4-Star Design Issues?

Omega Blacc

I commend D3 on the changes they've made to keep the game fun and interesting. I hate to be one of the many, many squeaky wheels around here, but I'd like to throw an observation out there: 4-star characters.

I am completely underwhelmed by the choice of Kingpin as a 4-Star...along with Elektra and Star-Lord. Star-Lord?! Really?

I get that these may be business decisions to coincide with current Marvel media promotions (comics, movies, etc.) but these characters are hardly worth "Legendary" status. Before you go and say "well, it's a game not a comic" let me explain why I think some of these characters have been subpar.

I think they have been subpar because the nature of the character dictates the moveset. Look at Prof. X vs. Kingpin. You mean to tell me that KINGPIN should have a weak moveset but hit for STUPID damage at max level because he's a four? I don't agree with that. Why is Kingpin a higher status than two of the Wolverines, Spider-Man or even Daredevil himself? Because he was released later? Because they need more 4's? Meh.

Now you tie your hands as a developer because Gambit will be dropping soon (hopefully) and you want to make him a 3. He'll have infinitely cooler abilities than a majority of the 4's by the very nature of his character...except he won't be hitting harder at max level than a Star-Lord, Elektra, or effin' Kingpin.

I understand the small pool of characters in the beginning of this game dictated who was created and what levels they were designed with. D3 did a great job most of the time. I'd just like to see some 4's worthy of the title. Where are Dr. Strange, Mr. Fantastic, and Silver Surfer? Where is Jean Grey? How are Dr. Doom, Spider-Man or Magneto not worthy of "Legendary" status?

Honestly, I think the last 3 characters they got dead-on right were Cyclops, Iron Fist, and Cage.

Heck...maybe take some characters as is and give them a buff and raise them a star. OK, maybe that's asking too much.

DrNitroman

Well, It's just my opinion but I think it would be difficult to try having the power of a character in game that matches his actual (?) power in the comics.

For me the normal level of play is the 3 rarity level and all characters of this level are supposed to be able to fight each other.
1 and 2 * are here as a training curve toward the 3* and 4* correspond to character more rare, more powerful (?) or with... different powers! One day the normal level of play of MPQ will slip toward 4* but it's not the case now.

As they stand, 4* have a legendary status, you're right. But don't forget only a part of MPQ players will manage to earn a few 4* covers and only the most hardcore players will actually play with them. Therefore it would not be a smart move of the devs to make very popular characters as 4*: this would just upset a lot of players who like these characters but can't get them!

GuntherBlobel

They're Legendary in the sense that you've heard that 4* characters are in the Cover Packs, but you've never actually opened one. It's rarity, that's all: semi-exclusive content. As far as I can tell, all the F2P games use this same gimmick. I have an ultra-rare HearthStone card that randomly helps or hurts me. I'd never use it, but it's unique!

They wouldn't match character power to rarity anyway, because then most people would only get to play their least favorite Marvel characters. They said as much in a recent Q&A. Makes sense to me.

Unknown

Omega Blacc wrote:

I am completely underwhelmed by the choice of Kingpin as a 4-Star...along with Elektra and Star-Lord. Star-Lord?! Really?

Let me tell you why Kingpin is a 4* character. Because he is tinykitty Kingpin. And Star-Lord makes a certain amount of sense as the "Leader" of the Guardians, even if his power set is kinda meh.

Omega Blacc wrote:

Now you tie your hands as a developer because Gambit will be dropping soon (hopefully) and you want to make him a 3. He'll have infinitely cooler abilities than a majority of the 4's by the very nature of his character...except he won't be hitting harder at max level than a Star-Lord, Elektra, or effin' Kingpin.

This is an assumption on your part, and a poor one I think. At the core basically every character in this game is the same. 3 colors, match tiles, use powers, watch animations. If Gambit is infintely cooler it's not because of his abilities. It's a perception you have.

Omega Blacc wrote:

I understand the small pool of characters in the beginning of this game dictated who was created and what levels they were designed with. D3 did a great job most of the time. I'd just like to see some 4's worthy of the title. Where are Dr. Strange, Mr. Fantastic, and Silver Surfer? Where is Jean Grey? How are Dr. Doom, Spider-Man or Magneto not worthy of "Legendary" status?

