Why are the PvP season rewards so bad?

We_are_Venom

The heroic 10 pack is ok-ish if you smash RNG and pull a couple 4* but the rest? 500 ISO? 100hp? 25cp for 10k? 10k ain't easy to hit for most players and the effort get there is significant, so I look at that 25cp and feel it should be more like 75cp, if not an even 100. Would even settle for 50cp and a 40 pack as the 7.5k reward.

The rewards are really really lame for the amount of work it takes to achieve them.

wirius

Its part of MPQ's greatest problem that they tried to fix starting with PvE There is not enough reward for the effort, period. Hopefully we'll see revised rewards soon with the 40th 4* release.

jredd

i just don't see how you get rewards every 300 to 1000 points to 5000 then the next 2 are 7500 and then 1000. they are aware that there are several numbers between there right? throw some rewards in there for fork sake...

also, put some alliance score progression rewards in there too.

stingiest bunch of stingies that ever stingied.

We_are_Venom

jredd wrote:

i just don't see how you get rewards every 300 to 1000 points to 5000 then the next 2 are 7500 and then 1000. they are aware that there are several numbers between there right? throw some rewards in there for fork sake...

also, put some alliance score progression rewards in there too.

stingiest bunch of stingies that ever stingied.

I completely forgot I created this thread. It's like I was drunk posting except I don't drink.

Anyway the alliance progression rewards are a really, REALLY great idea and better than what I suggested. Thanks for posting that hopefully someone important notices it,

bmart14

The overall PVP season rewards definitely do not come close to matching the effort put in. For individuals placements, you get a 4* as #1, 3* through 100, then a lowly 2*. Even for the 2* range, you get 250 ISO. Alliances up to top 500 get 500 ISO and 25 HP. There are 10 pvp games every season. So I'd think for the season, even up to 1500 placement the ISO should be a minimum of 2k. Alliance ISO should also be more (probably 4x).

At least individual overall season card rewards are somewhat ok but even though should probably be doubled across the board. For sure alliance card rewards need to be more. Why not have 10-packs for alliances? I mean up to 20 people worked together to get that placement. It feels cheap for a top 25 alliance (for example) end up with only one LT. Those should be multiple. How about 5 LT's for top 5 and 3 for top 25?

I enjoy PVP but I think there should be commensurate rewards for the extended effort especially for alliances.

carrion_pigeons

Somebody really needs to make a stickied thread that tells people that if they're about to suggest rewards being commensurate with effort, they may as well not bother. There has never been any indication that the devs are interested in a reward structure that does this (and by it's lack for so long, an overwhelming amount of evidence to support that they hate the idea). We could consolidate half the threads made on this forum.

scottee

History lesson

The season alliance reward actually started as the greatest prize the game had ever seen (and has ever seen since). And I'm not exaggerating. Season 1 had an alliance reward of the first 4* in the 4* era, Nick Fury. The cover was only attainable to the top 100 alliances at the end of the season, and no where else. This made the start of seasons the biggest adjustment to competition that the game has ever seen. The new alliance system meant something. Being a top player meant something. It was seriously the greatest period of frenzy in the game's history, because it was sustained for the whole month. (Before the servers crashed at the release of Ultron, they crashed at the end of Season 1.)

So what happened? Nothing. They've essentially kept the season alliance prize as a relatively new 4*, except now it's in the form of an LT. But that's the problem. As the game's developed, they still think a 4* for a month's work is a good prize.

Now, if they did something like make the next season's alliance prize a 5* cover, like OML or GG, that would be something different...

HxiiiK

scottee wrote:

History lesson

The season alliance reward actually started as the greatest prize the game had ever seen (and has ever seen since). And I'm not exaggerating. Season 1 had an alliance reward of the first 4* in the 4* era, Nick Fury. The cover was only attainable to the top 100 alliances at the end of the season, and no where else. This made the start of seasons the biggest adjustment to competition that the game has ever seen. The new alliance system meant something. Being a top player meant something. It was seriously the greatest period of frenzy in the game's history, because it was sustained for the whole month. (Before the servers crashed at the release of Ultron, they crashed at the end of Season 1.)

So what happened? Nothing. They've essentially kept the season alliance prize as a relatively new 4*, except now it's in the form of an LT. But that's the problem. As the game's developed, they still think a 4* for a month's work is a good prize.

Now, if they did something like make the next season's alliance prize a 5* cover, like OML or GG, that would be something different...

Good times, now that you've reminded me of them. It was one of the biggest shifts in the game, and drawing a Fury cover was THE best thing to happen back then (kinda like getting OML right now except WAY more satisfying because it meant you've just pulled a month's work in a token) and they really just got comfortable from there and stopped moving forward.

I think putting a 5* cover will cause that huge shift again, and it might bring back giants that have left us for greener pastures. Though here's hoping. D3 hasn't really made any huge game changes lately, and a lot of what they do cannot be compared with these sweeping changes last time.

carrion_pigeons

I won't say the current system isn't as unrewarding as anything in the game, but I'll point out that a lot of people hated grinding for a month straight for a "mandatory" alliance reward.

I was part of a multi-alliance group at the time, with a competitive group and a less-competitive group and every season we had a stampede out of the competitive group and had to look for replacements because people were so sick of needing a months' worth of grinding to keep up.

That was not the most player-friendly design ever.

Crowl

jredd wrote:

i just don't see how you get rewards every 300 to 1000 points to 5000 then the next 2 are 7500 and then 1000. they are aware that there are several numbers between there right? throw some rewards in there for fork sake...

also, put some alliance score progression rewards in there too.

stingiest bunch of stingies that ever stingied.

