Player X vs The Hunt: Based on a True Story
There are claims that the devs are out of touch with high level play. While I like to think that is not true, I can’t help but wonder how devs could claim they are worried about our sleep schedule while still giving us the nightmare that is The Hunt.
Prologue
Player X (fictional in-game name) has played MPQ for almost half a year. He is in a top PvE alliance. He has a job. He has a decent PvE roster and enjoys collecting 4-star characters. He has not spent money in MPQ. In this story, he has decided that Prof X is awesome and worth going for.
The Hunt starts. Player X searches the forums for the previous Hunt data. He recalls that the Hunt is one of the most difficult events ever with overlapping subs. He decides to go for a time slot where he has at least 3 hours to play when any sub event ends—9PM, which alternates into 9AM.
Day 1
I hope you guys enjoyed this little horror story. I contemplated making a comic version of this into a video and get 1000 views, but I'm not sure if it would qualify as "gameplay".
C’mon, devs. Overlapping subs with 12 hour offsets is not going to give you 8 hours. The hours required for placing #1 is probably beyond your imagination. To help you devs understand what your events are like, I am providing below a fictional recount of the effort it took to place #1 in The Hunt for Prof X.Demiurge_Miles wrote:Hey All,
Why 8hrs? Well there's a few reasons. We think 8hrs has a good natural rhythm to it, allowing for several satisfying play sessions throughout the day. On top of that, more than 50% of players voted for 8+hrs in this poll from a month ago: viewtopic.php?f=7&t=20373
Also, we're worried about people feeling like they need to wake up in the middle of the night to play our game. Seriously, we're super happy that you're committed to the game, but please don't ruin your sleep schedule. Sleep is good for you.
Prologue
Player X (fictional in-game name) has played MPQ for almost half a year. He is in a top PvE alliance. He has a job. He has a decent PvE roster and enjoys collecting 4-star characters. He has not spent money in MPQ. In this story, he has decided that Prof X is awesome and worth going for.
The Hunt starts. Player X searches the forums for the previous Hunt data. He recalls that the Hunt is one of the most difficult events ever with overlapping subs. He decides to go for a time slot where he has at least 3 hours to play when any sub event ends—9PM, which alternates into 9AM.
Day 1
9AM. After communicating with his alliance to spread out the members into different brackets, Player X aims for the second new bracket in his time slice. Lunch time comes around, and Player X goes shopping for frozen lunches to fill the freezer in his office.
7PM. It is after work, and alliance members call out that the new bracket is ready. Player X joins the new bracket and makes his first run through all the nodes in Alaska 1, jotting down the enemy levels. He sets an alarm on his iPad for 3AM, for the next refresh in 8 hours. Player X then heads home and has dinner.
10PM. Florida 1 had opened an hour ago. Player X laments forgetting about the simultaneous sub as he starts playing through Florida 1. Player X notes the enemy levels as he plays through it. He then spends the rest of the night like many of us--Deadpool Daily Quest and some PvP. He heads for bed at 12AM.
Day 2
7PM. It is after work, and alliance members call out that the new bracket is ready. Player X joins the new bracket and makes his first run through all the nodes in Alaska 1, jotting down the enemy levels. He sets an alarm on his iPad for 3AM, for the next refresh in 8 hours. Player X then heads home and has dinner.
10PM. Florida 1 had opened an hour ago. Player X laments forgetting about the simultaneous sub as he starts playing through Florida 1. Player X notes the enemy levels as he plays through it. He then spends the rest of the night like many of us--Deadpool Daily Quest and some PvP. He heads for bed at 12AM.
3AM. Alarm clock rings and Player X gets out of bed to avoid falling back asleep. He completes Alaska 1, and sets alarm for 6AM. He then goes back to sleep. He needs all the sleep he can get.
6AM. Alarm rings again, this time Florida 1. Player X plays through it while half-awake. After that’s done, Player X sets an alarm for 8AM so he can wake up for work.
8AM. Alarm rings. Player X wakes up by checking alliance messages. He also sets alarm for 11AM for the next refresh of Alaska 1. Then Player X goes to work.
11AM. Player X turns off the alarm before it rings. He spends 30 minutes finishing up work before he starts his lunch break, where he plays Alaska 1 while eating frozen food. He updates his Google doc data on scaling. He then completes Florida 1 a bit early to avoid playing during work.
