A polite request to the Forum regarding Kiora

Hibernum_JC

I know a lot of players are upset at the price point for Kiora, but I would like to remind you guys that she *will* be in the Vault in the near future, and she will be purchasable solely with Crystals. I don't know the exact price she will cost, but I can 100% confirm she will be in.

Our goal here is to ensure that everyone can have access to all the Planeswalkers they want, eventually. We release them through special offers like that to offer some sort of exclusivity to some players, but rest assured that even if you do not want to purchase her outright you will be able to grind out Crystals and purchase her.

nexus13

I just wish that players had an informed choice about making a purchase, that we knew it was X dollars to get this now or Y crystals starting on such and such date. For those spending cash they don't really know what the other option is, its a **** shoot to see if the upfront price is a bargain or if you're paying a severe premium for getting it first.

Meto5000

nexus13 wrote:

I just wish that players had an informed choice about making a purchase, that we knew it was X dollars to get this now or Y crystals starting on such and such date. For those spending cash they don't really know what the other option is, its a **** shoot to see if the upfront price is a bargain or if you're paying a severe premium for getting it first.

I totally agree with this. The way the current system works it can seem like you're intentionally obfuscating the eventual cost for unknown reasons. With the release of the Crystal Price Point for Gideon2 and ObNix, players now know that the cash price was a pretty good deal but it very easily could not have been. Why not just communicate prices from the start? I really don't think you guys (Publishers or Developers) have malicious intent, but the communication between the teams seems really lackluster.

EDHdad

Agreed, 100%. If Kiora is going to cost 250, 500, 1000 or a billion crystals, I'd like to know that sooner rather than later.

In paper Magic, we know the suggested retail price of every single product as soon as they are announced, often 6 months before the release date.

If you were charging some sane price, like 99 cents for a single card or $2.49 for a new Planeswalker, it wouldn't be as big of an issue.

BassMuffinFIve

EDHdad wrote:

Agreed, 100%. If Kiora is going to cost 250, 500, 1000 or a billion crystals, I'd like to know that sooner rather than later.

In paper Magic, we know the suggested retail price of every single product as soon as they are announced, often 6 months before the release date.

If you were charging some sane price, like 99 cents for a single card or $2.49 for a new Planeswalker, it wouldn't be as big of an issue.

Wow. When you put a rational price in there, it really looks a lot more attractive! /unbelievable

I still can't fathom that they are charging $50 for a fraction of a virtual game. Could you imagine paying $50 to listen to a single from an album from a band you like, and then not even OWNING that single? Let alone the whole album? Jesus...

EDHdad

By way of comparison, a complete set of Battle for Zendikar (274 cards) in Magic Online is about $61. You can use these to play actual games of Magic with actual human beings, some of whom are the greatest Magic players who have ever lived. Shrine of the Forsaken Gods, the card which Puzzle Quest is selling for $9.99 is 12 cents in Magic The Gathering Online or about $1.25 in paper.

If you have a complete set of Battle for Zendikar online, you can pay Wizards an additional $35 and redeem it for a complete set of the paper version of those cards.

Some of the older sets which aren't in Standard (a format which uses only recently printed cards) and which are too old to redeem are even cheaper than that. A complete set of Legions (143 cards from 2003) is available for $5.26. A complete set of Born of the Gods (which is no longer in standard but can be redeemed for paper Magic cards) is $17.86 for 165 cards.

I realize there is a different business model here, but pick any entertainment alternative. A month of Netflix is like $8. A best-selling book on Kindle is probably under $10. A really good board game is maybe $15 to $40.

ChrisTot

EDHdad wrote:

By way of comparison, a complete set of Battle for Zendikar (274 cards) in Magic Online is about $61. You can use these to play actual games of Magic with actual human beings, some of whom are the greatest Magic players who have ever lived. Sanctum of Ugin, a rare from that set, is 10 cents online or about $1.50 in paper.

