Rebalancing

Merrick

Again, I am in a position where I have to thank D3.

You listened to our concerns and buffed a couple of characters. There are plenty of others that need love, but that you kept the nerf bat on the shelf is greatly appreciated.

https://d3publisher.helpshift.com/a/mar ... -2016&l=en

Phumade

So far this looks like a very well considered and thoughtful balancing. Please keeping moving in incremental steps. It makes it much easier for us to digest the proposed changes

thisone

Good job demi, not nerfing is definitely the way forward. And if you have to nerf, start with small tweaks only

Thanos

Considering how many characters there are that need buffing, it would be nice if they'd do more than two per month.

dsds

Silver surfer is going to be a beast! At 9 ap, you can heal a lot of health. Red at 7ap is pretty impressive. Singularity feeding the other powers and then doing damage with no way to match the singularity. So the damage is dealt once countdown is zero, only way of stopping it is to kill surfer. Edit: Sorry read it wrong. Has to flu and reading funny. Maybe not as good as OML. At lower ap levels, surfer can be even more stronger. At 5ap of red or blue would be nice and would make him at par with oml.

I like the chohulk passive. That will feed nicely into the green which again does quite a bit of damage. Meh on the hot dog stand... what does 920th mean?

firethorne

Cho rework seems nice (aside from the typo, heal for 920th ). Thumbs up here.

BearVenger

dsds wrote:

Silver surfer is going to be a beast! At 5 ap, you can heal a lot of health. Red at 5ap is pretty impressive. Singularity feeding the other powers and then doing damage with no way to match the singularity. So the damage is dealt once countdown is zero, only way of stopping it is to kill surfer.

I like the chohulk passive. That will feed nicely into the green which again does quite a bit of damage. Meh on the hot dog stand... what does 920th mean?

I saw the SS powers as requiring more.than 5AP. Also, his black hole tile - can't it still be destroyed by match-4s?

fmftint

Cho still looks trash tier. He's ahead of Mr F now instead of behind him

madsalad

8k nearly unstoppable damage from SS seems solid. Removing Cho's blue tile requirement was needed so badly.

This is fine

Dragon_Nexus

firethorne wrote:

Cho rework seems nice (aside from the typo, heal for 920th ). Thumbs up here.

It's not a typo, he'll actually heal himself for one 920th of his total health

=3

brisashi

fmftint wrote:

Cho still looks trash tier. He's ahead of Mr F now instead of behind him

Can't say I agree, he doesn't look top-tier but looks more than useful.

drayviper32

I hope D3 buffs Devil Dinosaur. His powers should cause 5k damage minimum @ Level 270.

Blahahah

Cho looks so damn good. I already wanted to use him, but now even moreso than before.

homeinvasion

Was going to post the same completely agree. The meta is not broken at the moment. Back in the day Spiderman, Magneto, Sentry, X-wolvie were all so broken, every game involved 2 of that character in every game. The current meta is diverse, there is a lot of work to go as a handful of characters are still top tier but a good first step. I still can't see myself using or leveling chulk even though he is nearly max covered for me, maybe try a little bit bigger steps.

Sandwichboy

fmftint wrote:

Cho still looks trash tier. He's ahead of Mr F now instead of behind him

How is a low cost true healing, passive gen green battery with high health and significant board shake trash tier? Green still isn't anything impressive, but it absolutely can be both situationally useful and pack a moderate punch at the same time. Blue is among the best passives in 4* tier and 7AP true healing AND charged tiles? That is not trash.

fmftint

Sandwichboy wrote:

fmftint wrote:

Cho still looks trash tier. He's ahead of Mr F now instead of behind him

How is a low cost true healing, passive gen green battery with high health and significant board shake trash tier? Green still isn't anything impressive, but it absolutely can be both situationally useful and pack a moderate punch at the same time. Blue is among the best passives in 4* tier and 7AP true healing AND charged tiles? That is not trash.

Low cost, low yield true heal, makes charged tiles
4☆ Arcane Incantation does low damage and converts random tiles to green
High cost green that does low-mid damage and destroys random tiles or extra damage if you have 12 blue ap

Not impressed

Quebbster

fmftint wrote:

Sandwichboy wrote:

fmftint wrote:

Cho still looks trash tier. He's ahead of Mr F now instead of behind him

How is a low cost true healing, passive gen green battery with high health and significant board shake trash tier? Green still isn't anything impressive, but it absolutely can be both situationally useful and pack a moderate punch at the same time. Blue is among the best passives in 4* tier and 7AP true healing AND charged tiles? That is not trash.

Low cost, low yield true heal, makes charged tiles
4☆ Arcane Incantation does low damage and converts random tiles to green
High cost green that does low-mid damage and destroys random tiles or extra damage if you have 12 blue ap

Not impressed

We may have different priorities. I definitely see uses for a green battery that can Place Charged tiles on the board. I look forward to running him with Rulk and Thor in the SHIELD sim...
(I'll probably run him 3/5/5 though since green is a bit weak. Still, targeted board destruction does have its uses).

Magic

Quebbster wrote:

fmftint wrote:

Sandwichboy wrote:

fmftint wrote:

Cho still looks trash tier. He's ahead of Mr F now instead of behind him

How is a low cost true healing, passive gen green battery with high health and significant board shake trash tier? Green still isn't anything impressive, but it absolutely can be both situationally useful and pack a moderate punch at the same time. Blue is among the best passives in 4* tier and 7AP true healing AND charged tiles? That is not trash.