So the game doesn't line up with your perceptions. There may very well come a time when there are Spider-Man and Magneto 4* variants. I think of the 1*/2*/3*/4* character variants as parts of a characters path. They started out in yellow spandex, went through a weird tuxedo phase, and now are all black and shiny. They are already releasing too many characters at a time, and you want them to do MORE 4*s? Really?

Omega Blacc wrote:

Honestly, I think the last 3 characters they got dead-on right were Cyclops, Iron Fist, and Cage.

Heck...maybe take some characters as is and give them a buff and raise them a star. OK, maybe that's asking too much.

If they are going to continue releasing 4* characters (and all evidence suggests they will) I'd much rather see new and intersting characters in (and this is the important part) new an interesting stories. Enemy of the State was fun, and a good way to showcase Elektra when she was released. Could she have been a 3* character? Probably, but ultimately it doesn't matter. Let the game showcase their "Legendary" characters to support why they are legendary in the first place.

Omega Blacc

Lerysh wrote:

Omega Blacc wrote:

I am completely underwhelmed by the choice of Kingpin as a 4-Star...along with Elektra and Star-Lord. Star-Lord?! Really?

Let me tell you why Kingpin is a 4* character. Because he is tinykitty Kingpin. And Star-Lord makes a certain amount of sense as the "Leader" of the Guardians, even if his power set is kinda meh.

Omega Blacc wrote:

Now you tie your hands as a developer because Gambit will be dropping soon (hopefully) and you want to make him a 3. He'll have infinitely cooler abilities than a majority of the 4's by the very nature of his character...except he won't be hitting harder at max level than a Star-Lord, Elektra, or effin' Kingpin.

This is an assumption on your part, and a poor one I think. At the core basically every character in this game is the same. 3 colors, match tiles, use powers, watch animations. If Gambit is infintely cooler it's not because of his abilities. It's a perception you have.

Omega Blacc wrote:

I understand the small pool of characters in the beginning of this game dictated who was created and what levels they were designed with. D3 did a great job most of the time. I'd just like to see some 4's worthy of the title. Where are Dr. Strange, Mr. Fantastic, and Silver Surfer? Where is Jean Grey? How are Dr. Doom, Spider-Man or Magneto not worthy of "Legendary" status?

So the game doesn't line up with your perceptions. There may very well come a time when there are Spider-Man and Magneto 4* variants. I think of the 1*/2*/3*/4* character variants as parts of a characters path. They started out in yellow spandex, went through a weird tuxedo phase, and now are all black and shiny. They are already releasing too many characters at a time, and you want them to do MORE 4*s? Really?

Omega Blacc wrote:

Honestly, I think the last 3 characters they got dead-on right were Cyclops, Iron Fist, and Cage.

Heck...maybe take some characters as is and give them a buff and raise them a star. OK, maybe that's asking too much.

If they are going to continue releasing 4* characters (and all evidence suggests they will) I'd much rather see new and intersting characters in (and this is the important part) new an interesting stories. Enemy of the State was fun, and a good way to showcase Elektra when she was released. Could she have been a 3* character? Probably, but ultimately it doesn't matter. Let the game showcase their "Legendary" characters to support why they are legendary in the first place.

You're absolutely right. That's a lot of assumption on my part. It all sounded decent as I was typing it.

Last thing I wanted to do was become "one of those guys". My roster is strong and I really have nothing to complain about.

Everyone has different character tastes. heck my favorite character is Archangel and I doubt we'll ever see him in MPQ.

I'll let the developers develop, and I'll just wait and see what happens next. I don't care for Kingpin so I'll just leave him off the roster. that simple.

The odds of me collecting him without using $$$ are very low as it is.

SymmeTrey

I see what you're saying but I think the point about rarity is a good one. I also think that, as has been stated repeatedly, the battle that is playing out isn't necessarily a physical one between the participants. It's a RPG that requires some imagination.

When Professor X takes a Repulsor Blast to the face, it could actually be that he used his powers to somehow mitigate the blast but doing so drained him, reducing his "health. It's much like "hit points" in any role playing game. When your warrior took that 12 damage, he might not have been physcially cut but spent so much energy avoiding the blow that he left himself drained and more open to future attacks.

