Respec Idea

Unknown

I know everyone wants the respec system, so I was thinking that they could do it by having people use HP when you downgrade the cover, perhaps at half the cost of buying the cover (i.e upgrade for 1250, downgrade for 625). This way the devs make some money, but we also save money and time by not having to making a whole new character. Although the level would also go down, when you take covers out, which you most likely have to use ISO to get back to max level.

I know many people would not prefer the system be like this, but I feel it is better than nothing and also something that the devs would realistically do.

Thoughts?

Unknown

Nope, even thinking about it for a long time I can't find anything about this approach that would feel even remotely fair from customer perspective. Players almost exclusively want to respec because the game rules were changed, making existing character builds far inferior to new builds. I don't really see why anybody should have to pay to preserve their investment, that's pretty close to extortion. Nothing like saying "Look, we've just made the character you've spent a lot of time and money in far less useful. No worries though, for half the money you already paid we'll allow that character to keep his previous usefulness. You just have to level him up again.".

Unknown

I agree that it's not particularly fair, but with the way things are developing.. this is how I see it happening..

I don't see them giving repecs for free perhaps if they let us take it out for free but the levels go down? That would be my ideal..

I would still rather this than starting again.

Unknown

No. Considering the cost of hp, it should be like 100, 300 max. And we shouldn't lose levels because we should be able to move that cover onto another ability. I thought of respec not as downgrading, but readjusting the covers to the proper build. Or better yet, scrape the 13 cover system and let us max level all of them.

Dayv

Devs have already said the method they're considering is something along the lines of being prompted to delevel a skill when applying a 14th cover. They haven't guaranteed there's no cost, but I hope they make it a free action -- the cost is already invested in the time or HP spent acquiring the new cover.

doc8998

Respeccing should be handled much like any other game where balancing is a continuous battle... If the devs nerf a character, it's on them... A respec should be free of charge when D3 nerfs a character... However, most games will charge some sort of currency to just go in and respec because of "buyer's remorse." (ex: in my own case, I only needed one more card to get Classic Storm to max when she was at 4/4/4... When green dropped, I added it... Looking back, I wish I had just waited it out- I didn't put much forethought into it... I should be charged for respeccing her, and would gladly pay HP (within reason.. at current rate, I'd pop $5 worth of coins to do so, but nothing more.)

The difference is between the Devs forcing you to change your style, respecting the time, effort and money you've pumped into a character & power THEY felt was proper at release, and when they realized THEIR mistake, they should make YOU whole by giving you the respec, as opposed to no one holding a gun to your head to make you drop a card into a power you're uncertain of. In this case, you should then be charged with YOUR error... It's about taking responsibility on both sides of the coin. D3 is a company, they SHOULD be making money off of this; the line gets drawn at when they should be charging and when they shouldn't be charging the customer- Their oversight/ feeling of balancing (one not caught until 4 months later,) is NOT something that should cost the player who may have already paid them real world cash to gain the powers that were advertised. D3 needs to make this fair to the player, while the players need to keep an understanding that there can be a lot of value brought back to the game, as long as the player, in return, remains fair in their expectations of D3.

This also allows for players to test playstyles/ strategies when they start getting near the end of card drops for a particular character, which is a GOOD thing... As long as you're willing to pay, you can take a chance to see if that power you're eyeballing is as good as it sounds in the way you attack your opponent.

Using Thor or Wolverine (although, truly, wouldn't change Wolvie's card the way I have it set up,) as the recent example, with the drastic change in playstyle that many have had to adapt or restart their characters, this should have been a revamp with D3 eating the cost, with the player getting the benefit of a free respec.

However, If you've suddenly changed your mind on say Ares, and don't like the fact that you ballooned his "Sunder" ability, (yellow- does a lot of damage to enemy, but does a chunk of damage to Ares. It then places a 3 turn yellow countdown tile on the board, that when activated, heals Ares, and does more damage to current target,) and you always seem to get caught dying before the 3 second countdown timer restores his health and regret the choice you made, and then wish to swap it to Onslaught, I agree... you should be paying a fee to respec.

