How Many PvP Losses Is Fair To Expect?

chamber44

I'm solidly in the 4* transition with Rulk (level 220), 4Clops (250), and IMHB (209) being my best toons (but unusable Iceman and Jean). Many of my 3*'s are champed as well.

I can't really pinpoint when it started happening, but i feel like i used to be able to play until nearly 500 without losing a match (unless there was a terrible cascade), but now i can barely hit 100 before losing sometimes 2-4 matches in a row. I'm spending hundreds of ISO skipping around trying to find a match with levels that aren't equal to (if not higher) than my own (and that's not including 5's). It's to the point where I left my (top 100) alliance because the slog just to hit the 750 minimum was not only not fun, but actually (and weirdly) impossible.

Plus, once i'm hitting around 200, I keep getting pummeled with retals (or worse, losses to teams i have no hope of beating retaliating against). This game used to be fun, but now, either i'm stuck in this really weird MMR limbo or D3 has finally broken it for people with rosters like mine (only 10 total 5* covers divided up between 6 toons -- none of whom are leveled at all).

I'm sure i'm not the only one, so my question is this: have i finally reached the point that I should just move on to greener pastures? Is my MMR permanently crippled? Or is reaching 500 without significant usage of Health packs just my new reality?

Calnexin

Sounds like you're a victim of the new scaling.

My roster is below yours - my highest character is OML @ 323. My next is 4thor @ 220, and everyone else is 200 or below, excepting boosts. I usually climb to just below 400 and get hit 1-2x per day. Once I get above 400 I start getting slammed. On the Wasp event I lost ~ 200, from 490 max.

Vhailorx

That is not normal in my experience TC! I generally use 3-4 healthpacks while climbing to 600+, and another handful to go from there up to 1k+. I almost never have to shield before 1k.

It sounds like mmr is treating you as it would someone with 4I champs. But you only have 3 mostly covered, but underleveled 4*s.

I have a weak 4* roster (often use xforce twins to climbs and in40/4*thor for speed at the end), and I know that i would definitely target an underleveled roster like yours. You may suffer until you can fully champ at least 1 of your 4*s (if possible, to with rulk and play him with switch!).

But there are a lot of other factors that might affect your results. What slice do you play in? And when do you play?

SnowcaTT

It totally depends on how many points you have and how early you get there.

I often run out to 300 from seeds + 3*'s, and float there until last day. In the next 1.5 days I'll be hit ~15 times, often by heavy 5* teams that must be going up and down as an ISO run - they are hitting me for 5 points sometimes, so I assume I'm just another "seed" team for them.

I was like you and used to be able to float at 600-650 when in high 3*/few 4* land...once I moved to several 4*'s and a good 5* I can't float above 400 unless it's the last eight hours of the event. I assume there are just that few people in that MMR bracket - they all have to hit the same people and they can't all be to much higher in points.

Which is why I beg for a much wider MMR.

dsds

SnowcaTT wrote:

It totally depends on how many points you have and how early you get there.

I often run out to 300 from seeds + 3*'s, and float there until last day. In the next 1.5 days I'll be hit ~15 times, often by heavy 5* teams that must be going up and down as an ISO run - they are hitting me for 5 points sometimes, so I assume I'm just another "seed" team for them.

I was like you and used to be able to float at 600-650 when in high 3*/few 4* land...once I moved to several 4*'s and a good 5* I can't float above 400 unless it's the last eight hours of the event. I assume there are just that few people in that MMR bracket - they all have to hit the same people and they can't all be to much higher in points.

Which is why I beg for a much wider MMR.

Wider MMR is what caused this. The extra boosted levels ensures that any champed 3* can get hit by 345-375 level 5* players. I have experienced a drop in my float points as well. It only happens when a champed 3* star is the essential character. I have 3-4 non champed 3* and my float is the same with those unchamped 3* (of course my float points are lower for unchamped 3* but remains unchanged).

Also, please read the OP carefully, he did say that quite a few who attack him are beyond his ability to retaliate against. So it's not people who are the same level as him but people who are actually higher and can see him now due to the changes.

Fightmastermpq

I think this is just the progression of 5* rosters breaking the game. The first event of this season I joined early and climbed from 1000 to 1200 on battles worth anywhere from 4 to 8 points, taking a couple 70 pt hits in between. I made SO MUCH ISO doing this, and I think that many other people are learning that the best way to earn ISO with a 5* roster is to climb to this 1k pt range where MMR opens up and start hitting the 2/3/4* teams that can't retaliate.

My recommendation is to try different time slices, and experiment with what times you do your climbing. You could also be in an MMR funk that might correct itself, but it's hard to say as the MMR goals from D3 are not spelled out well.

dsds

I get what you are saying, but I don't think I've ever been hit by players with 5* characters that were level 345-360 before the change. Also they say you are open at 800 pts. It seems to me that it is happening much earlier like at 400-500 pts level instead of 800. Maybe the 800pt rule has changed as well.

Disclaimer, I rarely hit 800 or above so I thought I would be safe from the higher level players. Also please note, I have been fighting early nowadays and float at 400-600 and then climb to about 750 and stop because I hit my hp target. I normally fall to 400-500 pts at the end of the pvp event. But with the new update, I fall to 350-400pts to end the pvp event.

