timer? The ap defense was probably useful, but its no fun to have a countdown tile that you both want and don't want to resolve.
Before the change I would never use him. Even fully covered at a high level I had lots of trouble with his DDQ Clash. Now I can easily recommend championing him. His rework is better than IW but I use them together all the time now. So much board control for PVE especially. SL, IW, and Kingpin is a team I use a lot.

monsterjoe77

i use him in every pve now and just about every big enchilada. fun to use and very versatile. 355, 535 and 553 are all viable depending on teammates. before the rework, i turned so many covers of him into 1000 iso. he would probably be my highest level champion if the rework was done sooner. nice to have a usable and fun character. i hope the positive feedback on this and other characters (IW, Chulk, etc) helps encourage more rework on other characters.

Polares

I agree, Starlord is one of the best reworks ever. I still don't know why they made purple a bit worse after the rework (he was much worse than GSBW for Winfinite, so what was the point?), because I always like to have the option of creating match-5s when playing with 5s (well they probably did it for this reason ), but his red now is very good and his yellow is amazing, probably best passive in 3/4 land after Peggy's.

Fightmastermpq wrote:

He's good, but he accelerates 4* rosters much more than 5* rosters which sucks for PvE which is already unfavorable for 5*s. If his yellow boosted match damage by 20% I'd use him in almost every PvE match. The only advantage 5* rosters have is in match damage as their ability damage doesn't scale like 4*s do. So SL adding animation time to every match while only making abilities slightly more efficient is a net negative in 5* PvE compared to how much more powerful he is in getting 4* abilities off sooner.

Mmm I don't know if I agree with you. Being able to cast PH purple for 5 AP, that is BIG. If you get 15 purple you have basically won the match. And what about Spidey's blue for 4 AP, just 4 AP !!! Now with 12 AP you can fire it three times! SS red for 5, SS blue for 7, a 5/5/3 SS is basically immortal with Starlord at his side. It is a real pity he is team Cap and doesn't accelerate black (if he would accelerate IM46 red while being team IM or accelerate GG black then he would be even great with 5s).

I still use more Peggy than Starlord because she helps saving health packs A LOT, but when Starlord was buffed he was really great. I champed him without being 100% sure, but he really was a good decision.

Fightmastermpq

Polares wrote:

Fightmastermpq wrote:

He's good, but he accelerates 4* rosters much more than 5* rosters which sucks for PvE which is already unfavorable for 5*s. If his yellow boosted match damage by 20% I'd use him in almost every PvE match. The only advantage 5* rosters have is in match damage as their ability damage doesn't scale like 4*s do. So SL adding animation time to every match while only making abilities slightly more efficient is a net negative in 5* PvE compared to how much more powerful he is in getting 4* abilities off sooner.

Mmm I don't know if I agree with you. Being able to cast PH purple for 5 AP, that is BIG. If you get 15 purple you have basically won the match. And what about Spidey's blue for 4 AP, just 4 AP !!! Now with 12 AP you can fire it three times! SS red for 5, SS blue for 7, a 5/5/3 SS is basically immortal with Starlord at his side. It is a real pity he is team Cap and doesn't accelerate black (if he would accelerate IM46 red while being team IM or accelerate GG black then he would be even great with 5s).

I still use more Peggy than Starlord because she helps saving health packs A LOT, but when Starlord was buffed he was really great. I champed him without being 100% sure, but he really was a good decision.

SL and PHX don't play nice together unless you don't care about health pack usage. SS red for 5 is nice, but the damage/AP doesn't make up for 5* scaling compared to what you get at the 4* tier.

Polares

Fightmastermpq wrote:

Polares wrote:

Fightmastermpq wrote:

He's good, but he accelerates 4* rosters much more than 5* rosters which sucks for PvE which is already unfavorable for 5*s. If his yellow boosted match damage by 20% I'd use him in almost every PvE match. The only advantage 5* rosters have is in match damage as their ability damage doesn't scale like 4*s do. So SL adding animation time to every match while only making abilities slightly more efficient is a net negative in 5* PvE compared to how much more powerful he is in getting 4* abilities off sooner.

Mmm I don't know if I agree with you. Being able to cast PH purple for 5 AP, that is BIG. If you get 15 purple you have basically won the match. And what about Spidey's blue for 4 AP, just 4 AP !!! Now with 12 AP you can fire it three times! SS red for 5, SS blue for 7, a 5/5/3 SS is basically immortal with Starlord at his side. It is a real pity he is team Cap and doesn't accelerate black (if he would accelerate IM46 red while being team IM or accelerate GG black then he would be even great with 5s).

I still use more Peggy than Starlord because she helps saving health packs A LOT, but when Starlord was buffed he was really great. I champed him without being 100% sure, but he really was a good decision.

SL and PHX don't play nice together unless you don't care about health pack usage. SS red for 5 is nice, but the damage/AP doesn't make up for 5* scaling compared to what you get at the 4* tier.

I don't get why you say SL and PH don't play nice together (PH is always going to be in front protecting SL which is what you want when you use 4s with 5s). Then I use Starlord as my third support char, in essential nodes I use two more strong 5s ( with my scaling a 5 and a 4 is too dangerous).

Thing is, 4s are now the kings of PvE, that is how things are right now, but I think SL can accelerate 4s and 5s successfully, it is just that a team of 4s is always going to be much faster clearing a node than a team of 5s.

Fightmastermpq

SL makes a lot of CD tiles that work against PHX red.

ammenell

starlord, switch, px
starlord, rulk, 4cyc
starlord, Loki, ...

he's good.

AgentCoulsonLMD

Starlord is a must have character now. I use him, Cyclops and Bullseye in DD every day to quickly win. Combining Starlord with Gamora is great for 3 Reds.

Spiritclaw

My Starlord is 5/1/1, and I still manage to make good use of him. I'd really like a few more covers.

Polares

Fightmastermpq wrote:

SL makes a lot of CD tiles that work against PHX red.

Oh I see. Well, you are right, but it is not that bad, you might need to wait to fire red until some of this countdowns go off, but I don't think it makes them unpairable in any way. In the end, if you fire PH's purple three times, most of the board is going to disappear, so some of those will just get matched. Then, you will never fire Starlord's purple, so the only ones that might go against you are the yellow ones. It might be much more problematic for the second time you would want to fire her red, when there are already some strikes and the countdowns on the board, but I doubt you are going to have problems to fire it the first time. And with just some strikes on the board cascades will be deadly already. I don't remember having a lot of problems when I used them together (maybe I was using OML's strikes sometimes instead of PH's).

The only char that really is unpairable with PH because of her red is Carnage, when he is essential (like he was last week), it is super annoying.

therightwaye

The new StarLord is fantastic. Paired with KingPin is double fantastic.

What I really appreciate about this re-balance effort is the excuses to use more players. I hate seeing the same people in PvP. I hate using the same three people in PvE. The new characters and updates are really helping open up my rooster.