Countdown management and the next Buffs

Nonce Equitaur 2

Usually, the tactic for dealing with Countdown tiles is to kill the owner or match the tile away. Often, though, there are Countdowns in bad places, so it's good to have a power that can handle them. Recent changes have removed some of the options for handling countdowns. She-Hulk lost her Countdown removal ability, and Thor4's ability was bumped to Level 5 only.

Increased health will mean more Countdown tiles go off. Here's the current status as I see it, with a letter grade from AA (good) to FF (bad) purely on how well they can deal with Countdowns. Cheaper powers got a better grade than expensive powers.

BB _7 -- Cyclops -- 8 -> -- Mutant Revolutionary
BB 12 -- Thor 3 -- add 9 -- Thunder Strike
BB 12 -- Thor4 -- convert 3 enemy tiles -- Striking Distance (level 5)
BB 15 -- Hood -- choose blocks to destroy -- Twin Pistols
CC _9 -- Magneto (C) -- 9 tiles become Protect -- Coercive Field
AA 11 -- Captain America -- choose tile -- Star Spangled Avenger (level 5)
BB 11 -- Magneto (MN) -- destroy 5x5 block -- Magnetic Flux
BB 14 -- Black Widow (GS) -- choose blocks to destroy -- Pistol
CC 11 -- Sentry -- destroy 9 red tiles -- Supernova
CC _9 -- She-Hulk -- destroy 16 tiles -- Power Of Attorney
CC 10 -- Cyclops -- destroy random row -- Optic Blasts
CC _6 -- Ragnarok -- Add 4 -- Thunderclap
DD _8 -- Thor 3 -- Add 3 -- Mjolnir’s Might
AA PA -- Falcon -- remove random enemy tile -- Redwing (level 4)
AA _7 -- Invisible Woman -- lock 4 tiles -- Force Bubbles (level 5)
AA 12 -- Captain America -- choose tile -- Peacemaker (level 5)
BB _9 -- Black Widow (O) -- increase timers -- Anti-Gravity Device
BB _9 -- Magneto (MN) -- destroy 21 tiles -- Iron Hammer
CC _9 -- Doctor Doom -- all -> -- Technopathic Strike
CC 10 -- Mystique -- ten tiles to -- Infiltration
FF 11 -- Doctor Octopus -- Manipulation
AA 12 -- Invisible Woman -- explode 3 locked tiles -- Force Field Crush
BB 10 -- Storm -- destroy 14 tiles -- Lightning Strike
CC _8 -- Wolverine X-Force -- destroy 15 tiles -- X-Force
CC 10 -- Rocket & Groot -- Blammo! We Got Ya!
CC 10 -- Hulk -- destroy 8+ tiles -- Thunderous Clap
CC 12 -- Storm (Classic) -- destroy 13+ tiles -- Lightning Storm
CC 14 -- Ragnarok -- destroy random column -- Godlike Power
CC 19 -- Black Widow (GS) -- choose reticle to destroy -- Sniper Rifle
DD 9 -- Beast -- Animal Inside
DD _8 -- Punisher -- destroy 3x3 -- Judgement
AA 10 -- StarLord -- choose tile -- Sleight of Hand (level 4)
BB _5 -- Iron Fist -- 9 tiles to -- Iron Fist of K'un-Lun
BB _5 -- Loki -- swap 32 tiles -- Illusions
BB _8 -- Kamala Khan -- chose color for 7 tiles to -- Inhuman Stretchiness
CC _9 -- Magneto (MN) -- 3 selected -> , 5 random -> -- Polarity Shift
FF 10 -- Daredevil -- Radar Sense
BB _9 -- Storm (Mohawk) -- create 32 attack tiles -- Hailstorm
BB 11 -- Wolverine X-Force -- destroy enemy's strong tiles -- Surgical Strike
BB 11 -- Quicksilver -- swap two tiles -- Idle Hands
CC 17 -- Moonstone -- control Countdown -- Control Shift

Beast and Doctor Octopus should be able to affect Countdown tiles.
Daredevil's Radar Sense should put a Trap icon over a Countdown. When it goes off, he is Invisible to that immediate effect, but others could be hurt if they are out front.

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These are my choices for the most buffable powers.

19 -- Captain America -- Sentinel of Liberty

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reduce cost
17 -- BWGS -- Pistol

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3 3x3 blocks for 17 AP. How about 1 3x3 block for 6 AP?
14 -- IM40 -- Recharge

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Add variable cost
14 -- Hulk -- Smash

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let Anger tiles be 2-count. Invoke "Hulk gets stronger as he gets Angry."
13 -- Colossus -- Fastball Special

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reduce cost
12 -- Spider-Man -- Web Bandages

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something else
10 -- Psylocke -- Bewilder
_9 -- Squirrel Girl -- The Bigger They Are
_9 -- Storm -- Mistress of the Elements
_8 -- Black Panther -- Defense Grid
_8 -- Ragnarok -- Lightning Rod
_7 -- Captain Marvel -- Photonic Blasts
_7 -- Punisher -- Molotov Cocktail
PA -- Deadpool -- Life of the Party

OnesOwnGrief

Make sure to note that after the change, Force Bubbles will need to be at Level 5 to lock countdown tiles. Force Field Crush however only needs the bubble that gets popped to be within the 3x3 area. This allows you to plan for 3 or 5 in Blue depending on how you want to deal with those tiles.