In the end, I'm still of the belief that this was POOR planning on D3's part, not having a respec option upon release in a game that they knew would be having dynamic changes to characters as they gathered feedback from players on balancing issues.

Regards,
doc8998

Unknown

Granted, even under the old system, a respec system would have been nice. But considering how much that system changed (remember 20 covers to fully level up an ability instead of 5), I wouldn't be surprised if the cap was created at a later part in the development timeline. Early posts about respec seemed to suggest they were surpised by it. Of course they should be working on getting the system out there, but their time is now split between fixing bugs, generating new content, and programming. Considering the most recent backlash, I bet this isn't top priority. I do hope it comes soon. I think the one in/one out system would work great. I can see charging 50HP/100HP/250HP/500HP for each star level. I also hope that character adjustments and adding a third ability will allow for free respecs.

Unknown

Half the cost and I would possibly consider it. 500 hp for removing just 1 cover as a 4 star is a bit too much. I wouldn't pay it and I'm sure others wouldn't either.

Unknown

I hope they don't do it at all. It's just a prediction. However, if you've gotten to the point where you've fully loaded you 4* character, 500HP isn't gonna break you. I don't think it would be that bad.

doc8998

Blue Shoes wrote:

Granted, even under the old system, a respec system would have been nice. But considering how much that system changed (remember 20 covers to fully level up an ability instead of 5), I wouldn't be surprised if the cap was created at a later part in the development timeline. Early posts about respec seemed to suggest they were surpised by it. Of course they should be working on getting the system out there, but their time is now split between fixing bugs, generating new content, and programming. Considering the most recent backlash, I bet this isn't top priority. I do hope it comes soon. I think the one in/one out system would work great. I can see charging 50HP/100HP/250HP/500HP for each star level. I also hope that character adjustments and adding a third ability will allow for free respecs.

Believe me, I have sympathy for the devs... Their hands are full, I'm sure, and not much positive has been being said on their behalf recently... If you read some of the threads/ posts I've started or responded to, I GENERALLY try to see both sides of the coin. (Admittedly, some of my later posts have gone from attempting to see both sides to some venting, but it hasn't changed the fact that I understand they need to turn profit, but I still stand by some things that frustrate me to no end.)

1) This is the type of game that a respec system should have been in place from the get-go... I'm not going to get into the number of games I have, but it's extensive... unbelievably so. And I have yet to encounter one that has a "dynamic" adjustment system for balancing that doesn't include this very basic feature... heck, I'd even call it an expected feature in place. And when wholesale changes are made to a character/ class, a free respec is given, with the character/ class in question being reset to 0, and the player being made whole again by allowing to change to better fit that character into it's newly designed skillset.

2) The return on Thor/ Wolverine (I AM in the group that doesn't believe they were overpowered... Thor actually seems less like his change was for overpowering, as swapping from red-yellow chain to yellow-green chain isn't that much different in power... It does seem as if the "overpowering" was fixed not as much as the change in power as it was in the fact that most players went with a 5/5/3 to now aiming for a 3/5/5... but that's mostly my opinion... My wife actually had Thor already set up with a 5 in green (she's not much of a gamer, and kind of just went in adding the cards as she earned them, and thanks to a nerf that hasn't really affected her as far as Thor, she's raking it in atm.)

3) The return on the nerf was approx. 1/2 the character's value, (based off what I've read, I'm not sitting down and doing the math, lol) For players who pumped money into leveling Thor's powers, they aren't getting what they paid for, nor have they been given a viable return on what they invested in that was advertised. For those that didn't pay actual cash into leveling the powers, they're now being asked to invest time and effort into a character they already spent doing so... And with the recent change in economy, it's going to take even longer... To create a character they already had...

