New Characters VS New Events

Pylgrim

Ever since the end of the Ultron events, the community silently was granted one thing that a seemingly big percentage of its members was asking: a more relaxed pace of release of new characters; to wit: new characters have been released every 3 (or more!) PVEs as opposed to every 2 as it used to be ever since the anniversary, 9 months ago. Since May 3, until foreseeably the end of June (since next PVE after Unstable Iso will be a community-scaling-off event which was promised not to release a new character, only three characters have been released: Vision, 3* Bullseye and Carnage. That's 3 in 2 months instead 4-5.

And to be honest? I am a bit bored. Each new character is an injection of excitement. From the moment it is rumoured, teased and/or speculated, following the reveal, the preliminary understanding of the abilities, fighting to get it, testing a fully covered one in the next event, and then the slower (or fa$t) acquisition of powers and levelling up, every new hero or villain sparks a flurry of interest and playing drive. (DISCLAIMER: I think back-to-back releases are still bad, but I believe that a new character every 2 weeks or so is a fine pace of release). Considering those things, I was made to remember all the times that people have clamoured against new character releases, demanding instead new events.

Now, I have been part of the creative media industry (although not videogames) and I know well the kind of undertaking that something like a new event is; from planning and conceptualising, to design, to production of assets, coding, then testing then iterating dozens of times while cutting through miles of corporate red tape (D3Go, Sega, Marvel, Disney, Apple, Google and whomever else has a staked claim), a new event is a massively time and resources-consuming endeavour. But... is it worth it? Sure, when it is announced and released it will cause a huge spike of player engagement that will last for the duration of the event and hopefully will generate some lasting good will... unless some mistakes leak through and the net player opinion afterwards is constituted mostly of anger and backlash (see the Ultron event). And then what? They are left with a system, mechanics and assets that they can reuse, yes (although only so frequently), but which will generate greatly diminished results with each following iteration. By the third one it will already feel old, stale and repetitive and players will be already clamouring for a new one.

On the other hand, a new character release is comparatively much less work and has a much greater lasting component player-side: It is left in your roster and you are encouraged to acquire all its covers and level it up and then play with it as much as you want. The more characters released the higher chances that you'll get one that particularly resonates with you either in flavour or mechanics and each new one subtly (or not so much) alters the way of playing the game or "meta". So while I believe that new events are necessary from time to time to expand the "roster" of available events and shake things up (and hopefully one day be able to say permanent goodbye to the dreaded "Heroic" events), I have to say that I particularly don't wish for a faster pace of event releases, especially if it comes at the cost of a slower pace of character releases. (Having said that, I'm all in favour of "spiking" old events with new characters and battles and hopefully one day, we'll be able to stop fighting Dark Avengers over and over and over again.)

But this is just my opinion. What do you think?

Malcrof

From your perspective, how hard would it be to re-skin the current game , as is, to end Dark Reign? Adding new storylines and artwork, while leaving the PVE's pretty much the same (rename them of course)

Sounds like that could easily re-vitalize things, especially with all the changes coming (vault etc..)

But to answer your direct question, yes, the current pace of character releases is nice, with the cap at 1000 for a roster slot, it is fairly easy to get in a few weeks, so rostering the new ones is not a massive problem. Sometimes obtaining them is. But that can come with time. I prefer new chars over new events.. but they now have a proven rewarding PVE in the Ultron Event for big releases.


Ultron tokens were the single best thing about the event..

stowaway

I wasn't around during the first run of "Deadpool vs MPQ," but my understanding is that it was so popular it broke the servers. I was around during the first run of Ultron, and that definitely is what happened. They had more people playing the game than ever before. I don't recall a situation where a new character release generated that kind of interest. But maybe there's an example I don't know about? (Also, it's entirely possible that a bunch of people playing a new event doesn't generate revenue the way new characters reliably do.)

I think new characters are important to the game, for the reasons you said. I also think new events are important to the game. I don't think they've figured out the right balance between them.

