Okay it has been a few days since the nerf announcement...

Unknown

And I'm still not okay with it. Nor are many others.

My favorite argument on this forum is that nerfs are part of the game and they have happened before, and they should be expected, and you should buy with risk...

So here it is to all of you:

4 thor is the first 4 star to be nerfed. When one purchased her covers or worked hard to obtain them, it was reasonable to assume that this was a 4 star power set, and on level with x force, and thus would not be nerfed. Not one person should have expected this nerf. This WAS a 4 star powerset, and with no precedence before with nerfing a 4*, one should not assume that a nerf would ever come.

Besides, the nerfs before were to prevent exploits of characters, such as sentry bombing, etc.

There never was a true exploit with this character.

Contact google play or Apple, because what is happening is incredibly awful.

wirius

If you're looking for an echo chamber, I'm not giving it. You know what fraud prevention is for? Its not to help upset people that their characters got nerfed. Its to prevent real credit card theft, real companies bilking customers, and to protect consumers. When you flood their office with this bogus temper tantrum, you cost a legitimate business money, both google, and D3.

You didn't get "scammed". You knew nerfs could happen. You bought RP, how you spent it is up to you. You bought the champ with the knowledge it might one day be nerfed. You sound like a teenager. Are you going to complain next that a ten pack you bought didn't give you a 3*? Are you going to say its fraud then too? You knew the risks. Its a 3-star match phone game. Don't beat your fists into the ground and break stuff because you're unhappy.

Unknown

wirius wrote:

If you're looking for an echo chamber, I'm not giving it. You know what fraud prevention is for? Its not to help upset people that their characters got nerfed. Its to prevent real credit card theft, real companies bilking customers, and to protect consumers. When you flood their office with this bogus temper tantrum, you cost a legitimate business money, both google, and D3.

You didn't get "scammed". You knew nerfs could happen. You bought RP, how you spent it is up to you. You bought the champ with the knowledge it might one day be nerfed. You sound like a teenager. Are you going to complain next that a ten pack you bought didn't give you a 3*? Are you going to say its fraud then too? You knew the risks. Its a 3-star match phone game. Don't beat your fists into the ground and break stuff because you're unhappy.

I can't believe it, I just opened a ten pack and didn't get a single 3*!

*Beats fists into ground*

wirius

The scars I have on my knuckles aren't from fist fights, but shattered dreams from ten packs.

Unknown

Now where is that echo chamber? I swear I left it around here somewhere...

evil panda

wirius wrote:

If you're looking for an echo chamber, I'm not giving it. You know what fraud prevention is for? Its not to help upset people that their characters got nerfed. Its to prevent real credit card theft, real companies bilking customers, and to protect consumers. When you flood their office with this bogus temper tantrum, you cost a legitimate business money, both google, and D3.

this is false. credit card companies have a regulatory obligation to conduct an investigation when its users tell them that they did not receive the product or service that they used their credit card to pay for. this is not 'fraud prevention' (although you're the only one who's using the word fraud in this thread), but a different provision concerning 'billing errors'.

i'm not saying that everyone who calls their bank should expect a full and permanent refund, but the cc companies will investigate and if they find that you truly did not receive what you paid for, there will be chargebacks. i think the nature of digital goods makes this particular type of issue a lot more difficult to arbitrate, though.

KrazyKeylime

ya very tricky footing into virtual goods is there was one in call for duty 2 one of the shot guns changed killing range from medium to range to close range. not sure in outcome but many people left. was reading another article but it was exploitation of gold farmer in a MMO i haven't heard about.