4) if players wish to rebuild the character/s... And playing devil's advocate, let's say they sell off Thor and/ or Wolverine to earn the "buffed" sale price... They first need to get one of each color via drops or rewards. They'll have enough HP from the sale to level one power... so 4 points to start, that leaves 9 more points they have to account for. If they want immediate openings for these powers (due to no respec,) and choose to purchase HP (remember, this game involves many a casual player who, just by nature, may not have the time nor want to just keep hoping they "place" for a card reward, or earn it via a drop,) that's 4500 HP needed PER character. (if my math's wrong, please correct.) so on top of any money they may have spent initially, MPQ would be asking them to drop, at minimum, $30 for one character... this doesn't include the iso8 they're still going to be shy of... that's coins ONLY... They can get a "bigger" discount if they chose to sell off both, at $55. (again, assuming they want to go an immediate route to "open" the powers.) Then comes the timesink into earning the iso8, which they've already done... I'm not sure what that would add up to in cash if they choose to just pay it out...

5) If they choose NOT to sell off, but wish to rebuild Thor/ Wolvie, yet want to keep them to play in events with until they can rebuild these characters, this means opening a hero slot up and starting from scratch on everything they've already done for a character...

For some, like my wife, who is very casual in gaming, these 2 characters represented her two 85s... These players are stuck in no-win situations with these two characters. (Often the first 2 characters players opt to hit 85 with,) Most beta/ preview games that offer "buy-ins" of real world money, ensure that these buy-in extras are things that will remain with the player even as balancing occurs- things that will NOT be altered, in order for the player to be treated fairly as adjustments are made... Buying into "Loadout" recently, I was given unique taunts/ costumes/ etc that the devs keep in the game even after release, although they may no longer be available upon final release... a "reward" to show that you helped in the early versions of the game. This is something D3 should have ensured by not even having a HP purchase available within the card itself for these characters' powers if they were concerned about balancing. (Again, I truly didn't find either overpowered, was just bored seeing them as part of every roster... The (IMHO) best answer would have been to buff up some other characters... up Iron Man from 50 to 85, for example, or make some other characters more achievable or accessible that would make players challenge who they placed in their roster for events. The answer D3 chose cost players money they've spent, and may cost them more depending on how they choose to go about responding to this nerf... Who's to say that D3 doesn't turn around and find that the "new and improved" Thor's chain of yellow-green isn't out of balance? It's certainly, (again, IMHO,) close enough to the red-yellow, that it certainly seems reviewable, especially now that green was upped in power and now affects all other opponents, as well, whereas red-yellow were single target attacks.

I have a "Devs, please read, possible answer to uproar?" thread started where I gave some thoughts on how to make it fair to all parties involved... Granted, towards the end of the thread, there's a bit more venting than thoughts, but my personal thought was to revert these characters back, (please read other thread, I DID account for how to handle players who had sold off, I'm giving a very short version here,) to their original status with the understanding that these 2 characters WOULD be nerfed in the same patch they introduced the respec. The devs have claimed (there's a quote in that thread from Dev Will, I believe,) where he states its at the top of the list of things they want to add- requested frequently by both players and devs alike. Thor and Wolvie have had these powers forever, it seems... players had their own strategies to use with them and when they faced them, the game wasn't broken the way they were. Nerf these two with the respec when introduced with a free respec given to each for this first time. (all for adding a "paid" respec option for the players who want to do so to test out different builds.)

Respec should have been implemented from the outset just by nature of dynamic, evolving game like this... As it currently is, the answer in place is (as the old saying goes,) "placing the cart before the horse."

I believe those that many who rebuild these characters via time, effort, and money are going to rage again whenever respec is introduced. They initially spent time and possibly cash building these two heroes up, had them torn down, spend more time and money into rebuilding a character they ALREADY HAD, and then along comes a respec, and these same people are going to look back at the time/ money they spent rebuilding as time/money wasted YET AGAIN that could have been used on another character or characters.

***Here's another idea that just popped up as an act towards good faith towards the players that have been affected- Do a similar thing as the Black Widow/ Hawkeye purchases... Add guaranteed Thor/ Wolverine cards at an iso8 cost... Help these players that choose to rebuild (possibly this option only opens up if neither of these are on your current roster,) so they can quickly "get back into the game" with the 85s they had already worked up. As it is, rebuilding for some players, especially casual ones, is a somewhat daunting task considering all factors of random drops, purchasing into unguaranteed decks in the hopes of landing one of them, placing in events for earning these cards, etc... Something should be done that is better than the payout of roughly half the cards worth...***

Thanks for reading,
Regards, doc8998