When to level 4*s?

Vhailorx

What is the consensus for leveling 4*?

With 3*, it seems best to wait until one has a handful of well matches 3*s well covered before going up to 150+.

Is the same true of 4*s? Or are the close enough to 3*s that it's worth leveling them above 166 asap?

wymtime

Vhailorx wrote:

What is the consensus for leveling 4*?

With 3*, it seems best to wait until one has a handful of well matches 3*s well covered before going up to 150+.

Is the same true of 4*s? Or are the close enough to 3*s that it's worth leveling them above 166 asap?

It really is a personal preference. With buffed 3* you can hit 1000 without 4*. If you hav a good group of 3* and want to use the 4* go ahead and level away. At level 200-220 they are very usable and won't kill your PVE scaling. If you just take 1 to 270 your PVE scaling will go crazy.
4* are a big investment in ISO so make sure you plan on using them.

simonsez

I'd say it depends on whether or not you have enough covers that it'll make it immediately usable. EG, if your HB has 5 black, or your PX has 5 blue, then it's time. But if you have a kingpin that's at, say, 2/3/3, there's really no reason to tie up ISO in him.

PeterGibbons316

I'm not sure there is a consensus. With the weekly boosted characters it seems that 4* chars see much less use in PvP, and the jury is still out on whether or not they hurt your scaling in PvE (based on my personal experience I tend to think that they do, but that is anecdotal).

I would prioritize getting my top tier 3* characters that are optimally covered to 166 before investing too much ISO in 4* characters. And even the the only 4*characters I would level are XFW, IMHB, Prof X, and I suppose Carnage now.

Vhailorx

PeterGibbons316 wrote:

I'm not sure there is a consensus. With the weekly boosted characters it seems that 4* chars see much less use in PvP, and the jury is still out on whether or not they hurt your scaling in PvE (based on my personal experience I tend to think that they do, but that is anecdotal).

I would prioritize getting my top tier 3* characters that are optimally covered to 166 before investing too much ISO in 4* characters. And even the the only 4*characters I would level are XFW, IMHB, Prof X, and I suppose Carnage now.

I suspect that kingpin and fury are worth leveling too. Less sure about Elektra and starlord. They both have their uses, but are fairly limited.

I am specifically asking this question as I have a perfectly solid e* roster, and have only recently started getting a handful of 4*s to the 10-13 cover range. That is when 4*s can go to 200+ and is, I think, when they really start to be useful. And I assume that the meta will only get more 4*s Centric as demirge makes it easier to get the covers and releases more characters.

It seems clear that levels do at least indirectly affect pve scaling, so I think some caution is warranted. But i also don't think that my pve will immediately be filled with 395s as soon as I put 1 character to 200.

Unknown

My experience is that leveling 4* even with 13 covers is a waste of iso unless you can get them to at least 200-205. They actually become stronger than 166 level 3* at 222-225 I believe.

In the "n-word" era

nerf

I seriously doubt I will ever take a 4* past 250 unless/until the rest of my 3* roster is maxed, and for that matter my 2* & 1* are all at their respective level caps.

I took three 4* characters to level 185, and they were weaker than my 166 3* characters.

Having 20/20 hindsight. If you can be patient I would suggest not leveling 4* until you can go from level 70 to level 200-205 at one time.

Just my opinion; and I don't pretend to be an expert.

Wonko33

the best time to level 4* was last January when they were still worth a damn

Seriously, I start leveling them when they have 7-8 covers and some powers that could be useful. I don't use them in PvP until they are really good (like a 3 red , whatever yellow, 5 blue 4thor was worth leveling)

I use mine in PvE a lot, since most of mine are not PvP ready. saves health packs and all, helps the monotony of playing the same teams all the time. Some of them are decent when boosted in PvE now too. (the boosted ones help you see how good they are leveled up too)

Vhailorx

HiPhoneGamer wrote:

My experience is that leveling 4* even with 13 covers is a waste of iso unless you can get them to at least 200-205. They actually become stronger than 166 level 3* at 222-225 I believe.

In the "n-word" era

nerf

I seriously doubt I will ever take a 4* past 250 unless/until the rest of my 3* roster is maxed, and for that matter my 2* & 1* are all at their respective level caps.

I took three 4* characters to level 185, and they were weaker than my 166 3* characters.

Having 20/20 hindsight. If you can be patient I would suggest not leveling 4* until you can go from level 70 to level 200-205 at one time.

Just my opinion; and I don't pretend to be an expert.

Out of curiosity, which 4*s did you level? I Had a 5/5/3 xforce at 166 pre-nerf and he was clearly better than most of my 3*s. His abilities (once they had 5 covers) were just that good. Post nerf I barely use him, and i wonder if taking him up to 200-220 will make him useable again, if not as awesome as he used to be.