If you have a complete set of Battle for Zendikar online, you can pay Wizards an additional $35 and redeem it for a complete set of the paper version of those cards.

Some of the older sets which aren't in Standard (a format which uses only recently printed cards) and which are too old to redeem are even cheaper than that. A complete set of Legions (143 cards from 2003) is available for $5.26. A complete set of Born of the Gods (which is no longer in standard but can be redeemed for paper Magic cards) is $17.86 for 165 cards.

I realize there is a different business model here, but pick any entertainment alternative. A month of Netflix is like $8. A best-selling book on Kindle is probably under $10. A really good board game is maybe $15 to $40.

Problem is, the people in charge of marketing in Netflix are probably trying to achieve a different business model.
In this, and many other mobile games, the people calling the shots care about what the whales are willing to spend.
I have a friend who, for example, spent cash to be able to buy 3 big boxes. Despite the drop in rares, he still received 6 mythics and 10 rares (in 42 packs). He has not uninstalled the game. I have seen a lot of complaints from people on here about the direction the game is going..yet still no uninstalls. The correct price for something is the highest price people are willing to accept. Treat everything going on with this game as its "price" (after all, everything in life has an opportunity cost). By keeping the game installed on a device, people are saying they are okay with how things are going. D3 wins because the whales are still clicking, and the free players are still logging in and at the very least getting their login bonuses. The marketing team can see all of these taps through various 3rd party libraries of code and deduces that people "do" want things to change..but are definitely willing to stick around despite them.

I still browse the forums, but I deleted the app 10 days ago. I hear all these threats of people "wanting" to uninstall..but the reality is..they also want to get their QB rewards. The game doesn't have to change from the direction it is headed because the community doesn't force it to. Vote with your dollars and with which apps are worth even being installed on your phone.

All of your points above are solid. Sounds like you did your research and see this game as obviously more expensive than most forms of entertainment out there. You know this, the people of this forum know this..so this begs the question..why is the game still installed on anyone here's devices? And the answer to that question is the reason why D3 is going in the direction they are: because people will still play the game anyway.

EDHdad

For me personally, I've been into Magic the Gathering for over 22 years and I see Magic Puzzle Quest as a potential expansion of the Magic brand.

The designers of Magic Puzzle Quest have been very responsive to our input regarding game play and technical issues. So it's certainly worth while to give input. On the financial side, I fully recognize that different people are calling the shots, and that I'm not their target customer. But I'll still continue to give input. Whoever wants to can kick it upstairs where it can be filed in the appropriate circular bin.

I, and others like me, bent the ears of the Powers That Be at Wizards of the Coast decades ago, and a lot of meaningful change came from that. There are a lot of things people take for granted today which are due to the gentle nagging from people like me in the 1990's. Stuff like publishing complete lists of cards, indicating the rarity of a card on the card, numbering the cards, printing foil parallels for collectors, etc.

I'm not into FTP games in general. I'm not going to delete a Magic the Gathering themed gem-matching game to install a Game of Thrones themed gem-matching game. For all its flaws, Magic Puzzle Quest is a fun game and if the person to person mode gets too annoying, I can always hang out in story mode.

paralistalon

The problem with Kiora being released at such an outrageous price is that now that they already did this, they're going to have to price her at about 1000 crystals in order to not offend everyone that spent $50 on her on day one! There's no other fair solution- they kind of painted themselves into a corner with this one. I think the players would have found it a lot easier to accept if Kiora was included as a mythic rarity card in a regular pack. Yes, that means that you will spend MUCH more than $50 to reliably get Kiora, but since there is a SMALL CHANCE to get her in a daily free pack even, people would be willing to accept this. This is how most freemium games operate. The other part that is really frustrating is your decision to slowly release new cards over time. Why on Earth would anyone want to buy packs when there are fewer rares to get and when many of the rares that are needed to make certain decks work are not available? With fewer cards, there is a higher chance of getting a duplicate rare. Getting duplicate rares wasn't as bad when the drop rate was actually decent, but now that it's ****, getting a duplicate just feels like the biggest slap in the face (especially when the conversion rate for dupes is so low). As a player, I really appreciate the open communication about recent issues, but I am frustrated by the lack of any response about the nerfed drop rate for rares. You could easily say something like, we did this intentionally because we thought we had to slow people down because we didn't want everyone to get all the cards so soon, but we don't even get this. Also, it leaves a foul taste in everyone's mouth that this communication always comes AFTER the fact, as if to apologize for not knowing that people would outraged by being mislead into spending money without knowing what the actual conversion rate for money to crystals to rares to mythics to planeswalkers is.

