HP progression moved from 500 to 900

Unknown

Guess based on actual figures showing most players stop at 700.

You guys continue to invent new ways to make me feel I wanna puke. Another cheap move sneaked in.

If anything else, what happened with the "better communication" movement? The announce statement ran out of recycled bits?

Unknown

They say the 500 HP is moved to the alliance. The top 2500 alliance gets 50 HP. If you assume 5 guys are in each alliance, that's 12500 people getting the reward. I think it's pretty safe to say 12500 people did not hit a rating of 500 before, because on some of the less competitive brackets 500 is almost enough for top 10 (and sometimes is) so it's hard to see 12500 guys with that kind of rating.

That doesn't address the issue of what if you don't belong to an alliance.

Nemek

Yeah, if say 50K people joined a PvP event (which I think is WAY too high an estimate) and we say that the top 2500 alliances have 5 players each...

Currently, that is 5*2500 = 12500 players get 50 HP.

So, what percentage of players is that? 12500/50000 = 25%.

That means under the old system, you would need to be in the top 25%, or rather 0.25*500 = Top 125.

The top 125 in a bracket most DEFINITELY didn't get 500 points. Generously, let's say 500 points got you top 20 (and that's in the hardest brackets...500 often gets you top 10.)

So, six times as many players are getting the 50 HP reward now.

Then, the upper 50 HP reward was reduced to 900 points, which is wayyyyyyyyyyy easier to get than 1000 points. If anything, this is a dramatic increase in HP for the player base.

Unknown

Phantron wrote:

They say the 500 HP is moved to the alliance. The top 2500 alliance gets 50 HP. If you assume 5 guys are in each alliance, that's 12500 people getting the reward. I think it's pretty safe to say 12500 people did not hit a rating of 500 before, because on some of the less competitive brackets 500 is almost enough for top 10 (and sometimes is) so it's hard to see 12500 guys with that kind of rating.

That doesn't address the issue of what if you don't belong to an alliance.

The whole alliance stuff is dropped on the game in a pre-alpha form. First there should be a way of communication in-game and interfaces to manage joining and forming alliances. Once those are in place it's okay to start giving alliance-based prizes.

but starting with TAKING AWAY normal prizes reallocating them in mostly no man's land is just rude. Doing so without announcing it will be here yesterday adds insult to the injury.

It would be the most fundamental feature to have "invite to my alliance" with the player/roster view.

All we have is join if you guessed a name. Not even full list without giving a few letters. Not even a comment field on the alliance to say who is expected to join. How many players already joined somewhere? How they are supposed to join on the fly?

NorthernPolarity

It's funny how a change like this can draw bad press and yet actually be better for the playerbase by injecting more HP into the game.

Unknown

NorthernPolarity wrote:

It's funny how a change like this can draw bad press and yet actually be better for the playerbase by injecting more HP into the game.

The people complaining about it are the ones who lose something from it. It may be a net gain, but it's still a loss for a large number of people.

Unknown

pasa_ wrote:

Phantron wrote:

They say the 500 HP is moved to the alliance. The top 2500 alliance gets 50 HP. If you assume 5 guys are in each alliance, that's 12500 people getting the reward. I think it's pretty safe to say 12500 people did not hit a rating of 500 before, because on some of the less competitive brackets 500 is almost enough for top 10 (and sometimes is) so it's hard to see 12500 guys with that kind of rating.

That doesn't address the issue of what if you don't belong to an alliance.

The whole alliance stuff is dropped on the game in a pre-alpha form. First there should be a way of communication in-game and interfaces to manage joining and forming alliances. Once those are in place it's okay to start giving alliance-based prizes.

but starting with TAKING AWAY normal prizes reallocating them in mostly no man's land is just rude. Doing so without announcing it will be here yesterday adds insult to the injury.

It would be the most fundamental feature to have "invite to my alliance" with the player/roster view.

All we have is join if you guessed a name. Not even full list without giving a few letters. Not even a comment field on the alliance to say who is expected to join. How many players already joined somewhere? How they are supposed to join on the fly?

I'm just saying the numbers work out favorable to the average player. I don't like this system where they're pretty much forcing you to be in an alliance to get what you used to be able to get yourself if you're competitive in a game where there's really nothing to work together toward. Even if there's a decent interface to support alliances, there's really nothing you can work together. About all you can say is like "Everyone get more points gogogo!" Due to MMR dictating who you play, it's not like you can even try to attack another alliance that might be getting too close to you in any meaningful capacity.

Unknown

Ben Grimm wrote:

NorthernPolarity wrote:

It's funny how a change like this can draw bad press and yet actually be better for the playerbase by injecting more HP into the game.

The people complaining about it are the ones who lose something from it. It may be a net gain, but it's still a loss for a large number of people.

People are complaining because it's a certain style of playing that's punished.