Unknown

R&G at 5 is at least as useful as XF for destroying CDs. Bonus it won't target your own CDs or other friendly specials.

OnesOwnGrief

Lerysh wrote:

R&G at 5 is at least as useful as XF for destroying CDs. Bonus it won't target your own CDs or other friendly specials.

That's really interesting. I was debating on leveling R&G next.

Unknown

OnesOwnGrief wrote:

Lerysh wrote:

R&G at 5 is at least as useful as XF for destroying CDs. Bonus it won't target your own CDs or other friendly specials.

That's really interesting. I was debating on leveling R&G next.

Yea I like him a lot. He's super good at PvE. I've had a 4/5/4 R&G for a long time now, and 5 green is a decent skill, especially by the no XF standard.

Unknown

I'm still kind of bummed out that She-Hulk lost the countdown effecting component of Settlement. Yeah her green needed an overhaul, no question, but the stealth nerf to her blue makes me sad. It was situational, but very useful. Now she's more versatile in terms of being much more team-friendly, but with less functionality.

OnesOwnGrief

Thugpatrol wrote:

I'm still kind of bummed out that She-Hulk lost the countdown effecting component of Settlement. Yeah her green needed an overhaul, no question, but the stealth nerf to her blue makes me sad. It was situational, but very useful. Now she's more versatile in terms of being much more team-friendly, but with less functionality.

Wasn't even a nerf of the skill, it was a complete change. She now buffs tiles she grab and she only takes enemy tiles.

cletus1985

How much did the devs pay you to put Moonstone in the useful list and downgrade OBW to might be useful?

OBW is still my go to for countdowns, put her with a board shaker and you're good to go. Thanks for all your helpful threads Nonce, you've definitely made MPQ much better for us.

Nonce Equitaur 2

cletus1985 wrote:

How much did the devs pay you to put Moonstone in the useful list and downgrade OBW to might be useful?

I do sort them all by cost. It's generally well known that anything with a cost over 12 likely won't be useful unless you have a color generator of some sort.

Iron Fist + Moonstone is a good combo against sniper teams.

Unknown

OnesOwnGrief wrote:

Thugpatrol wrote:

I'm still kind of bummed out that She-Hulk lost the countdown effecting component of Settlement. Yeah her green needed an overhaul, no question, but the stealth nerf to her blue makes me sad. It was situational, but very useful. Now she's more versatile in terms of being much more team-friendly, but with less functionality.

Wasn't even a nerf of the skill, it was a complete change. She now buffs tiles she grab and she only takes enemy tiles.

I wouldn't call it a complete change. It still does approximately the same thing. It takes three special tiles (at 4+ covers), gives you two and the enemy one. The change is that it doesn't convert everything to strike tiles, it buffs your new tiles, and it only targets enemy tiles. That makes her far more versatile, because before if you wanted to use her blue at all you really couldn't use her optimally with anyone who relies on special tiles, and that's a large list. Now she plays nice with pretty much anyone, given the usual color combination concerns.

But the fact that her blue doesn't target enemy countdown tiles anymore is definitely a nerf. It was excellent at shutting down goons and other countdown producing characters in some situations, and now that part of her utility is gone. All around the changes make her "better", if only because her green was such a train wreck before, but it still stands that she can't do something very useful anymore that she formerly was able to do.

Sword user

Nonce, you overcosted OBW's blue, its cost is 9 blue. Also, Mystique blue is 10 now, too.

Nonce Equitaur 2

Sword user wrote:

Nonce, you overcosted OBW's blue, its cost is 9 blue. Also, Mystique blue is 10 now, too.

Yep... I just updated Mystique everywhere. Doesn't look like the devs actually posted the March character changes, but they talked about them in a video.

I changed things to a letter grade so I could sort by color.

Nonce Equitaur 2

Countdowns and special tiles will be a major part of the Ultron event, so I thought this was worth bumping. From Turul's speculation's post

turul wrote:

Ultron Prime (probably unplayable)
- (every turn passive) creates a "drop tile", which deals damage when it arrives to the bottom row.
- (every turn passive) destroys the bottom row
- cannot be stunned

Ultron Ultimate (probably playable)
- AOE DMG
- creates CD tiles which stun + drain strongest AP
- (every turn passive) Copies a friendly special tile next to the original. (atk/prot/strike tile)
- cannot be stunned

The new PVE will be at least two chapters, meeting both Ultron versions above.