Unknown

evil panda wrote:

wirius wrote:

If you're looking for an echo chamber, I'm not giving it. You know what fraud prevention is for? Its not to help upset people that their characters got nerfed. Its to prevent real credit card theft, real companies bilking customers, and to protect consumers. When you flood their office with this bogus temper tantrum, you cost a legitimate business money, both google, and D3.

this is false. credit card companies have a regulatory obligation to conduct an investigation when its users tell them that they did not receive the product or service that they used their credit card to pay for. this is not 'fraud prevention' (although you're the only one who's using the word fraud in this thread), but a different provision concerning 'billing errors'.

i'm not saying that everyone who calls their bank should expect a full and permanent refund, but the cc companies will investigate and if they find that you truly did not receive what you paid for, there will be chargebacks. i think the nature of digital goods makes this particular type of issue a lot more difficult to arbitrate, though.

What did you pay for? Hero points. Did you get Hero Points? Yes. Beyond that there is nothing to be done. Please grow up and don't falsely report fraud because you disagree with a change.

Unknown

D3 needs to remove the option to directly buy character covers in order to protect players from the sizable monetary losses they will encounter in the face of rebalances. Rebalancing is fine, in and of itself, and even good for the game overall.

But it looks very poor to continually release powerful (top tier) characters with the good faith belief in the player base that these characters were thoroughly or even moderately playtested, then sell covers at the prices ranges these covers sell at for several months, and then turn around and substantially diminish the character -- sometimes reducing them from generally rank #1 to mid tier (C mags) or from rank #1 to garbage tier (sentry), and as a result conveniently shifting the power curve so that some other character is now #1 and you need to buy more covers to get back up in the curve -- the rat race.

In the end, for the developers these rebalances are the results of lessons learned -- and these lessons learned are in a sense free for them, but not for the many hard core competitive that players have ended up losing several hundred dollars throughout the process. I'm left feeling as if I'm paying for an education in better game design to the developers. They learn more, get better at game design, improve their game IP, and I'm left to regret having spent the money on covers. Does that sound like a sustainable business model? These lessons learned should have been learned in play-testing, not at the monetary expense of the player base.

Removing the ability to buy covers directly, though carrying a downside for players enthusiastic about building their fave superheroes, would at least remove the impression that this is an intentional, by design, rotating money grab business model, and be a tacit admission on the part of the devs that "hey, we value our players, and we can't guarantee that you will get tomorrow what you pay for today, so it's unfair for us offer for sale the covers directly putting at risk the money you put into this game to support our continued business."

Having said that, I'm going free to play for good, even if they were to role back every one of these recent changes. I am(was) one of those 1+$/day players. Credibility and trust is finite, and for me, three times is enough. I'll still enjoy the game and share enthusiasm, but zero money goes to this game. When they finally manage to balance the superheroes, maybe they'll get around to figuring out how to rebalance the damage they did to all their most enthusiastic paying customers on the way.

kensterr

If you paid for a 2 litre engine car and months down the road the manufacturer calls for a recall of all cars and does a mandatory swap of the engine to a 1.3 litre. If you refuse to swap they say all warranty will be void. How would you feel?

Unknown

kensterr wrote:

If you paid for a 2 litre engine car and months down the road the manufacturer calls for a recall of all cars and does a mandatory swap of the engine to a 1.3 litre. If you refuse to swap they say all warranty will be void. How would you feel?

But you didn't buy a 2 litre engine car. You bought virtual currency, you received the virtual currency. The amount of currency you received has not changed and it has not been removed. So there is nothing for anyone to reimburse just because you don't like a change made to virtual items.

M1Lance

kensterr wrote:

If you paid for a 2 litre engine car and months down the road the manufacturer calls for a recall of all cars and does a mandatory swap of the engine to a 1.3 litre. If you refuse to swap they say all warranty will be void. How would you feel?

You would have a class-action lawsuit. Which is what D3 might face if they continue this trend.

Unknown

M1Lance wrote:

kensterr wrote:

If you paid for a 2 litre engine car and months down the road the manufacturer calls for a recall of all cars and does a mandatory swap of the engine to a 1.3 litre. If you refuse to swap they say all warranty will be void. How would you feel?

You would have a class-action lawsuit. Which is what D3 might face if they continue this trend.

I would love to see that get laughed out of court.