7PM. Player X gets off work and starts grinding Alaska 1 in the office for 2 hours. Frozen food is consumed somewhere in this timeline. Immediately following that, he completes the first pass of the newly opened Savage 1, followed by a refresh of Florida 1. It is now 10:30. He heads home to play Deadpool.
Day 3
6AM. Alarm rings again, this time Florida 1. Player X plays through it while half-awake. After that’s done, Player X sets an alarm for 8AM so he can wake up for work.
8AM. Alarm rings. Player X wakes up by checking alliance messages. He also sets alarm for 11AM for the next refresh of Alaska 1. Then Player X goes to work.
11AM. Player X turns off the alarm before it rings. He spends 30 minutes finishing up work before he starts his lunch break, where he plays Alaska 1 while eating frozen food. He updates his Google doc data on scaling. He then completes Florida 1 a bit early to avoid playing during work.
7PM. Player X gets off work and starts grinding Alaska 1 in the office for 2 hours. Frozen food is consumed somewhere in this timeline. Immediately following that, he completes the first pass of the newly opened Savage 1, followed by a refresh of Florida 1. It is now 10:30. He heads home to play Deadpool.
5AM. Alarm rings. Player X gets up to complete Savage 1 followed by Florida 1. At 6:30AM he heads to work.
7AM. Work doesn’t start until 9:30. Player X microwaves some frozen food for breakfast, and eats while he grinds to complete Florida 1.
9AM. Florida 1 finishes and Alaska 2 opens. Players X starts rushing through Alaska 2 with boosts, so he can finish it before work starts.
11AM. Work is lighter today so Player X takes an early lunch break to complete Savage 1. He then checks his afternoon and schedules a “bathroom break” at 5PM for Alaska 2.
5PM. “Bathroom break”. In Alaska 2. 'Nuff said.
7PM. Player X gets off work. It’s Friday! But Player X goes home so he can get ready for the next grind.
9PM. Savage 1. Player X then spends a relaxing night updating scaling data. Enemy levels are getting incredibly high. Player X strategizes with alliance mates and concludes that early grind is better than no grind.
1AM. Alaska 2. Player X plays carefully, because scaling is getting high and he needs all the health packs he can get to score high on Savage 1. He sets an alarm for 3AM, when his health packs regen to full. He then goes to bed.
Day 4
7AM. Work doesn’t start until 9:30. Player X microwaves some frozen food for breakfast, and eats while he grinds to complete Florida 1.
9AM. Florida 1 finishes and Alaska 2 opens. Players X starts rushing through Alaska 2 with boosts, so he can finish it before work starts.
11AM. Work is lighter today so Player X takes an early lunch break to complete Savage 1. He then checks his afternoon and schedules a “bathroom break” at 5PM for Alaska 2.
5PM. “Bathroom break”. In Alaska 2. 'Nuff said.
7PM. Player X gets off work. It’s Friday! But Player X goes home so he can get ready for the next grind.
9PM. Savage 1. Player X then spends a relaxing night updating scaling data. Enemy levels are getting incredibly high. Player X strategizes with alliance mates and concludes that early grind is better than no grind.
1AM. Alaska 2. Player X plays carefully, because scaling is getting high and he needs all the health packs he can get to score high on Savage 1. He sets an alarm for 3AM, when his health packs regen to full. He then goes to bed.
3AM. Player X wakes up to alarm and attempts the hardest nodes in Savage 1. He wins once but fails twice. So much for “winfinite.” He uses 4 health packs, sets alarm for 5AM, and then goes back to bed.
5AM. Player X gets up. It’s Saturday, which means it’s time to MPQ like mad. He spends the next 3.5 hours grinding Savage 1, which ends at 9AM. The remaining 30 minutes are spent on Alaska 2, which also refreshes at 9AM.
9AM. Savage 1 ends, but Player X is furiously rushing through Alaska 2, which is getting fairly difficult. He is 10 minutes late to Florida 2 starting, but he has also solidified his placement in his bracket. It is 10AM by the time that is all over. He goes to make some breakfast after the grueling 5 hour grind. He then sets alarm for 12PM and goes to take a nap.
