How to fix PvE (utilizing the new features)

dkffiv

After some thought I've come up with a pretty clean solution that utilizes all the new features, keeps PvE "competitive" and keeps everyone relatively happy.

The general theme is to keep the format the same but change how placement rewards are handed out. The format is as follows:

1) Treat the format similar to this test event. Revert the first 3 nodes back to "easy" nodes, capping their max scaling at roughly 25-33% the maximum seen on the hard nodes (around 120-140 seems fair if you're normally facing 395 hard nodes). For a developed roster you should see something around 3x level 140 nodes, 3x 395 nodes and 3x 250-300 essential nodes (scaling down accordingly for 2* and 3* rosters).

2) Scaling will be handled like in this test event, no need for community scaling / rubber banding and there can still be a visual indicator for how the node is getting harder with each completion (scaling with each clear seems fine).

3) Each node has 7 rewards and can be cleared a total of 10 times for "full" points (remove all node cooldown penalties) after which the node becomes locked. If a sub is up for 48 hours I would suggest resetting the nodes back to 0/7, 10 full clears again at the 24 hour mark.

*For survival nodes I would change it to the first 3 clears give some type of reward and they can be cleared a total of 5 times before locking out. Survival nodes take significantly longer and I could not bring myself to play them repetitively this event.

The major change that I suggest is that placement rewards are now handed out based on progression. The current progression rewards will be given out as they are now but the end of sub / end of event placement rewards will be given out based on what % of the nodes you cleared. For instance, the current rank 1 (3x 4* and 3x 3* covers) will be given out to anyone who cleared every node in every sub 10x times (which is basically what it takes in current competitive PvE). Totaling points equivalent to clearing every node 7 times (all node rewards) should give out 3x 3*, 8 times 1x 4*, 9 times 2x 4* (numbers can be tweaked). Alliance rewards are also based on progression (rank 1 rewards if all 20 players achieved 10/10 clears, etc).

This would encourage much more competitive play than the Gauntlet format since everyone has to play a fairly large amount (10 clears at ~30m each is 5 hours of play per 24 hours) in a limited time frame but rewards are transparent and more forgiving. Rather than having to clear 9 times every 24 hours (0, 8, 16 hour mark followed by 6 clears before the sub ends) you can pace out your 10 clears throughout the day (one of the stated goals of this test). If you don't want to go for maximum points, you can do a clear or two whenever you have some free time. If you have more free time one day of the week than another, you can do 10 clears on your free day and maybe only 3-5 on your busy, resulting in maybe 2 or 3 3* covers.

Benefits:
-All rosters on relatively even ground (1-3* players might have a slightly easier time from feedback on scaling) and rewards are mostly dependent on time invested
-Friendly to PvP end times as you can time your PvE playtime so as to not interfere
-Same amount of effort as regular PvE but the players are not forced to play at certain times
-Better for random toilet breaks
-Specific rewards (namely new character releases) attainable if effort is placed

-* more competitive than Gauntlet, players will be more willing to spend on boosts / health kits because the clears need to be done within a 24 hour window

kensterr

You had me at "Better for random toilet breaks".

kaelad

I like the PvE test for the most part, but also feel it could use some tweaking. Regarding your suggestions...

1. I agree, those first three nodes are too difficult now. Bringing them back down a bit would be a welcome change.
2. I agree, whatever tweaks they made to evaluating your roster strength seem to have worked well. I wish I could have tested it it on the Simulator event to get a better idea, because 2 of my top 3 were single-cover, boosted 4* characters and the enemy level was too high.
3. I mostly agree, locking out the nodes may be a good idea. A lot of people who consistently place in the top 10 seem to hate the changes, and I think a lot of that hate is because it takes too much grinding to make the top 10 in this new format. When I have all 3 essential characters, like I do in this event, I usually rank 40-70 (3 clears per sub, maybe a little grinding at the end). I think I've played about the same amount of time as before and kept the same ranking. I can see why those in top 10 would need to do a lot more work than before. If the nodes locked out, which would be a necessity if they took suggestion #1, that would prevent the grind. Not sure if the point difference would be wide enough between say the #1 and #20 ranked players as it used to be. That would probably be the trick in figuring out how many times you can play before a node locks.

Not sure about your suggestion on your idea for removing placement rewards. I'll need to think more on that.

For reference, this was my roster at the start of the event. Mostly 2* champions with seven 3* with 8+ covers at level 102.
https://mpq.gamependium.com/rosters/kaelad/revisions/114

dkffiv

kaelad wrote:

Not sure about your suggestion on your idea for removing placement rewards. I'll need to think more on that.

For reference I'm consistently a top 1 finisher for new character releases. The placement rewards aren't being removed, they're changing from being given out based on relative rank to a goal based on the subs pointd. Currently first and second place sub rewards are based on who completed their first 3 clears as close to the 8 hour marks as possible plus how quickly they could complete the final grind down.

