PvP Gameplay Updates

Unknown

Hey All,

For those that may not have hit the announcements yet, we recently posted an updated discussing some PvP changes/planned changes for matchmaking, the skip feature and the amount of Iso-8 rewarded after any PvP match.

Here is the original post: viewtopic.php?f=13&t=2819

Thanks!

Unknown

That style of play is only there because your mmr is broken. We were told 100/200 not 70 still included. I am incredibly skeptical of any "improvements" to mmr. This probably just ruined pvp even more for me after you already ruined Pve for me.

Nemek

This is what we were told:

IceIX wrote:

DirigiblePilot wrote:

I think think think that it means that there will now be 4 rewards possible: 70, 100, 140, 200. But I don't know for sure.

Correct, all evenly weighted. This makes the average Iso reward 127.5, up from 105 as current.

Unknown

So basically you can skip twice and still break even compared to before per game (assuming you win, which is less certain now).

Unknown

Nemek wrote:

This is what we were told:

IceIX wrote:

DirigiblePilot wrote:

I think think think that it means that there will now be 4 rewards possible: 70, 100, 140, 200. But I don't know for sure.

Correct, all evenly weighted. This makes the average Iso reward 127.5, up from 105 as current.

Gotcha hadn't seen that post. Still unhappy about it.

Unknown

I don't think the issue was fighting matches for 0 points...it was fighting matches for single digit points while opening yourself up to a 30-50 point retaliation from them...

Unknown

Are we playing a game of chicken? The devs seeing how much they can screw with us before we all quit?

Clintman

Guys, you need to actually fix the MMR and amount of loss you take when someone lower than you attacks you. At least tell me you love me before you punch me in the eye again.

Unknown

Cool a skip tax, now I have to play teams I have no hope of beating. Glad they are fixing the high priority problems for their users.

Unknown

Speedy0307 wrote:

Cool a skip tax, now I have to play teams I have no hope of beating. Glad they are fixing the high priority problems for their users.

Playing and losing is a good way to lower your MMR so that you start playing teams you CAN beat. It's actually a good idea. Having a hidden MMR is stupid if you can always pick your fights.

In theory, this will make the PvP ladder reflect more of a true distribution. The people at the top will have those L141 3* characters and the people in the middle will have the maxed out 2* chars, etc.

Of course this introduces a new problem: the rich get richer. The people with the uber teams get the uber rewards making their teams even harder to beat.

Unknown

Stillhart wrote:

Speedy0307 wrote:

Cool a skip tax, now I have to play teams I have no hope of beating. Glad they are fixing the high priority problems for their users.

Playing and losing is a good way to lower your MMR so that you start playing teams you CAN beat. It's actually a good idea. Having a hidden MMR is stupid if you can always pick your fights.

In theory, this will make the PvP ladder reflect more of a true distribution. The people at the top will have those L141 3* characters and the people in the middle will have the maxed out 2* chars, etc.

Of course this introduces a new problem: the rich get richer. The people with the uber teams get the uber rewards making their teams even harder to beat.

That's actually a good point. On one hand we have people who always win their game, and on the other hand we have people complaining about they're matched with guys who are too tough. Well, if you always win, the system has no option but to assume you ought to be fighting someone stronger, even if it involves you skipping 30 times every time to find the one guy you can beat.

Unknown

What game are you guys making where this is going to work? I'd love to give it a try.

Unknown

Will we soon be charged ISO or HP for opening the app?

Will anyone tell us what is going on with underhanded spikes in costs of shields, boosts or any other in game currency? Most people aren't too happy with the recent changes.

Unknown

Clint wrote:

Guys, you need to actually fix the MMR and amount of loss you take when someone lower than you attacks you. At least tell me you love me before you punch me in the eye again.

They don't love you. And MMR was just fine tuned to properly force the shield usage that was the original aim. (though the y seem to screwed it over with also doubling the shield prices again...)