12PM. Player X wakes from his nap, slightly recharged. He plays some Deadpool followed by a slightly early run of Alaska 2 so he can be on-time for Florida 2 refresh, which is worth more points than Alaska. It is now 2PM, and Player X relaxes by having lunch while reading up on alliance mates griping about scaling.
3PM. Player X uses some health packs doing early attempts on the hardest node in Alaska 2, where even a tiny cascade on the enemy side equals instant death. He spends some health packs and sets alarms for when health packs are near full. He then browses forums to catch up on all the complaints about nerfs.
5PM. Player X starts his 4 hour grind to complete Alaska 2. Crazy scaling ensues.
9PM. Early grind paid off. Player X is now a tiny bit ahead of #2 from a strong finish in Alaska 2. Florida 2 refresh starts. Player X is enjoys a relaxing grind since Savage 2 does not start for another 12 hours. After all that, he gets some dinner and spends some time on things not MPQ. Hey, he has a life too, you know? Oh yes, don’t forget about the 5AM alarm.
Day 5
5AM. Player X gets up. It’s Saturday, which means it’s time to MPQ like mad. He spends the next 3.5 hours grinding Savage 1, which ends at 9AM. The remaining 30 minutes are spent on Alaska 2, which also refreshes at 9AM.
9AM. Savage 1 ends, but Player X is furiously rushing through Alaska 2, which is getting fairly difficult. He is 10 minutes late to Florida 2 starting, but he has also solidified his placement in his bracket. It is 10AM by the time that is all over. He goes to make some breakfast after the grueling 5 hour grind. He then sets alarm for 12PM and goes to take a nap.
12PM. Player X wakes from his nap, slightly recharged. He plays some Deadpool followed by a slightly early run of Alaska 2 so he can be on-time for Florida 2 refresh, which is worth more points than Alaska. It is now 2PM, and Player X relaxes by having lunch while reading up on alliance mates griping about scaling.
3PM. Player X uses some health packs doing early attempts on the hardest node in Alaska 2, where even a tiny cascade on the enemy side equals instant death. He spends some health packs and sets alarms for when health packs are near full. He then browses forums to catch up on all the complaints about nerfs.
5PM. Player X starts his 4 hour grind to complete Alaska 2. Crazy scaling ensues.
9PM. Early grind paid off. Player X is now a tiny bit ahead of #2 from a strong finish in Alaska 2. Florida 2 refresh starts. Player X is enjoys a relaxing grind since Savage 2 does not start for another 12 hours. After all that, he gets some dinner and spends some time on things not MPQ. Hey, he has a life too, you know? Oh yes, don’t forget about the 5AM alarm.
5AM. Florida 2 refresh. It is certainly a lot better not having to wake up at 3AM as well. Player X sets alarm for 9AM and goes back to bed.
9AM. Savage 2 starts, and it seems like the end is near. Player X rejoices and starts this happy Sunday with Deadpool daily quest and breakfast. Player X sets alarm for health packs refill.
11AM. Health packs full. Player X plays the hardest node to reduce risk of running out of health packs on the next refresh.
1PM. Florida 2 refresh again. Player X sets alarm for health pack regen and updates scaling data in preparation for Savage 2 refresh. Player X then eats lunch while having teams after teams of low level heroes die on the hardest node, in an attempt to scale down the enemy level. It goes down after 6 teams die, but came right back after a win. Player X gives up.
5PM. Savage 2 refresh arrives in the middle of the long final grind on Florida 2. Player X boosts on most missions to save health packs.
9PM. After 4 hours of early attempts and 4 hours final grind, Florida 2 ends. Player X celebrates his lead with some PvP grinding. 2 hours later, unable to climb the 166 wall in PvP, Player X decides to give up top 100 and gets ready for Savage 2 refresh.
1AM. Savage 2 refreshes. Enemies are already twice his rosters’ level. Player X contemplates waking up in the middle of the night for some early grinds, but decides against it. He sets alarm for 8AM.
Day 6
9AM. Savage 2 starts, and it seems like the end is near. Player X rejoices and starts this happy Sunday with Deadpool daily quest and breakfast. Player X sets alarm for health packs refill.
11AM. Health packs full. Player X plays the hardest node to reduce risk of running out of health packs on the next refresh.