I also have a 4/4/2 imhb (who will probably 5/4/2 next weekend after the season reward cover), and imhb seems like a great all around PvP character these days

Druss

Fairly recently pushed my XF & Fury to 270. PvE is now almost impossible Lv 300+ Jugs, Ares, Daken etc.

Personally wish I had left them @ 166

Vhailorx

Druss wrote:

Fairly recently pushed my XF & Fury to 270. PvE is now almost impossible Lv 300+ Jugs, Ares, Daken etc.

Personally wish I had left them @ 166

That sucks druss.

Did you use the 4*s in pve a lot, or did your scaling go up immediately? Also, there is a lot of room between 166 and 270. I wonder if 200 or 220 would have the same outcome.

Unknown

only 4* worth leveling is kingpin/x/hulkbust/maybe carnage at max cover imo

GrumpySmurf1002

raisinbman wrote:

only 4* worth leveling is kingpin/x/hulkbust/maybe carnage at max cover imo

They're all worth leveling, provided you have the iso and the covers, which are admittedly very large caveats. 4Thor (lvl155) and XForce (221) both carried me through long stretches of Iso8.

The strongest (X, IMHB) are just worth leveling higher or maxing because they can overcome the massive PvE scaling deficit with their (not calling them broken) combos with GSBW/IF.

Unknown

GrumpySmurf1002 wrote:

raisinbman wrote:

only 4* worth leveling is kingpin/x/hulkbust/maybe carnage at max cover imo

They're all worth leveling, provided you have the iso and the covers, which are admittedly very large caveats. 4Thor (lvl155) and XForce (221) both carried me through long stretches of Iso8.

The strongest (X, IMHB) are just worth leveling higher or maxing because they can overcome the massive PvE scaling deficit with their (not calling them broken) combos with GSBW/IF.

i couldnt recommend anyone level xforce starlord susan fury when many 3* are better for less investment

it sounds like u needed those characters due to your roster/personal scaling

dr tinykittylove

4*s don't scale well. It's covers that are most important. I keep mine at the same level as my 3*s and they work fine for me.

Before the nerf and the rotating character buffs/health changes, XF was one of my go-to characters for both pvp and pve. Now he's a bit too squishy to be practical on defense in pvp, but still does a lot of good work in pve and sim.

4*thor I recently got to 525. Pretty awesome when paired with the right support characters.

IMHB also works a treat at level 155, 5/4/3. I have no complaints.

Vhailorx

dr tinykittylove wrote:

4*s don't scale well. It's covers that are most important. I keep mine at the same level as my 3*s and they work fine for me.

Before the nerf and the rotating character buffs/health changes, XF was one of my go-to characters for both pvp and pve. Now he's a bit too squishy to be practical on defense in pvp, but still does a lot of good work in pve and sim.

4*thor I recently got to 525. Pretty awesome when paired with the right support characters.

IMHB also works a treat at level 155, 5/4/3. I have no complaints.

But in the 150a, imhb only has 12I health.

Isnt extra health on of the big benefits of 4*s. Is it worth giving up that advantage?

Unknown

220 is the level when they have 3* match damage, so start tanking colors. Since HP is one of the main advantages to 4*s this is usually desired. Leveling them to 130 puts them at 220 with a weekly boost, so that is the first stop. Then 220 actual. Then 270. It costs more to go 220 to 270 than it does to go from 70 to 220.

Currently I am basically waiting for full covers, since as mentioned the covers mean more than the levels, then leveling the 13 cover 4* to 130 immediately.

GrumpySmurf1002

raisinbman wrote:

GrumpySmurf1002 wrote:

raisinbman wrote:

only 4* worth leveling is kingpin/x/hulkbust/maybe carnage at max cover imo

They're all worth leveling, provided you have the iso and the covers, which are admittedly very large caveats. 4Thor (lvl155) and XForce (221) both carried me through long stretches of Iso8.

The strongest (X, IMHB) are just worth leveling higher or maxing because they can overcome the massive PvE scaling deficit with their (not calling them broken) combos with GSBW/IF.

i couldnt recommend anyone level xforce starlord susan fury when many 3* are better for less investment

it sounds like u needed those characters due to your roster/personal scaling

First, there are not 'many' 3* better than XForce/Fury/4Thor. There's a couple clearly better, and a few more on par. And I also made the assumption that the question comes from the place where you're already an established 3* player, which means you likely have those better ones already completed.

As far as personal scaling, no, I could've done it without them. (I'll use Patch-Loki for a lot of overscaled nodes). But like most PvE, I'll use somewhere in the neighborhood of 25-30 characters to get through it. And it's only because of lack of Iso/covers that there aren't more 4* in that list. I can certainly find places for Elektra or Starlord in that group too.

Turbosmooth

Druss wrote:

Fairly recently pushed my XF & Fury to 270. PvE is now almost impossible Lv 300+ Jugs, Ares, Daken etc.