If the drop tiles do damage when Ultron destroys them, then She-Hulk will be a major player, since she can reliably destroy the lower row.

In particular.

BB _7 -- Cyclops -- 8 -> -- Mutant Revolutionary
AA 11 -- Captain America -- choose tile -- Star Spangled Avenger (level 5)
BB 11 -- Magneto (MN) -- destroy 5x5 block -- Magnetic Flux
AA PA -- Falcon -- remove random enemy tile -- Redwing (level 4)
AA _7 -- Invisible Woman -- lock 4 tiles -- Force Bubbles (level 5)
AA 12 -- Captain America -- choose tile -- Peacemaker (level 5)
BB _9 -- Black Widow (O) -- increase timers -- Anti-Gravity Device
BB _9 -- Magneto (MN) -- destroy 21 tiles -- Iron Hammer -- Or destroy whole board.
FF 11 -- Doctor Octopus -- Manipulation
AA 12 -- Invisible Woman -- explode 3 locked tiles -- Force Field Crush
CC 10 -- Rocket & Groot -- Blammo! We Got Ya!
CC 10 -- Hulk -- destroy 8+ tiles -- Thunderous Clap
CC 19 -- Black Widow (GS) -- choose reticle to destroy -- Sniper Rifle
DD 9 -- Beast -- Animal Inside
AA 10 -- StarLord -- choose tile -- Sleight of Hand (level 4)
BB _5 -- Iron Fist -- 9 tiles to -- Iron Fist of K'un-Lun
BB _5 -- Loki -- swap 32 tiles -- Illusions
BB _8 -- Kamala Khan -- chose color for 7 tiles to -- Inhuman Stretchiness
FF 10 -- Daredevil -- Radar Sense
BB _9 -- Storm (Mohawk) -- create 32 attack tiles -- Hailstorm
BB 11 -- Quicksilver -- swap two tiles -- Idle Hands


I'll try to update this as we figure out what's effective.

scottee

Wait, but I thought this was a non-issue since the forum seems to think countdowns are useless...

They're probably nerfing all the countdown removals to make Starlord the best 4*.

Nonce Equitaur 2

Countdowns are good when you have a lot of them, or when you can place them. They are bad when they are expensive, random, and immediately matched away.

Enemies generate lots of countdown, and it seems Ultron will do the same, so good Countdown handling will be important.

Prediction -- Captain America, Invisible Woman, Magneto MN will see a lot of use.

GuntherBlobel

For those with a Lvl 5 X-Force , don't forget that he trashes half the board (including CDs) for 16 AP. It's a silver-lining at least.

Pylgrim

Beast's Yellow needs to be in the list of buffable powers. Even after the buff, the best that can be said of it is "slightly better than Web Bandages", not precisely the highest of praise.

Also, both of the other IM40 powers and Quicksilver powers likely need to be tooled up to their pre-nerf values.

Unknown

One glaring omission from the list is the 2* Ms Marvel yellow ability. That can convert ANY non-team up into a team-up, including CD tiles. It only costs 7 AP, meaning it is usually pretty easy to fire off, and often causes cascades and board shakes, possibly making non-eliminated CD's to be easier to reach!

Unknown

Nonce Equitaur 2 wrote:

Daredevil's Radar Sense should put a Trap icon over a Countdown. When it goes off, he is Invisible to that immediate effect, but others could be hurt if they are out front.

This is the truest thing ever. And it would make Radar Sense/Dare Devil really fun to play against goons.

Malcrof

SuperRed wrote:

One glaring omission from the list is the 2* Ms Marvel yellow ability. That can convert ANY non-team up into a team-up, including CD tiles. It only costs 7 AP, meaning it is usually pretty easy to fire off, and often causes cascades and board shakes, possibly making non-eliminated CD's to be easier to reach!

Usually save up for 2 blasts, and you can reset the entire board.

Missed:
GSBW you can create lines of 4 to wipe out countdowns

GuntherBlobel

I feel like you are over-weighting AP costs when rating these powers, since they increase in effect with additional AP, but don't spend more than their initial cost:

CC 10 -- Rocket & Groot -- Blammo! We Got Ya!
CC 10 -- Hulk -- destroy 8+ tiles -- Thunderous Clap
CC 12 -- Storm (Classic) -- destroy 13+ tiles -- Lightning Storm

At 30 AP, which is very achievable in survival nodes, these powers absolutely wreck the board and can be fired 3X if needed.

2* Storm is really the big winner here, because at 30 AP, she'll smash half the board and recharge her skill half-way. On average, 30 AP will fire Lighting Storm 3X and ultimately destroy around 90 tiles.

I know, I know, PvP is the only game there is...