1PM. Florida 2 refresh again. Player X sets alarm for health pack regen and updates scaling data in preparation for Savage 2 refresh. Player X then eats lunch while having teams after teams of low level heroes die on the hardest node, in an attempt to scale down the enemy level. It goes down after 6 teams die, but came right back after a win. Player X gives up.
5PM. Savage 2 refresh arrives in the middle of the long final grind on Florida 2. Player X boosts on most missions to save health packs.
9PM. After 4 hours of early attempts and 4 hours final grind, Florida 2 ends. Player X celebrates his lead with some PvP grinding. 2 hours later, unable to climb the 166 wall in PvP, Player X decides to give up top 100 and gets ready for Savage 2 refresh.
1AM. Savage 2 refreshes. Enemies are already twice his rosters’ level. Player X contemplates waking up in the middle of the night for some early grinds, but decides against it. He sets alarm for 8AM.
8AM. It’s Monday. Time for work. Player X tries to beat traffic but traffic beats him instead. At work, Player X sneaks in a Savage 2 run while eating breakfast. It’s good that Mondays are slow.
12PM. Lunch break. Player X does early grinds on the hardest nodes, gets lucky and completes a large amount of it. He checks the afternoon schedule and notes a good time for a break.
3PM. Meeting in an hour. Due to having some hard nodes done already, Player X is able to finish his early Savage 2 run quickly. In an obscure location.
6PM. The final, final grind starts. 2 hours in, Player X is out of health packs, but it looks like his main competitor has given up chasing, and Player X grinds goon nodes to secure a high score. Alliance messages come in: a sister alliance is dropping out of top 50.
9PM. Victory. Normally this is where Player X dances the victory dance, but the situation is dire in the sister alliance. Player X coordinates with commanders and brings his high score to the sister alliance. He drives home.
10PM. Player X enjoys dinner and a Taco run while continuing to monitor the alliance ranking. More top alliance mates sacrifice their position in the top alliance and join the sister alliance.
12AM. After 2 hours of frantic shuffling and merging in members from the PvP brother alliance, the event is finally over. The alliances cheer for their top 50 placement. Player X powers up his new Prof X.
The End.12PM. Lunch break. Player X does early grinds on the hardest nodes, gets lucky and completes a large amount of it. He checks the afternoon schedule and notes a good time for a break.
3PM. Meeting in an hour. Due to having some hard nodes done already, Player X is able to finish his early Savage 2 run quickly. In an obscure location.
6PM. The final, final grind starts. 2 hours in, Player X is out of health packs, but it looks like his main competitor has given up chasing, and Player X grinds goon nodes to secure a high score. Alliance messages come in: a sister alliance is dropping out of top 50.
9PM. Victory. Normally this is where Player X dances the victory dance, but the situation is dire in the sister alliance. Player X coordinates with commanders and brings his high score to the sister alliance. He drives home.
10PM. Player X enjoys dinner and a Taco run while continuing to monitor the alliance ranking. More top alliance mates sacrifice their position in the top alliance and join the sister alliance.
12AM. After 2 hours of frantic shuffling and merging in members from the PvP brother alliance, the event is finally over. The alliances cheer for their top 50 placement. Player X powers up his new Prof X.
I hope you guys enjoyed this little horror story. I contemplated making a comic version of this into a video and get 1000 views, but I'm not sure if it would qualify as "gameplay".
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Comments
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Wow... just... just, wow.0
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What I got from this: I need to be recording my scaling data
Seriously though, I hope some devs see this and realize what it takes for top placements. Something is wrong when this is what it takes/what people can do.0 -
I was disappointed that I only got 1 cover, but uhh... Nevermind. You enjoy those extra covers. You earned them.0
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Dauthi wrote:What I got from this: I need to be recording my scaling data
Haha. I know you are just kidding, but for the record I'd like to clarify that "scaling data" is a fictional understatement of the actual detailed PvE tracking data recorded. From that data, we know, for example, that the point values and scaling patterns for this The Hunt is exactly the same as the previous The Hunt. Not saying that the devs are lazy, but I wish they would at least look at re-releases and make tweaks to optimize them for 8 hour refreshes. Even a reduction from 6 missions in a stack to 5 missions could reduce an end grind from 3 hours to 2.5 hours.0 -
Good representation. That's why The Hunt made up my mind to quit completely - there was no viable 'casual' way to play it.0
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DrUnpleasant wrote:Good representation. That's why The Hunt made up my mind to quit completely - there was no viable 'casual' way to play it.
