PVP "etiquette" only works if you use Line.

Nellobee

This topic, yet again, demonstrates that the devs need to change shielding mechanics.

Unknown

DrStrange-616 wrote:

It's not okay to punish someone for your perceived slight or breaking your rules, that's vigilantism.

Without retreading the argument on philosophy, where we clearly differ, let me address this more practically.

At least from where I stand, enforcement against "uninvolved" players (to borrow a term from the late Iain Banks) is exceedingly rare. The kind of "hit this guy on your way up if you see him" stuff is maybe a little more common, but that hardly counts for anything since the first thousand point climb is about hitting guys on our way up anyways.

So no matter how one might feel about applying metagame norms to uninformed players, the actual penalty of enforcement to them is basically nothing. If a player is truly playing the game without any side-channel knowledge, he or she can play the game with negligible consequences beyond the in-built hazards of the game. Less "tar-and-feather the loyalists" and more "stern look at someone who stole your parking space."

I don't know if we have a way to verify that my experience stands generally, since participating in the forums at least partially qualifies you as "involved." But it would surprise me to hear otherwise.

Pylgrim

Hi.

First things first, I want to thank everybody who has participated in the discussion. Both sides have been mostly civil and cooperative. Second, I admit to typing the OP in a moment of intense frustration, so I apologise if I came off as hostile. Third, a few clarifications: I have nothing against Line users or against the use of etiquette among them. it is not only nice, it is also a logical and productive measure. I was simply annoyed by the fact that observing a rule that doesn't benefit me (as a non-Line user) caused me to lose my chance at a cover I badly need (over 2 years playing and my Nick Fury still only has 3 Blue covers).

As others have pointed in this thread, I was screwed by several different factors, but the point was and still is that none of those factors would have come into play if I had decided to just keep climbing as I used to do before I started to consider etiquette. Adding to that frustration was the fact that one of the reasons I'm compelled to follow etiquette is the impending threat of alliance-wide revenge. As much as I agree with the use of etiquette, people shouldn't feel browbeaten into opting in. So I guess the whole point of the post was and is "Etiquette is fine and all, but please don't make me feel threatened to comply if I can't or don't want to." Pretty sure that if the feeling of being forced into a behaviour wasn't in my mind, I wouldn't have felt the need to vent about it as I'd feel fully responsible for my choices.

Finally I do agree with some posters that many of these behaviours and consequences are encouraged by flaws in the system and that improvements to the system would eliminate many of the grievances stated in my post. Now, a few personal responses:

fmftint wrote:

If you're going to play on your own and prequeue nodes, you need to stick to players who's points you can verify, someone in your bracket or in a T10 alliance where you can check global leader board

(and everybody who expanded on this) Sadly, this was a pretty terrible bracket. During my first shield, whenever I checked for targets, it kept rotating between the same 5 30-34 point people. Finding 3 people giving decent points was a rarity, but sadly their points could not be verified. Not once during my whole climb, shields and hops I was presented with any of the top players of the bracket. Many thousands of Iso were spent
in the search, in vain.

mohio wrote:

You may think it's a hassle for yourself to do it only for an event here or there, but most BC or shield check rooms would gladly accept you knowing that you'll only be there for one event, or once a week, etc. The more people that "play nice" the better it is for everyone in the room, so I doubt many would raise a fuss unless you enter the room and start hitting friendlies. Also a lot of people genuinely want to help out other players so they will take you whether you're climbing to 1k at the very end or baking and hopping with 24+ hrs left.

Hmm, I was under the impression that people are kicked from the chats periodically if they are not participating regularly. I'd gladly have joined a chat for that particular PVP since I needed that cover so much, but I didn't want to be a pain in the ****, having someone get me in just to disappear after the end of the event.

PeterGibbons316 wrote:

The exception to this is cupcakes. If you are nearing 1k and find a team of 2*s worth more than you, then you should absolutely wait to hit them. Do another battle or two first and then come back to it, you'll get even more points.

Aren't cupcakes set up right before shielding? How are they going to get more points?

aesthetocyst wrote:

He also makes the groundless assumption and implication that, had he continued fighting and not shielded, that his results would have better. They almost certainly would not have. At that point, he had racked up a lot of exposure time, and was on a lot of radars as an increasingly valuable target.

Finally, he fails to note how long he shielded for, or at what point in the event he dropped shield. If near the 8hr mark, or in the final 4 hours .... yikes. Don't blame these unnamed etiquette pushers for the proclivities of the wild piranha hordes roving at those hours.

It is not groundless. I have done it in the past. I just keep climbing. I may get attacked in the meantime, but usually that only sets me back one battle or two, if I keep finding good targets.

To answer your questions, I had an 8h shield and I broke it around the 6h to go mark.

Ruinate wrote:

Using Line and cooperating is much more fun.

I imagine it can be for some people. However, for me, it represents an additional time commitment. I'm already putting 1-3hs per day in the game, which leaves me with little time to do other things in addition to my duties and responsibilities. Long gone are the days when I could idle in a chat just having fun with the regulars.

JVReal wrote:

Hi Pylgrim, I did hit you last night. It was around the 3 hours to event end mark, and I was getting close to 800. I queued you, and moved to another node, queued someone else, and went to the third node and queued someone else. I hit a lower scoring node first, came back and then hit your node. I intentionally left you alone hoping you'd shield before hitting you. I only recognized your name from the forum, so that's the only reason I remember hitting you. I was hoping you were shielded by the time I hit you. After I hit 800+ I shielded until the end.

I do apologize if you were not shielded when i hit you. Most of my alliance mates are in a different time slice than me, so the shield check rooms don't help me out too much. I can only go by basic etiquette. I didn't hit you twice, I waited an extra fight to hit you since you were my highest point value node at that moment, and I was shielding almost immediately afterwards, so my points were safe for your retaliation on a hop if you wanted it.

s'all good man. You hit me when I had already given up and just let people nibble me down to nothingness.

trat73

So if you were going to use Line, step one would be to install the app. Then what?

fmftint

trat73 wrote:

So if you were going to use Line, step one would be to install the app. Then what?

Find out who runs battle chat for your chosen slice

cletus1985

mohio wrote:
You may think it's a hassle for yourself to do it only for an event here or there, but most BC or shield check rooms would gladly accept you knowing that you'll only be there for one event, or once a week, etc. The more people that "play nice" the better it is for everyone in the room, so I doubt many would raise a fuss unless you enter the room and start hitting friendlies. Also a lot of people genuinely want to help out other players so they will take you whether you're climbing to 1k at the very end or baking and hopping with 24+ hrs left.

Hmm, I was under the impression that people are kicked from the chats periodically if they are not participating regularly. I'd gladly have joined a chat for that particular PVP since I needed that cover so much, but I didn't want to be a pain in the ****, having someone get me in just to disappear after the end of the event.

It depends on the BC you join, some are filled so regularly due to limits that everyone is kicked each event (in which case you'd have no issues being sporadic), others do carry a constant member list and you'd have to work something out each time you're in that chat. As someone who refused to join Line and participate for the same reasons for a very long time, I can tell you it's really not anymore time consuming but very scoring beneficial. Definitely worth the time to download and make a few key contacts.