Announce stated they filter out the 0 pts matches, what is infinite improvement from ground 0. Though they are silent on 1 pts matches, who want to bet if they will be offered?

And as said many times, most cases you don't pick <10 or even <20 fights as that means net loss of points.

In volverine tournament several reports on *-level guy sitting in #1 position, likely due to mmr and matchmaking and the runner-up can't take over only getting max-141 teams. Improved mmr tournament experience for you.

Unknown

D3PCS wrote:

Hey All,

For those that may not have hit the announcements yet, we recently posted an updated discussing some PvP changes/planned changes for matchmaking, the skip feature and the amount of Iso-8 rewarded after any PvP match.

Here is the original post: viewtopic.php?f=13&t=2819

Thanks!

To be blunt, until you guys make it so that a win at 15 pts isn't equal to a loss at 40 pts, the system is broken. no amount of tweaks will change that.

Unknown

pasa_ wrote:

Clint wrote:

Guys, you need to actually fix the MMR and amount of loss you take when someone lower than you attacks you. At least tell me you love me before you punch me in the eye again.

They don't love you. And MMR was just fine tuned to properly force the shield usage that was the original aim. (though the y seem to screwed it over with also doubling the shield prices again...)

Announce stated they filter out the 0 pts matches, what is infinite improvement from ground 0. Though they are silent on 1 pts matches, who want to bet if they will be offered?

And as said many times, most cases you don't pick <10 or even <20 fights as that means net loss of points.

In volverine tournament several reports on *-level guy sitting in #1 position, likely due to mmr and matchmaking and the runner-up can't take over only getting max-141 teams. Improved mmr tournament experience for you.

I attack someone for 20 points. They attack me for 29
I attack someone with 10 points they attack me for 38
I attack someone worth 5 they hit me for 50.
I attack someone worth 40 points they attack me for like 12.

Hmmm. I wonder why I'm skipping so much..... I'll guess I'll go into deep thought and... Oh wait no I'm done. The answer was common sense....AGAIN

Unknown

Phantron wrote:

That's actually a good point. On one hand we have people who always win their game, and on the other hand we have people complaining about they're matched with guys who are too tough. Well, if you always win, the system has no option but to assume you ought to be fighting someone stronger, even if it involves you skipping 30 times every time to find the one guy you can beat.

What immediately takes us back to stupid tanking: you see a strong team at high end you can't win, go in with your ballast members and retreat, get lower, get lower opponent, beat him with actual team for better points. Or issue your tank team as bait and play only retals on unsuspected climbers.

Is that the fun part of the game?

Unknown

pasa_ wrote:

What immediately takes us back to stupid tanking: you see a strong team at high end you can't win, go in with your ballast members and retreat, get lower, get lower opponent, beat him with actual team for better points. Or issue your tank team as bait and play only retals on unsuspected climbers.

Is that the fun part of the game?

Losing is part of playing any competitive game. In LoL (or any other Elo-based game), if I'm not losing half my games, I'm ranked too low.

Let me put it this way: I'd rather "tank" by losing a regular old match than by putting in a **** team and losing a bunch of matches on purpose.

Another way to think of it: for 99% of the playerbase (the ones that aren't on the forums), purposely putting in a team to lose is counter-intuitive and just not done. By making "tanking" part of normal play, normal players can take advantage of it.

Of course none of this fixes the retaliation points issue, but it's a step in the right direction IMO.

Unknown

I'm pretty sure someone else has suggested this but we should get like 5 free skips (like on Pandora radio) before it starts taxing. Then have those free skips regenerate like health packs. Just an idea.

Unknown

The increase in ISO was all I was looking forward to. Disappointed in the result. Disappointment in this game continues.

Unknown

Could you fix matchmaking first? In the latest LR all the teams I got in the last 30 minutes were at least 200 below me. Took 10 skips to find matches worth more than 5 points. That goes into negative ISO territory after the skip tax.