Personally wish I had left them @ 166

That utterly sucks. Thanks for the warning.
I have my top 12 at Lv144. I am going to try to get all my fully covered 3* and any 4* (about 22) to Lv144 before going up. At Lv144, I can compete with Lv166 in PvP (50%). Still only hitting 500 points in PvP, but I focus on PvE.

So eventually I will get everyone to 166 and it sounds like I need to stay there. But I may park it at 150. That should give me perhaps a 65% win against Lv166 PvP and keep the PvE slightly at bay.

One of my alliance members is wishing she kept everyone at Lv94. And I agree, I found PvE way harder after pushing past that threshold. I didn't understand the scaling until I got a few characters to 135. I can barely pass the last 2 PvE nodes now with boosts on. When I was Lv94, I had no PvE issues and needed no boosts.

I was barely able to stay in the top 50 for Carnage mostly due to PvE scaling. I had to grind for the last 5 hours. Went from 39th to 47th in the last 15 minutes. It was partly my fault for not optimizing point refresh, but it is not possible due to one and a half jobs.

Unknown

GrumpySmurf1002 wrote:

raisinbman wrote:

GrumpySmurf1002 wrote:

raisinbman wrote:

only 4* worth leveling is kingpin/x/hulkbust/maybe carnage at max cover imo

They're all worth leveling, provided you have the iso and the covers, which are admittedly very large caveats. 4Thor (lvl155) and XForce (221) both carried me through long stretches of Iso8.

The strongest (X, IMHB) are just worth leveling higher or maxing because they can overcome the massive PvE scaling deficit with their (not calling them broken) combos with GSBW/IF.

i couldnt recommend anyone level xforce starlord susan fury when many 3* are better for less investment

it sounds like u needed those characters due to your roster/personal scaling

First, there are not 'many' 3* better than XForce/Fury/4Thor. There's a couple clearly better, and a few more on par. And I also made the assumption that the question comes from the place where you're already an established 3* player, which means you likely have those better ones already completed.

As far as personal scaling, no, I could've done it without them. (I'll use Patch-Loki for a lot of overscaled nodes). But like most PvE, I'll use somewhere in the neighborhood of 25-30 characters to get through it. And it's only because of lack of Iso/covers that there aren't more 4* in that list. I can certainly find places for Elektra or Starlord in that group too.

never said they were better, but if u look at character ranking thread its arguable, plus always have to factor in investment

i would not recommend nonCharles/Hulkbuster 4* to players

obviously we are at an impasse if you'd actually think of using elekra starlord

Unknown

Vhailorx wrote:

dr tinykittylove wrote:

4*s don't scale well. It's covers that are most important. I keep mine at the same level as my 3*s and they work fine for me.

Before the nerf and the rotating character buffs/health changes, XF was one of my go-to characters for both pvp and pve. Now he's a bit too squishy to be practical on defense in pvp, but still does a lot of good work in pve and sim.

4*thor I recently got to 525. Pretty awesome when paired with the right support characters.

IMHB also works a treat at level 155, 5/4/3. I have no complaints.

But in the 150a, imhb only has 12I health.

Isnt extra health on of the big benefits of 4*s. Is it worth giving up that advantage?

Ok, but think about it, are you REALLY going to use that 2/2/2 Kingpin, even if he had 8,000 health at level 127? I don't think you are. May as well just wait for a 13 cover 4* before you even contemplate leveling them, they aren't really that useful otherwise.

Unknown

Turbosmooth wrote:

Druss wrote:

Fairly recently pushed my XF & Fury to 270. PvE is now almost impossible Lv 300+ Jugs, Ares, Daken etc.

Personally wish I had left them @ 166

That utterly sucks. Thanks for the warning.
I have my top 12 at Lv144. I am going to try to get all my fully covered 3* and any 4* (about 22) to Lv144 before going up. At Lv144, I can compete with Lv166 in PvP (50%). Still only hitting 500 points in PvP, but I focus on PvE.

So eventually I will get everyone to 166 and it sounds like I need to stay there. But I may park it at 150. That should give me perhaps a 65% win against Lv166 PvP and keep the PvE slightly at bay.

One of my alliance members is wishing she kept everyone at Lv94. And I agree, I found PvE way harder after pushing past that threshold. I didn't understand the scaling until I got a few characters to 135. I can barely pass the last 2 PvE nodes now with boosts on. When I was Lv94, I had no PvE issues and needed no boosts.

I was barely able to stay in the top 50 for Carnage mostly due to PvE scaling. I had to grind for the last 5 hours. Went from 39th to 47th in the last 15 minutes. It was partly my fault for not optimizing point refresh, but it is not possible due to one and a half jobs.

This has more to do with your consistent placement high in PvE ladders and less to do with Fury's level.