Unknown

wirius wrote:

If you're looking for an echo chamber, I'm not giving it. You know what fraud prevention is for? Its not to help upset people that their characters got nerfed. Its to prevent real credit card theft, real companies bilking customers, and to protect consumers. When you flood their office with this bogus temper tantrum, you cost a legitimate business money, both google, and D3.

You didn't get "scammed". You knew nerfs could happen. You bought RP, how you spent it is up to you. You bought the champ with the knowledge it might one day be nerfed. You sound like a teenager. Are you going to complain next that a ten pack you bought didn't give you a 3*? Are you going to say its fraud then too? You knew the risks. Its a 3-star match phone game. Don't beat your fists into the ground and break stuff because you're unhappy.

I take it you haven't spent hundreds of $ on upgrading the character?

GuntherBlobel

prash wrote:

wirius wrote:

If you're looking for an echo chamber, I'm not giving it. You know what fraud prevention is for? Its not to help upset people that their characters got nerfed. Its to prevent real credit card theft, real companies bilking customers, and to protect consumers. When you flood their office with this bogus temper tantrum, you cost a legitimate business money, both google, and D3.

You didn't get "scammed". You knew nerfs could happen. You bought RP, how you spent it is up to you. You bought the champ with the knowledge it might one day be nerfed. You sound like a teenager. Are you going to complain next that a ten pack you bought didn't give you a 3*? Are you going to say its fraud then too? You knew the risks. Its a 3-star match phone game. Don't beat your fists into the ground and break stuff because you're unhappy.

I take it you haven't spent hundreds of $ on upgrading the character?

I know I didn't! And with each "nerf," I feel less and less sympathy for those that have.

Arondite

It really gets under my skin when people toss around the term robbery so lightly. You're defaming them inappropriately and inaccurately.

Argue all you want that what d3 is a sign of poor foresight, planning or a lack of awareness regarding game balance and health, or even indicative of poor customer service. All of these things are a matter of opinion, and you can argue them effectively without defaming anyone or outright lying.

But robbery does not fit. No matter how you twist or turn the situation, what has happened here is far from robbery.

Call a mosquito a mosquito, not a spider.

Unknown

I kinda feel robbed mate, sorry

Unknown

camichan wrote:

Having said that, I'm going free to play for good, even if they were to role back every one of these recent changes. I am(was) one of those 1+$/day players. Credibility and trust is finite, and for me, three times is enough. I'll still enjoy the game and share enthusiasm, but zero money goes to this game. When they finally manage to balance the superheroes, maybe they'll get around to figuring out how to rebalance the damage they did to all their most enthusiastic paying customers on the way.

I couldn't have written it any better. I have spent north of 3$/day (holy cow, that's actually quite frightening in retrospect) on this game and going in full F2P mode from now on.

Unknown

eh201207 wrote:

And I'm still not okay with it. Nor are many others.

My favorite argument on this forum is that nerfs are part of the game and they have happened before, and they should be expected, and you should buy with risk...

So here it is to all of you:

4 thor is the first 4 star to be nerfed. When one purchased her covers or worked hard to obtain them, it was reasonable to assume that this was a 4 star power set, and on level with x force, and thus would not be nerfed. What D3 is doing is complete and utter robbery. Not one person should have expected this nerf to come, and they have been swindled from their money. This WAS a 4 star powerset, and with no precedence before with nerfing a 4*, one should not assume that a nerf would ever come.

Besides, the nerfs before were to prevent exploits of characters, such as sentry bombing, etc.

There never was a true exploit with this character.

Contact google play or Apple, because what is happening is incredibly awful.

From legal point of view, you use real mobey to buy hero point only. You use the hp to trade for covers. So dev has no responsibility on this nerf thing.

Unknown

Arondite wrote:

It really gets under my skin when people toss around the term robbery so lightly. You're defaming them inappropriately and inaccurately.