Au contraire! I played rather "casually"...and got a Daredevil cover. I think it would be more accurate to say "there is no viable 'casual' way to play it and remain both competitive for top 50 and sane." I won't get into the argument about what constitutes "reasonable effort," mostly because I think PvE in this game demands way too much for such meager payouts. Suffice it to say that the reward scheme for this event were utter ****. Most events are, but having only the top 50 earn Professor X was madness.0 -
Great story the parts you missed is:
Day 4
Checks leader board and researches opponent's alliance and roster. Takes notes on who has Thoress and X-Force and at what level. Makes a strategic decision on if they are hard core grinders or casual players who are stepping up. Theorizes on what their scaling is and what it might look like in Savage Lands II. If they are from a top tier PVE alliance, communicate with alliance teammates to figure out how to knock them off their game plan. Continue on with rest of day.
Day 5
Check Leader board and take notes on who is keeping up with the pace. Its now clearly down to one other opponent and he is from a top 25 PVE alliance and he's their scoring leader (Well at least he's not from We are Groot). Stock up on more food, post on the the forums to see if their alliance is monitoring. Oh **** they are! Comes to the inevitable conclusion that #2 will grind for first. Checks the night sky for any signs of Aliens, who might come to abduct him.
Day 6
Before final grind, sets a second alarm clock. I'll be damn if I lose 1st because I slept through the Ipad alarm. Wakes up and starts the final grind. 3hrs later, posts the obligatory "Good Game Well Played" story on forums. Pass out for 2 hrs and proceeds with rest of day. Checks alliance battle chat throughout the day to get reports on how the sister alliances are doing. Notices that alliance ranking is slowing slipping, but trusts the commanders to do the appropriate recruiting and score management. After all, didn't I do the hard work of grinding for points? Keep hearing good reports from team mates who are achieving their desired placements, and constantly asks "when does slice 5 end again?" 1 hr from slice 5 ending, gets an urgent text message from commanders to get on battlechat. Sister alliance needs support stat! Work out who has to swap to make sure they have enough points to make top 50! Crisis averted, both alliances are back in top 50. Gets nervous about close calls and decides to monitor alliance standings. Slowly sees both alliances sliding! Damn it! We worked too hard for this **** to happen. Convenes another emergency chat with alliance commanders, and cracks out the calculator to do some on the fly calculations. Okay, this will be close! Scores are gonna be tight, but we can still split the difference, but not everyone is still awake! Make some real live phone calls and start promoting some other players so they can approve more mercs! 5 min to go! Concludes I think we can still get both alliances in!!! 1/2 of the super-alliance is now fully alerted and monitoring battle chat. 2 min to go! Man the scores are tight! 0 min to go! God damn it, why doesn't D3 have an in game clock? Did it work? OMG!! alliance award are coming through, does it mean it worked? hits the alliance leaderboard...0 -
Awesome story.
I would add that The Hunt PvE grinding for Prof X is not the first and only PvE we had to grind.
It adds up to the ones we've grinded in the last months.
Each new PvE for a 4* is a nightmare. But it's even worse for developed rosters.
Since the devs like data a lot and base their strategy on data, I suggest the following :
- change the PvE progression reward to 1-50, 51-100, 101-150,
- fix the scaling so that players can play without spending 10K HP in a PvE event,
And see if you make more money.
You could be surprised...0 -
sounds all too real. Except you forgot to weave in the pvp climbs/shields/hops as well in between those grinds........0
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That's actually quite funny. And not just a rant, more "this is actually what has happened" is is probably the same for most who went for the top rewards.
It's why I will never, ever, play at the top end of pve on this game. I enjoy playing, but when and how I want, not when the devs dictate I should for a cover. Certainly took me a while to reach this stage though.0 -
Same - except that I ground twice before I went to bed and did not lose sleep over any of the games (but i was fortunate?? that none of the subs ended in the wee hours of the morning).
That said, that's probably why I ended up 3rd and not 1st in my bracket.
I came this close to quitting, and I never want to quit playing pvp.
I didn't know most of the people in my bracket but at the end of it I felt like we'd all gone through a war together or something, and were waiting for it to be over. The victory was meaningless due to exhaustion.