Imagine if they say from now on if you used any character at or above level 141 in a tournament you automatically lose 100 HP on every tournament, otherwise you automatically gain 100 HP on every tournament. This will inject more HP into the economy for sure, and the guys with level 141s can just use someone lower. That doesn't mean this is a good change. Requiring you to be in an alliance is a rather serious intrusion on people's playstyle.

Unknown

Phantron wrote:

Requiring you to be in an alliance is a rather serious intrusion on people's playstyle.

Exactly. It would be a fishy move even if alliances were an old established thing. But doing the shift before even the few alliances that make sense had chance to form? Ho'rude!

For me the alliance prize is obscure -- discussion shows I'm not alone to not know even the basics of tabulation let alone make a guess where I finish either as a 1-man alliance or with some random fellows. I do see that this far I got 150 HP from a normal topX run, possibly spending 75 or 150 on shields, that is now cut to 100 and even a cover was taken.

The fact (or guess) that they will throw packs of HP and the missing cover from helicopter on the crowd just fails to make me happy.

This game is designed around individual progress and lacks even a market that usually is present in online games. I could adjust to some group play where we can form actual team, able to pool covers, HP, ISO, maybe do coordinated attacks or whatever.

As you also said, just signing up under a made-up name with unknown random players that is marginally different from the scoring brackets we're thrown hardly creates something worth the name "alliance".

NorthernPolarity

Phantron wrote:

Ben Grimm wrote:

NorthernPolarity wrote:

It's funny how a change like this can draw bad press and yet actually be better for the playerbase by injecting more HP into the game.

The people complaining about it are the ones who lose something from it. It may be a net gain, but it's still a loss for a large number of people.

People are complaining because it's a certain style of playing that's punished.

Imagine if they say from now on if you used any character at or above level 141 in a tournament you automatically lose 100 HP on every tournament, otherwise you automatically gain 100 HP on every tournament. This will inject more HP into the economy for sure, and the guys with level 141s can just use someone lower. That doesn't mean this is a good change. Requiring you to be in an alliance is a rather serious intrusion on people's playstyle.

Yeah, I know what you're saying. I said that because I thought that less people were going to get the 50HP reward as opposed to more, so that math surprised me. The alliance requirements are definitely an intrusion on the playstyles that we've grown accustomed to, without really adding too much to the game. Maybe this will make the playerbase slightly more social, so we can give each other high-5s when the alliance does well? Not that that really justifies the change at all, but meh.

Unknown

Right now I'm in an alliance with two of the guys I know and the other two guys I have no idea. I think it was just the first two guys that randomly clicked on join because we left the alliance as open. As far as I can tell there's no way to remove people (at least I haven't figured it out), nor do I have any plan to ever talk to those two guys who apparently just thought our alliance name looked cool and joined.

That's not social and that's not teamwork. I don't mind if teamwork yields better reward even though I prefer to play alone, but there's not even that right now. If there was say a level 2000 DAX3 battle where the damage they take is cumulative and they're completely immune to the usual cheap tricks (no AP steal, no stuns, and if you cast moves like Magnetic Field you just die instantly instead) you need 20 guys playing constantly to try to bring them down and the winner gets some nice prize, at least there's clearly a teamwork aspect. I'm sure some people will disagree having some kind of equivalent of 'raid' in a puzzle game doesn't make much sense, but at least you can say those 20 guys working together to beat the team of level 2000X3 DAs clearly did something none of them could've achieved on their own. Right now we can't even say that.

Spoit

Phantron wrote:

pasa_ wrote:

Phantron wrote:

They say the 500 HP is moved to the alliance. The top 2500 alliance gets 50 HP. If you assume 5 guys are in each alliance, that's 12500 people getting the reward. I think it's pretty safe to say 12500 people did not hit a rating of 500 before, because on some of the less competitive brackets 500 is almost enough for top 10 (and sometimes is) so it's hard to see 12500 guys with that kind of rating.

That doesn't address the issue of what if you don't belong to an alliance.

The whole alliance stuff is dropped on the game in a pre-alpha form. First there should be a way of communication in-game and interfaces to manage joining and forming alliances. Once those are in place it's okay to start giving alliance-based prizes.

but starting with TAKING AWAY normal prizes reallocating them in mostly no man's land is just rude. Doing so without announcing it will be here yesterday adds insult to the injury.

It would be the most fundamental feature to have "invite to my alliance" with the player/roster view.

All we have is join if you guessed a name. Not even full list without giving a few letters. Not even a comment field on the alliance to say who is expected to join. How many players already joined somewhere? How they are supposed to join on the fly?

I'm just saying the numbers work out favorable to the average player. I don't like this system where they're pretty much forcing you to be in an alliance to get what you used to be able to get yourself if you're competitive in a game where there's really nothing to work together toward. Even if there's a decent interface to support alliances, there's really nothing you can work together. About all you can say is like "Everyone get more points gogogo!" Due to MMR dictating who you play, it's not like you can even try to attack another alliance that might be getting too close to you in any meaningful capacity.

To be fair, It's not like the MMR lets you attack people ahead of you in your bracket very often either