Argue all you want that what d3 is a sign of poor foresight, planning or a lack of awareness regarding game balance and health, or even indicative of poor customer service. All of these things are a matter of opinion, and you can argue them effectively without defaming anyone or outright lying.

But robbery does not fit. No matter how you twist or turn the situation, what has happened here is far from robbery.

Call a mosquito a mosquito, not a spider.

Your inability to recognize a metaphor is absolutely stellar... 10/10.

"What D3 is doing is complete and utter robbery" does not equal claiming they have taken part in the crimnal act of robbery but is likening their actions to that of committing robbery.. If I say after the nerf Spiderman is a pile of **** i'm not exactly saying he is a brown smelly heap.... just likening him to it. In fact add "like" in between "is" and "complete" and you make it a simile instead and you get the meaning. http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Metaphor

On the other hand YOU said the guy has defamed D3/whoever when he hasn't.... He has merely expressed his opinions with a slightly advanced piece of language.

Also where is your evidence for poor foresight or lack of planning? ONE piece of evidence they didn't intentionally release on OP character to get money out of ppl whilst from the very beginning planning to nerf them once they got all the money they could? There isn't any way to prove it either way which is why the interpretation of their actions depends entirely on how much faith you have in them. If ppl's faith has been eroded by the repeated pattern of OP hero -> massive overnerf then it's perfectly reasonable to no longer go for the "friendly bumbling idiot" defence.

Oh.... your claim he outright lied.... when he did nothing of the sort actually IS defamatory... so that's deliciously ironic . Don't worry though... nowhere near close enough to getting you sued. Proving a genuine loss from an off hand post in a forum where you are anonymous would be tough!

ps..... if English isn't your first language... or you simply don't know what a metaphor is consider this a friendly piece of info and i'll remove that downvote.

Unknown

bonfire01 wrote:

Arondite wrote:

It really gets under my skin when people toss around the term robbery so lightly. You're defaming them inappropriately and inaccurately.

Argue all you want that what d3 is a sign of poor foresight, planning or a lack of awareness regarding game balance and health, or even indicative of poor customer service. All of these things are a matter of opinion, and you can argue them effectively without defaming anyone or outright lying.

But robbery does not fit. No matter how you twist or turn the situation, what has happened here is far from robbery.

Call a mosquito a mosquito, not a spider.

Your inability to recognize a metaphor is absolutely stellar... 10/10.

"What D3 is doing is complete and utter robbery" does not equal claiming they have taken part in the crimnal act of robbery but is likening their actions to that of committing robbery.. If I say they turned Spiderman into a pile of **** i'm not exactly saying he is a brown smelly heap.... just likening him to it. In fact add "like" in between "is" and "complete" and you make it a simile instead and you get the meaning. http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Metaphor

On the other hand YOU said the guy has defamed D3/whoever when he hasn't.... He has merely expressed his opinions with a slightly advanced piece of language.

Also where is your evidence for poor foresight or lack of planning? ONE piece of evidence they didn't intentionally release on OP character to get money out of ppl whilst from the very beginning planning to nerf them once they got all the money they could? There isn't any way to prove it either way which is why the interpretation of their actions depends entirely on how much faith you have in them. If ppl's faith has been eroded by the repeated pattern of OP hero -> massive overnerf then it's perfectly reasonable to no longer go for the "friendly bumbling idiot" defence.

Oh.... your claim he outright lied.... when he did nothing of the sort actually IS defamatory... so that's deliciously ironic . Don't worry though... nowhere near close enough to getting you sued. Proving a genuine loss from an off hand post in a forum where you are anonymous would be tough!

ps..... if English isn't your first language... or you simply don't know what a metaphor is consider this a friendly piece of info and i'll remove that downvote.

Business is business. They advertise an op character. You use real money to buy hp. So you use those hp to buy covers. Then they nerf the character so that you have to pay more to invest in another character.

The main point is they sell hp only not covers. You have so many choice to use those hp but you bet on a poor investment.

This is the theory of running a casino.

This is a casino with an appearance of marvel comics , isnt it?