To be fair, weren't those additional rewards at 7.5k and 10k just added as a bonus for those who are coordinating out of game and able to run up their score sufficiently, it was not like the devs consider it part of the regular progression that would mandate a load more intermediate rewards.

One thing to bear in mind with complaints about the seasonal placement awards, those are already a bonus on top of all the other rewards people are able to earn in the individual pvp events as it is.

jredd

Crowl wrote:

jredd wrote:

i just don't see how you get rewards every 300 to 1000 points to 5000 then the next 2 are 7500 and then 1000. they are aware that there are several numbers between there right? throw some rewards in there for fork sake...

also, put some alliance score progression rewards in there too.

stingiest bunch of stingies that ever stingied.

To be fair, weren't those additional rewards at 7.5k and 10k just added as a bonus for those who are coordinating out of game and able to run up their score sufficiently, it was not like the devs consider it part of the regular progression that would mandate a load more intermediate rewards.

One thing to bear in mind with complaints about the seasonal placement awards, those are already a bonus on top of all the other rewards people are able to earn in the individual pvp events as it is.

you mean the heaps of 2* covers i pull from event tokens?!! those totally turn the tide...

GrumpySmurf1002

aesthetocyst wrote:

If there were 15K, 20K, 25K, 30K, etc., progressions, your insinuations about devs catering to certain styles and extremes of play would have merit.

I've already argued they should go to 25-30k, but nonetheless it still makes no sense that getting all progressions during the season (scoring 15k) doesn't have a corresponding season reward.

mohio

A couple people have stated this already, but they're "so bad" because they were always meant to be added freebies you get for playing each event in a season. The devs even stated as much when they introduced the rewards in the first place. The more "premier" rewards were meant to be kept in the individual events themselves. So, if you look at the rewards as extra stuff you weren't getting before (which was the case at season 1, whether you were playing then or not), it's pretty generous of them is it not?

As for rewards not being commensurate with effort, I actually somewhat disagree. If you're only hitting 3-400 each PvP, that's about enough to get you to 4000 with some help in simulator, and that 10-pack will probably be fairly helpful to your roster. If you're hitting 800-1k, that 25 cp at 10k is exactly what you need. Sure everyone likes more free stuff, so peppering more ISO, cp, hp, etc. throughout the rewards ladder would be great, but the big ticket items are nice and right about where they should be imo. Where this does break down however is at the very top end. If you're hitting 1300+ every event, then sure that 25 cp is nice at 10000 points, but you hit that in 6 or 7 events (or for some, just 3 events) and then have nothing to look forward to for the rest of the season. So I do agree that additional rewards are needed beyond 10k points, maybe cycle 5 cp, 100 hp, 5000 iso every 2500 points or something?

Just as a quick illustration of the issue here is a rundown of what people "earn" over a season based on certain scores (big rewards only):

400 per pvp : 10 event tokens, season 3*, season 10-pack
650 per pvp : 20 event tokens, season 3*, season 10-pack
800 per pvp : 20 event tokens, 10 event 3*, season 3*, season 10-pack, season 25 cp (with some help from sim)
1000 per pvp : 30 event tokens, 10 event 3*, 10 event 4*, season 3*, season 10-pack, season 25 cp
1300+ per pvp : 30 event tokens, 10 event 3*, 10 event 4*, 250 cp, season 3*, season 10-pack, season 25 cp

As you can see, the season rewards are quite good if you're hitting 400-800 per event, since hitting that 10-pack is a fairly substantial bonus. Once you're at 800 per event, the 10-pack doesn't help nearly as much compared to all the 3* you are getting per event, but if you can do enough shield sim to get to 10k on the season that extra 25 cp is pretty big bonus. At 1000 the season rewards start to really pale in comparison to what you're getting per event, since you are picking up a guaranteed 4* every event, but if you're not getting cp each event, the bonus at the end is quite nice. The discrepancy is even larger at 1300+ as you're also picking up the cp each event, so the bonus 25 is a fairly small amount compared to what you've accumulated throughout the season.

MushroomGenius808

We_are_Venom wrote:

jredd wrote:

i just don't see how you get rewards every 300 to 1000 points to 5000 then the next 2 are 7500 and then 1000. they are aware that there are several numbers between there right? throw some rewards in there for fork sake...

also, put some alliance score progression rewards in there too.

stingiest bunch of stingies that ever stingied.

I completely forgot I created this thread. It's like I was drunk posting except I don't drink.

Anyway the alliance progression rewards are a really, REALLY great idea and better than what I suggested. Thanks for posting that hopefully someone important notices it,

Not sure alliance progression rewards are possible, or if so, they would need to be recorded differently than the alliance cumulative score at the end of an event.

Currently, you can jump in an out of an alliance affecting an alliance's cumulative score (merc'ing), but if this mechanic were counted for a progression-type reward, it's ripe for abuse (where people could jump from alliance to alliance to grab progressions). The only thing they could do would to keep any points earned while in the alliance tallied separately. If they're unable to be tallied separately, we could see the end of merc'ing for placement.

TxMoose

pretty exploitable. merc for pve. while in the merc pve alliance, dump pvp points so when you rejoin your pvp alliance you can re-earn those pts all over again. only way I see that working is if you just step progressions up at each event end with the current rules of who's in at the end of each event. you could have a hard progression and soft. soft progression is what the current event(s) are at, but not locked into the hard progression until current event ends. might need to be pretty advanced system, which makes me think it probably won't be anything like that.

El Satanno

aesthetocyst wrote:

Nah, just make the entire season a locked alliance event.

Cue umpteenth rehash of the pros and cons of mercing.

Honestly, I think I'd like that. It really would make alliances truly meaningful as a cohesive unit.

Alsmir

But heroic 10 pack makes up for it!
Especially if you are as lucky as I am and pull 9x 2* and a Sentry cover.