zaann85

All I can say is kudos to Hibernum_JC for doing his job, and making a really fun game. If everyone is so made and up in arms, that means they care and enjoy this game too!

Theros

ChrisTot wrote:

EDHdad wrote:

By way of comparison, a complete set of Battle for Zendikar (274 cards) in Magic Online is about $61. You can use these to play actual games of Magic with actual human beings, some of whom are the greatest Magic players who have ever lived. Sanctum of Ugin, a rare from that set, is 10 cents online or about $1.50 in paper.

If you have a complete set of Battle for Zendikar online, you can pay Wizards an additional $35 and redeem it for a complete set of the paper version of those cards.

Some of the older sets which aren't in Standard (a format which uses only recently printed cards) and which are too old to redeem are even cheaper than that. A complete set of Legions (143 cards from 2003) is available for $5.26. A complete set of Born of the Gods (which is no longer in standard but can be redeemed for paper Magic cards) is $17.86 for 165 cards.

I realize there is a different business model here, but pick any entertainment alternative. A month of Netflix is like $8. A best-selling book on Kindle is probably under $10. A really good board game is maybe $15 to $40.

Problem is, the people in charge of marketing in Netflix are probably trying to achieve a different business model.
In this, and many other mobile games, the people calling the shots care about what the whales are willing to spend.
I have a friend who, for example, spent cash to be able to buy 3 big boxes. Despite the drop in rares, he still received 6 mythics and 10 rares (in 42 packs). He has not uninstalled the game. I have seen a lot of complaints from people on here about the direction the game is going..yet still no uninstalls. The correct price for something is the highest price people are willing to accept. Treat everything going on with this game as its "price" (after all, everything in life has an opportunity cost). By keeping the game installed on a device, people are saying they are okay with how things are going. D3 wins because the whales are still clicking, and the free players are still logging in and at the very least getting their login bonuses. The marketing team can see all of these taps through various 3rd party libraries of code and deduces that people "do" want things to change..but are definitely willing to stick around despite them.

I still browse the forums, but I deleted the app 10 days ago. I hear all these threats of people "wanting" to uninstall..but the reality is..they also want to get their QB rewards. The game doesn't have to change from the direction it is headed because the community doesn't force it to. Vote with your dollars and with which apps are worth even being installed on your phone.

All of your points above are solid. Sounds like you did your research and see this game as obviously more expensive than most forms of entertainment out there. You know this, the people of this forum know this..so this begs the question..why is the game still installed on anyone here's devices? And the answer to that question is the reason why D3 is going in the direction they are: because people will still play the game anyway.

Targeting whales is only effective short time. As of now many people are doing their dailies and and checking the game hopping something to change. Long term those people will be exaussted and whales will spend less.
At that point d3go has 2 options:

Reduce prices as expected in a regular business
Or
Go the SEGA way in puzzle and glory to close servers cause people are not paying at set prices. A decrease in price would have restored faith on game and actually make it more sucessful.

What path will hybernum chose?
I recently started playing and it looks like hybernum is getting less and less fexible and more unforgiving.

Puzzle and glory from sega was equally as good as this game and some thinks it was better. What we can learnfrom sega is that you can't make people spend if they don't perceive any value in time and money invested no matter how good the game is.