(Maybe some people enjoy it though, you never know.)0 -
Sounds like a lot of fun!
But seeing a lot of the scores from different slices, people are willing to do it so d3 believes that the pve event is a smash hit!0 -
Overlapping subs are evil and the work of the devil. That is all.0
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Dauthi wrote:What I got from this: I need to be recording my scaling data
Seriously though, I hope some devs see this and realize what it takes for top placements. Something is wrong when this is what it takes/what people can do.
Not to be callous but to place 1st out of 1000 other players shouldn't that require extraordinary effort?
I finished 3rd this event (partly due to an easy bracket) and was not willing to put forth the effort to take 1st. However, I did have to play way above casual to get top 5.
I guess this thread is about finding the right balance of effort for pves. Other than 5 day pves are a bit nuts, I think the rest of the event is just fine. It should be a big challenge to come in 1st.0 -
Similar story, also insert PvP (top 5-10) and LRs (crazy I know). No one to blame but myself really, but this, those overlapping subs must buuuuuuuurrrn0
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I'm seriously a little creeped out right now, I think Davyx was following me all last week!
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As long as people are willing to put in that kind of effort to top a bracket, it will take that kind of effort to top a bracket. The people you are trying to best are trying their hardest to not let you. Any event structure changes that limit maximum effort would mean Player-Y can now compete with you, and you need to be even more rigid and dedicated to optimality. Yes, overlapping subs are awful, but the less awful the grind is made, the more people will choose to attempt it. So as long as their is a desire/incentive to be the top-x player, there will always be crazies up for going toe-to-toe with your own crazy level.
The only answer then is either pure progression like Gauntlet and the Daily, or a much much flatter placement reward structure (every cliff-like threshold point adds a new grind-level). Having 3rd covers for top 5/10/20 is a big culprit especially in cases when ISO and HP rewards go up at the same threshold, but even if it were stretched to top-50 for the third, having anything more than some ISO and HP for higher tiers above that (i.e. a legendary 4th cover for top-1/2) will continue to drive the crazy train.0 -
I think this is the point of PvE. It rewards time spent playing and dedication rather than the strength of your roster. I've finished in the top spot of PvE a couple of times with a 2* roster. There has to be something to set apart the top finishers from everyone else. In PvP it's mostly roster strength, in PvE it's willingness to dedicate time to the game. If you remove that you make it a lot harder for newer players to be successful, and you kill your new player base.
With all that said - I agree that the way they released Prof. X via The Hunt was just awful. I was able to keep up on the weekend, but once Monday hit I had to go to work and I immediately fell out of the top 50.0 -
I am not a fan of the Gauntlet progression reward. I like the concept of Gauntlet, but without refreshing points to help hit top progression, if I just can't beat the last couple nodes because I'm scaled out of them, there is no way I can ever get the top progression. I like the casualness of Gauntlet due to no ranking, but again, I have never hit top progression because of scaling. I am a 2 to 3* transitioning player. I've struggled with scaling in the last 2 PVE's since I've leveled several 3* to 95 despite the fact that devs say leveling your 3 stars is irrelevant.CrankyDay wrote:The only answer then is either pure progression like Gauntlet0 -
JVReal wrote:
I am not a fan of the Gauntlet progression reward. I like the concept of Gauntlet, but without refreshing points to help hit top progression, if I just can't beat the last couple nodes because I'm scaled out of them, there is no way I can ever get the top progression. I like the casualness of Gauntlet due to no ranking, but again, I have never hit top progression because of scaling. I am a 2 to 3* transitioning player. I've struggled with scaling in the last 2 PVE's since I've leveled several 3* to 95 despite the fact that devs say leveling your 3 stars is irrelevant.CrankyDay wrote:The only answer then is either pure progression like Gauntlet
Yeah, I've never gotten top Gauntlet reward, and it would not be my model for a new pure progression system, nor would I choose the one-and-done node structure of the event itself. I like some grinding, and knowing that I could score more points by playing more and being more stringent with my schedule. But, the effort to do more than just top-150 for a single 3-star cover under the current system becomes more and more intensive, and a lot of that stems from the pure dedication some players have to earn top rewards and the result of grouping a handful of such people together.0
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