Under the new system, everyone who completed all nodes 10 times would receive 2 event tokens plus iso hp and cp. Anyone who was willing to put 5 hours a day into the event could receive the top reward rather than the 2 players who could do it most efficiently (developed rosters tend to have the advantage of efficency). My prediction is that rewards are roughly the same given the same amount of effort but that you could play at your own pace every 24 hours instead of at fixed 8 hour intervals. The system would also be more generous for the top 1% (I've seen several events where 4 players were all doing full clears but there is only room for 2 winners).

Edit: Using the current event as an example:

Progression would remain roughly the same, dropping the final 25 CP reward to 150,000 to make the numbers easier. I would set 225,000 to be the maximum number of points one could earn (netting 3x Xforce and 3x Thor covers at the end) with 157,500 points netting you the top 50 reward (3x Thor covers). 157,500 is 70% of the total number of points, equating to obtaining all 7 rewards on every node. If you did 3 extra clears on the easier nodes you would probably net enough points to earn a 4* cover.

Its not entirely accurate but assuming there were 7 subs (no 48 hour subs) the points would be roughly

Day 1) 2,100 per clear, 21,000 points for 10 clears
Day 2) 2,400 per clear, 24,000 points for 10 clears
Day 3) 2,800 per clear, 28,000 points for 10 clears
Day 4) 3,300 per clear, 33,000 points for 10 clears
Day 5) 3,700 per clear, 37,000 points for 10 clears
Day 6) 4,000 per clear, 40,000 points for 10 clears
Day 7) 4,200 per clear, 42,000 points for 10 clears

This format would eliminate the current problem of late joining / bracket snipes. You would be encouraged to join as soon as you can as well as play whenever possible. What I frequently do for events where I don't care about the reward is to full clear the easy nodes and do the hard nodes a couple of times each - this format should produce similar results with the added benefit that I can multi clear harder nodes during the day if I feel like it for better rewards overall.

XandorXerxes

I don't think that format would really work. Placement rewards are designed to limit 4* rewards, opening them up for anyone and everyone with free time would be going against that philosophy. This especially applies to newer players, who might not know how to maximize points based on the cooldown of nodes or grinding at the end (though I'm sure some could figure it out), and would not normally receive three 4* rewards in a given PvE.

5 hours though, assuming 30 minute clears... credit to those who do that, I'm not sure I could spend 5 hours matching-3 especially day-in and day-out.

dkffiv

XandorXerxes wrote:

I don't think that format would really work. Placement rewards are designed to limit 4* rewards, opening them up for anyone and everyone with free time would be going against that philosophy. This especially applies to newer players, who might not know how to maximize points based on the cooldown of nodes or grinding at the end (though I'm sure some could figure it out), and would not normally receive three 4* rewards in a given PvE.

5 hours though, assuming 30 minute clears... credit to those who do that, I'm not sure I could spend 5 hours matching-3 especially day-in and day-out.

The amount of rewards going out wouldn't be that much different than in the current system. Like you said, 5 hours a day x 7 days is a big commitment.

Unless you started playing more your rewards would be about the same as they are now (perhaps slightly better with the removal of time constraints). If people decided to play more because they like this format, then yes there would be more 4* rewards but there would also be increased activity / exposure (along with increased health pack and boost usage) which should overall increase the company's bottom line.

Philly484

The system fails in the fact that the rewards do not benefit the player after they have done 7 clears of each node. You get nothing for beating a Titanesq type node. Sorry, but that is the biggest flaw of the new system. No reward factor for having to put in more time, especially for competitive play. I think even with resetting the rewards back to the same 7 isn't that good of a reward. From what I notice being int he top 20 in my bracket even some ppl are not fully grinding to 0. Maybe if the reward after the full 7 clear matched the difficulty rating of, it would be well worth it. The reward factor is the biggest issue for me.

dkffiv

Philly484 wrote:

The system fails in the fact that the rewards do not benefit the player after they have done 7 clears of each node. You get nothing for beating a Titanesq type node. Sorry, but that is the biggest flaw of the new system. No reward factor for having to put in more time, especially for competitive play. I think even with resetting the rewards back to the same 7 isn't that good of a reward. From what I notice being int he top 20 in my bracket even some ppl are not fully grinding to 0. Maybe if the reward after the full 7 clear matched the difficulty rating of, it would be well worth it. The reward factor is the biggest issue for me.

I intentionally left out the last 3 rewards as your compensation is rolled into the "placement" (now progression based) rewards. For new characters I end up spending around 10k iso on boosts per day - that iso is what earns me the extra covers. If you only want to clear for the 7 rewards you get 3x 3* covers, if you put the extra effort in you get the 4*.