Vhailorx

A couple of quick thoughts pylgrim:

1) prior to this week, the release rate was unchanged. Although it was sometimes one new chracter every three pve events, the rate was the same: every other week. We just had some shorter one events, meaning 2 over per week, rather than one. This week, the rate MAY have slowed. the current UNSTABLE iso-8 event should have had a character release, and instead it's a rerun of carnage covers. It is, however, a short event, so it's still possible that the second one This week will be a new character release, keeping to the standard schedule.

2) as for boredom, I have found this pace fairly refreshing. There has generally been something to play when I wanted to do so, and there has been a no pressure to grind constantly or stay up late.

That being said, I am sure that many people who do complain about the release rate would also complain of boredom of the rate dropped to one character a month or less. It is hard to please everyone and people are fickle. I also think that much of the character release rate complaints stemmed from roster slot costs. That concern is still real for most players, even with the 1k cap about to be put in place.

As for the new character v. New event split, I think demiurge is right to keep new characters coming faster than new events. It makes them more money, but it also provides more variation that most new events. And this game has more or less abandoned any pretext of story.

Edit: if it wasn't clear from above. I like new events, but am happy with fewer, less buggy events. I would love to see demiurg switch to 3-week character design sprints, rather than the current 2-week sprints. I think that slightly slower schedule would keep the game fresh for most players, and also not crush the players whenever multi-media tie-ins require additional, special releases.

TxMoose

as a transitioner who does NOT enjoy rapid fire releases, I've thoroughly enjoyed playing for cmags and spending more time in pvp, making it to 1000 twice now. no complaints from me. however, I can see that once you get all the key characters covered, there is very little incentive left to play pve hard for punisher or mystique covers that will just be sold for 300 iso. The way I see it, how it sets up, at that stage in the process it seems the devs intend for you to not play pve as much and focus on pvp, especially now that ****s are so much more available with the scoring changes. most vets rave about saying goodbye to pve (other than release events) and truthfully I'd prefer a little less time than I spend on the game. but my roster isn't where I want it to be yet, but I'm hopeful that I hit some events that I don't need awards for so I can take my foot off the pedal every once in a while. considering all aspects of the game - pve, pvp, ddq, LRs - that's a lot of time commitment to a mobile match-3 game and taking out pve would slash that time commitment in half or more. would also leave a hole for hp generation that is required for pvp, so there's that too. now I'm just rambling....

Punisher5784

stowaway wrote:

I wasn't around during the first run of "Deadpool vs MPQ," but my understanding is that it was so popular it broke the servers. I was around during the first run of Ultron, and that definitely is what happened. They had more people playing the game than ever before. I don't recall a situation where a new character release generated that kind of interest. But maybe there's an example I don't know about? (Also, it's entirely possible that a bunch of people playing a new event doesn't generate revenue the way new characters reliably do.)

I think new characters are important to the game, for the reasons you said. I also think new events are important to the game. I don't think they've figured out the right balance between them.

While a new PVE may not generate revenue like a new character would, a new character released on a new PVE would likely generate a ton of revenue. Many players were wishing for a Maximum Carnage PVE for his new character. Think about how great the Grocket PVE was when they were released or Enemy of the State with Elektra. That brings interest in the game and creates cash, not releasing a new character on ISO Brotherhood or Prodigal Sun every month.

Buret0

Adding a new character would require a lot more testing than adding a new event (assuming that the event follows the existing format and isn't a new type like Ultron). A new character actually changes the dynamic of the game. You need to test for broken combinations and for abilities that might interact with the new abilities. A new character should require far more testing than a new event.

A new "event" is mostly a series of nodes drawn on a map with a line leading between them. Between the nodes is a simple graphic of a character speaking in a speech bubble. I don't see how that would be a challenge to add, given the fact that everything is already in place to run these events.

A new Ultron style event, where the dynamic is changed would require a bit more testing, but the tools are mostly already in place. The required character nodes being one time only with a lock timer? How much of a challenge would coding that be? Seriously.

Unknown

I think they mentioned in some video or forum msg that every line of dialogue needs to be approved by Marvel. That's maybe a couple hundred lines along with the scenario plot that needs to get approved. I'm sure bringing in the translators adds to the headache. A new character needs 3 character abilities, and at least a dozen character poses.