When facing Kingpin, you are probably not in a fistfight with him (although he is imposing), you are likely facing him and his army of goons and whatever plans/traps he has hatched for you. This even seems somewhat indicated by his countdown power. When he takes a Repulsor Blast to the face, perhaps it was actually a goon (or group of goons) that took that blast before you could reach Kingpin... you reduced his health (or army of goons). Perhaps his hit points are more indicative of battling a group of bad guys, not just Kingpin, man-to-man. From this perspective, Kingpin is a strong opponent... even though he may not be Thanos or Ultron, I would probably take him over Gambit any day of the week.

Unknown

IMO they got cyclops red all wrong, he's supposed to be an expert and dead on with his blasts, why would they make it a random row? That's giving him 0 precision for an ability he is proficient in. There is quite a few things i dislike about him especially his costume, I like his blue and yellow 90's one the best. I do like his black blast and his animation and how it goes all over the place. While I would love to be able to choose what row to hit, I guess the point is I'm pretty critical in my opinions which some I'll just leave out because he is my favorite character. While I do agree with you that there is a lot better character to choose for 4* I'm sure it revolves around advertising more than who is better than who in some cases. I think the Daredevil series is going to be premiering this month on Netflix.

rednailz

I'd have to agree that Kingpin is a 4* in the sense that he's a gaint crime boss and his goons come into his power and * rating. He can also throw down with 3* like spidey, DD and punpun. But most of KP's powers seem to make him like the boss he is, not some heavy hitter with powers that are his. They are more like his overall powers. Don't forget DD and friends have to make it through a HEAP of goons to even get in the same room as the big man.

For SL, meh, but he's the leader of GoT which is a big deal now. Elecktra is just a joke.

I get the fanboy outrage of 90's Cyc not being the 3*, but I kinda get it - although I'm biased. IMO the mordern Cyc is more powerful, dangerous and more of a leader than the 90's cyc he tended to whine a lot and get a lot more support from Prof X and others. Teh 80's Cyc wasn't that big of a deal and he was mostly a leader in name and followed around Jean and Logan most of the time....he did some ok plans. The modern one seems much stronger, and more badass. I never was a fan of the old cyc, but the new one has one me over. But that's opinion, nothing more.

I don't think spidey is a 4* by any means. Perhaps black suit spidey....which I could see them releasing as a 4*, or cosmic spidey, which was kind of a silly gag phase. I agree Doom and Mags should be 4*....I mean the crime boss theory for KP could easily work for Doom too, who has actually caused way more and way larger problems in the marvel univers.

the rating system gets tough when you're putting guys like punisher or DD in with guys like sentry or hulk. There's a big difference between taking on crime thugs, or taking on gaint powerful beasts from another planet ,ect. ect

Eddiemon

Omega Blacc wrote:

I get that these may be business decisions to coincide with current Marvel media promotions (comics, movies, etc.) but these characters are hardly worth "Legendary" status. Before you go and say "well, it's a game not a comic" let me explain why I think some of these characters have been subpar.

4* denotes the rarity of covers and the character power is derived from that.

It is not and never has been an opinion on where any individual character sits in the Marvel hierarchy. Hell Wolverine is represented 3 times at 3 different tiers. None of the 3 times represent him at a time when he didn't have adamantium so how can you be logically seeing it as a reflection of power or movesets?

Similar questions can be raised over Thor or Spiderman. And while 4* Thor may have the powers of Thor, she doesn't have the knowledge of an ancient being like Thor, so there isn't any logical way she could be more powerful or legendary than someone who has lived for generation untold in differnt incarnations.

Storm and Black Widow also get 3 representations in 3 different power tiers.

And if you are trying to turn it into a popularity contest then explain Ragnarok (Clor) being 3* while hawkeye and Iron Man start at 1*.

So no, the * rating is based on how you obtain the covers and isn't any reflection on where the character sits in the Marvel Pantheon.

morph3us

Spiderham wrote:

IMO they got cyclops red all wrong, he's supposed to be an expert and dead on with his blasts, why would they make it a random row? That's giving him 0 precision for an ability he is proficient in.

Explanation below (warning, spoilers, if you haven't read the comics):

It's because his powers aren't working properly after the whole Phoenix Five debacle, so it's actually well characterised in this instance. He's got the same problem in the current comic run.