Low cost, low yield true heal, makes charged tiles
4☆ Arcane Incantation does low damage and converts random tiles to green
High cost green that does low-mid damage and destroys random tiles or extra damage if you have 12 blue ap

Not impressed

We may have different priorities. I definitely see uses for a green battery that can Place Charged tiles on the board. I look forward to running him with Rulk and Thor in the SHIELD sim...
(I'll probably run him 3/5/5 though since green is a bit weak. Still, targeted board destruction does have its uses).

The battery bit is always going to move the character up couple of tiers. He seems to be an interesting partner for RHulk who is the best Green user in the 4* land (especially when buffed). Maybe also Ice-Man (close second). I would be tempted to try him with the said pair plus Switch for extra punch. Who knows - might work in the sim. Or him, SW and Jean? I think there is some testing. His ultimate power might be in PvE when one of the 3 main green users of the 4* land is buffed and any green feeder will be invaluable.

Unfortunately mine is 5-1-1 (until today I felt I am lucky for not pulling one) so he will have to wait for his turn regardless of the tier he ends up in.

Warbringa

Let's be honest here people....Chulk is certainly better than he was before but still barely even mid tier. His black is still poor and his green doesn't do good damage for the AP it requires, even after the buff. Perhaps he becomes an ok AP battery but he seems to be too slow to be a great one and charged tiles aren't really great since opposing team often matches them too, time will tell I guess. The problem is that Red Hulk is probably just a much better green AP battery choice still since he also drains opponents green AP. The only way usage balance occurs in the 4* tier(which seemed to be D3's intent) is through radical changes in powers like IM40 or nerfing Iceman, who is hands down the best 4* out there (Teen Jean and Red Hulk are up there as well - all are purple/green users of course lol). I don't mind nerfs if done correctly but D3's history of nerfing is awful (in most cases) so I don't want to see that happen but if this Chulk buff is indicative of what is to come for other 4* characters, it really won't change the balance within the 4* tier. Let me put it this way...who would you choose between newly buffed Chulk and Iceman to put on your 4* team, assuming covers and levels are equal? Now maybe you would use both to help Chulk boost AP for Iceman ...but you are still picking Iceman first every time between the two. I think Chulk's usage may temporarily increase slightly , it will not decrease Iceman's use, nor will any other character buff do so unless it brings that character up to the power level of Iceman. Maybe we start seeing a Chulk, RHulk, Iceman team? Simply load up on that green AP and blast away? On SS, I am not sure since I don't play him or play against him very much. It appears that his buff will certainly help him but I am not sure if it really makes him competitive or simply now just playable.

carrion_pigeons

His black makes enough charged tiles that it's useful with other characters with better board shake. It's not a good skill on its own but it combos with stuff now instead of actually being a brick. And Scarlet Witch has shown that the passive has too many ways to abuse it not to be valuable, and green AP is probably the best color to battery.

Also, they said they were going for incremental changes. If this isn't good enough, they'll presumably buff him even a little more. No reason not to give him a shot, now.

Of course, I'm still not going to get over his stupid face/nipples.

notamutant

I think both of these buffs are being underrated. I think people also are not keeping up with the whole charged tiles meta-game that is forming now. We previously had only Thor that could create charged tiles. Cho too, but he was useless. Then we had Silver Surfer. Recently, we added Black Bolt to that group. Black Bolt and Thor both benefit from more charged tiles on the board through either more damage with Thor's red or Black Bolt's black. Generally, bringing a lower tier to a fight is a bad idea since it will make you more of a target in PvP, but it is fine for PvE. When boosted, a max 4 star is almost as good as a 5 star, especially Cho who has around 30k health when boosted and maxed.

So let's pretend we are talking about a typical PvP event with a 3 star and then two other characters you can choose. If you are in the 4 star world, you wouldn't use Thor previously due to the requirement to first use stun before red to make the damage meaningful. You also needed IM40 to get enough AP quickly, which made you a target on defense. Now if you bring Thor and Cho, you have Cho's passive blue feeding Thor's stun, as well as his black creating charged tiles for more damage from Thor's red. Not as fast as IM40, but much safer since Cho has huge amounts of health, and when boosted his healing will be annoying. Previously, you had to spend blue AP by Cho to get charged tiles, so it wasn't worth it. Now you have the free green generator. So you have a usable-decent green, blue, red, black, and **** yellow and no purple. Not a crazy team, but better on defense than Thor/IM40.

Next, let's look at Silver Surfer's buffs. The ideal partner for Silver Surfer is now Black Bolt. They have a all actives covered except purple. They also have higher health than the other "popular" 5 stars (OML and Phoenix). SS has healing as well, but BB doesn't, so the team isn't quite as difficult as OML Phoenix in that regards. Still, with a cheaper blue, you are much more likely to get it off multiple times in a match. BB activates his black when there are enough charged tiles on the board. His red now created an extra charged tile as well as doing 1.5k more damage for cheap. With all the charged tiles on the board, BB's black will be dishing out damage almost every turn, and will be hard to stop since SS will create more charged tiles every time he gets 9 blue or 7 red AP. Black hole will now finally be a move worth using, as the 1 AP cheaper means one less match, and it actually does damage as well as gathering more AP. Now this team won't climb quite as well as OML and Phoenix due to no revive or self-heal except for Surfer, but it will make up for it with getting attacked less on defense since you will definitely take a bigger chance at defeat fighting this team than Phoenix + OML.

In the past, I agree, the devs overvalued charged tiles. But I think now, we are finally starting to see ways to get charged tiles on the board cheaper and more useful ways to take advantage of them, to the point where they are actually worth some interesting strategies.