Honestly, I'm in the camp of liking more characters due to the new combinations, but I can't help but feel that this is limited to a smaller camp of people. I'd be lying if I said I was as excited about Quicksilver or Scarlet Witch as Colossus, even though I now use both QS and SW more than Colossus. Once your favorite character is in, there's not as much anticipation for the next.

fight4thedream

Interesting topic. As someone who has been very vocal about the need for new PvE and other game modes, i will state that i still believe the game is too heavily focused on new character production at the expense of new content. There are a multitude of ways of injecting new content that shouldn't be as time consuming as designing the next "Ultron" event.

For example:
Guerrilla events that reward HP/ISO
-fight thugs/spies/ninjas with street level characters (Spidey, Daredevil, Punisher, Deadpool etc)
Weekly non-competitive mini-games that introduce a new character
-My pet project Sabertooth Sneak Attack (use 2* Wolverine to fight a 3* Sabertooth mano e mano to get one cover of Sabertooth each week)
- new lightning rounds
race through a mini style gauntlet event to see if you get can get through increasingly difficult nodes for more and more ISO
-Survival mode
(see how many waves of enemies your team can survive for chances at nice progression prizes)

You can make the argument that it will require time to make such events but really besides the mini-games, all of what i suggested already exists in the game and just require modifications here and there to "freshen" the experience.

A problem that doesn't get discussed much since it is the status quo is that the three commodities of the game, covers, HP and ISO, are all awarded together. If they were to separate them and offer unique mini-events with rotating character requirements, it would make for a much more interesting experience.

They could also monetize events by making new events HP buy in (which they sort of tried but with pretty lousy prizes and i do believe all were PvP events). I think most of the longtime players have reached a point that we would even be happy if they just re-skinned goons and DA to Sentinels or monsters or anything else (which they kind of did with the Prodigal Sun event and no one really complained about it. Most people actually enjoyed the first run me thinks).

You are correct by about the third run through of a proper PvE event it loses it's charm. That's why I push for shorter mini-games and events because they should be short, sweet and rewarding. Nothing too fancy but keeps things fresh.

On the flipside, by sticking to the current release schedule and method, there is very little to get excited about beyond the hope that this character might be the next "best" thing. Once a player has a well established roster, they can perform well enough that a new non-meta shaking character is nothing more than a ho-hum moment. No disrespect to KK, Cyclops, PX or KP and now Carnage but my roster does not suffer because i don't have any of them cover maxed, and while I was initially interested in Carnage having seen his animations and skill set I will just say I'm underwhelmed. (It really would have been infinitely cooler if they had taken the time to do a proper Maximum Carnage event with NPCs and buffed characters related to the storyline. I'm hoping they *might* do it if they ever release an Eddie Brock Venom)

Honestly, after they did that back to back R&G event to release both R&G and Gamora I realized the devs priorities and have been pushing them to hire a proper event planner/designer. At the very least, be mindful of a new character's history and relationships and try to buff and require characters that actually are related.

Instead we are left with a system that artificially increases the temporary value of a new character by requiring them as essentials for future PvEs and now the weekly buff thing. Instead of spending so much time tweaking scaling and trying to force the whole player pool to play for the same prizes against the same enemies, it would have been more worthwhile to actually diversify events, offer tiered events, give team boosts if you use characters from the same team or combo (ex: Use three X-men to get an increase in tile damage or 20% increase in special power attack), etc.

What it currently boils down to is that with the exception of personal faves and potential meta-game changers, the more new characters they push through the current game setup, the less I care. And I don't think I'm the only one.

tl;dr- If the devs continue pushing out new characters arbitrarily under the current system, the less interested I become in the game overall. There are plenty of ways to utilize existing material to present "fresh" game events and avenues in which to monetize events. The current character introduction system does not pay homage to the character, their history or relationships and comes off at best as being lazy and at worst disrespectful and exploitative. It's about time the Dark Avengers were retired, goons were left for Noob players to fight and 4* characters got the red carpet treatment. Just sayin.