Fightmastermpq

dsds wrote:

I get what you are saying, but I don't think I've ever been hit by players with 5* characters that were level 345-360 before the change. Also they say you are open at 800 pts. It seems to me that it is happening much earlier like at 400-500 pts level instead of 800. Maybe the 800pt rule has changed as well.

Disclaimer, I rarely hit 800 or above so I thought I would be safe from the higher level players. Also please note, I have been fighting early nowadays and float at 400-600 and then climb to about 750 and stop because I hit my hp target. I normally fall to 400-500 pts at the end of the pvp event. But with the new update, I fall to 350-400pts to end the pvp event.

The 800 pt opening is for higher ranked players to find you. It's basically MMR saying "OK, we will let you 'bully' these weaker rosters, but you can only hit them for very few points." The 800 pt number I have found to vary as well. If you join right as an event opens you can often see everyone from very low, sometimes you have to climb to 1k or even higher. Just depends. Could have to do more with average scores for the slice or time remaining or something like that.

Hyphenmoore

I am having similar issues. I have about 12 champed 4*s and my OML is at 360. I will play the seed teams and quit around 100 points and come back later and have been hit 4-5 times by players I would have no chance to retaliate against. Mostly high level 5* teams and champed 5*s.

I am not a very active pvp player and when I want to get to 1000 I used to be able to pretty easily but not so much anymore. Low point fight and constant retaliations. I usually use slice 4.

Polares

Transition is always a problem in this game, when you are in 3 land (not anything above 200) you are usually safe, not 5s attacks, you can more or less get to 1000 (if you dont play in 2nd and 4th slice). Then when you are in 4 land (nothing above 290) you are more or less ok, you are attacked by some 5s, but it is still ok as you have always a buffed 4. Transition is also made worse because your fights are much harder (this is what is happening to you), you need to spend a lot of iso to find good targets.

Recently though, some new problems have made transitions even worse. First, 3s were 'nerfed' and now 3s with the same level as any 4 are usually worse, so now it is harder to get to 1000 for 3s teams than it was before. And then have a good deep 4 roster is hard because of the lack of iso. Usually when players have 7+ champed 4s, they already have a 360 level 5, which screws the transition even more, because they go from 3->4 to 4->5 straight away.

As a 5 player, I get much more attacks in the range of 200 - 600 points than before, but then it is easier to climb to 1300. So my floor has been obliterated because there are not that many 5 players (so they all see me all the time), but then when climbing I get attacked just once or twice. So, it makes sense, it has its logic, but it is strange that when I was in 4 land I could easily unshield with 600 and not get attacked, and now I get attacked even with 200

PS: Oh yeah, and REMOVE THE STUPID 10 ISO TAX !!!!

optimus2861

chamber44 wrote:

I'm solidly in the 4* transition with Rulk (level 220), 4Clops (250), and IMHB (209) being my best toons (but unusable Iceman and Jean). Many of my 3*'s are champed as well.

I can't really pinpoint when it started happening, but i feel like i used to be able to play until nearly 500 without losing a match (unless there was a terrible cascade), but now i can barely hit 100 before losing sometimes 2-4 matches in a row. I'm spending hundreds of ISO skipping around trying to find a match with levels that aren't equal to (if not higher) than my own (and that's not including 5's). It's to the point where I left my (top 100) alliance because the slog just to hit the 750 minimum was not only not fun, but actually (and weirdly) impossible.

My PVP experiences over the past season or two (at least) mirror yours. I used to easily hit 400 at minimum in just about any event I wanted, and if my featured character was strong enough I could usually hit 575 without too much fuss and then decide if I wanted 725. 800 was always a longshot though (I've hit it 3 times total in 600+ days). I might take an end-of-event beatdown back into the 400s by floating at 500+ but so be it; I had the HP from the progression, a token or two, and that was good enough for me. I long ago gave up any hope of placement.

But now... good grief, PVP is a bloodbath of frustration. I have 38 3* champs, a usable 4hor, and that's it. My highest characters are just reaching the mid 180s (including 4hor). Every. Freaking. Match. is against a roster that's identical or stronger than mine now. So all it takes is a bad board, a bad cascade, and I'm at serious risk of losing outright or eating multiple health packs. And the boosts ensure that despite having the 38 3* champs, I can't use over half of them because I'm just hanging out a "KICK ME" sign for defence. Or they just can't stand up to their boosted brethren anyway, such as my attempt to take Cyclops along in DD PVP recently. He tripped on a level ~300 Ambush tile and lost ~90% of his health in that one hit.

Add to that the double frustration that the seeds don't even appear all the time any more. Here, you have 0 points and are just starting, face three champions! Stupid!

S4 is where the big boys play; I tried there for a bit and have since surrendered that field. Merciless beatdowns from unbeatable adversaries at almost any time. S3 is a little saner but .. I've lost motivation. I just can't be bothered to put up with the aggravation for long.

tl;dr: the MMR sucks, as has been detailed by just about everybody, including the OML players.