Buret0

I would actually like to see a story PvE where the story has divergent paths:

If you go this way, the reward is X. If you go this way, the reward is Y.

I would also like it if they did something where if X was in your roster, you could not also roster Y, which would be all about which choice you made in the event and making it matter. From then on, the cover would be listed as X/Y on the token pulls, because you would never receive Y covers if you already had X rostered.

If that wouldn't fly with the collectors (forcing them to start a second account just to have them all?), then maybe having it so that if X is in your party, Y cannot also be in your party (as they already do with the various * variations of wolverines, storms, widows, etc.).

They can make it work with the parallel universe stories that are going on, where the origin stories for the different iterations may have changed due to choices that the characters made in the past.

In order to make it work, both characters need to be equally powerful and in demand, but they can't simply be clones... they need to be distinct enough that they are both equally sought after and valuable. Hell, some people might even sell off their X in order to acquire Y the next time the event gets run.

Unknown

stowaway wrote:

I wasn't around during the first run of "Deadpool vs MPQ," but my understanding is that it was so popular it broke the servers. I was around during the first run of Ultron, and that definitely is what happened. They had more people playing the game than ever before. I don't recall a situation where a new character release generated that kind of interest. But maybe there's an example I don't know about? (Also, it's entirely possible that a bunch of people playing a new event doesn't generate revenue the way new characters reliably do.)

I think new characters are important to the game, for the reasons you said. I also think new events are important to the game. I don't think they've figured out the right balance between them.

Deadpool was prob most popular character release

as for the topic itself, much like LoL, releasing new characters is more important than releasing PVEs, sadly

Punisher5784

Buret0 wrote:

I would actually like to see a story PvE where the story has divergent paths:

If you go this way, the reward is X. If you go this way, the reward is Y.

I would also like it if they did something where if X was in your roster, you could not also roster Y, which would be all about which choice you made in the event and making it matter. From then on, the cover would be listed as X/Y on the token pulls, because you would never receive Y covers if you already had X rostered.

If that wouldn't fly with the collectors (forcing them to start a second account just to have them all?), then maybe having it so that if X is in your party, Y cannot also be in your party (as they already do with the various * variations of wolverines, storms, widows, etc.).

They can make it work with the parallel universe stories that are going on, where the origin stories for the different iterations may have changed due to choices that the characters made in the past.

In order to make it work, both characters need to be equally powerful and in demand, but they can't simply be clones... they need to be distinct enough that they are both equally sought after and valuable. Hell, some people might even sell off their X in order to acquire Y the next time the event gets run.

That would be cool like a Civil War type PVE: Choose a Side. Depending on your choices brings you to a different sub-event. Your choose gives you a different reward path.

Unknown

Punisher5784 wrote:

Buret0 wrote:

I would actually like to see a story PvE where the story has divergent paths:

If you go this way, the reward is X. If you go this way, the reward is Y.

I would also like it if they did something where if X was in your roster, you could not also roster Y, which would be all about which choice you made in the event and making it matter. From then on, the cover would be listed as X/Y on the token pulls, because you would never receive Y covers if you already had X rostered.

If that wouldn't fly with the collectors (forcing them to start a second account just to have them all?), then maybe having it so that if X is in your party, Y cannot also be in your party (as they already do with the various * variations of wolverines, storms, widows, etc.).

They can make it work with the parallel universe stories that are going on, where the origin stories for the different iterations may have changed due to choices that the characters made in the past.

In order to make it work, both characters need to be equally powerful and in demand, but they can't simply be clones... they need to be distinct enough that they are both equally sought after and valuable. Hell, some people might even sell off their X in order to acquire Y the next time the event gets run.

That would be cool like a Civil War type PVE: Choose a Side. Depending on your choices brings you to a different sub-event. Your choose gives you a different reward path.

Anything that brings variety to MPQ I will approve of.

It's sad really, there's hundreds of comics and decades of materials for D3 to use...yet we get cut and paste PVPs and have characters in game who don't talk(and no, not because they're the strong and silent type)