COMING SOON: CHARACTER UPDATE COUNTERPOINTS!!

Unknown

Lerysh wrote:

Posting this here where it's hopefully less noisy and will get more attention. So I basically don't care about any of the other things announced, but what they did to Thor is a crime. It's character assassination of their strongest female character. Powers under spoiler tag.

Demiurge_Miles wrote:

Thor (Goddess of Thunder) - Coming 3/23/15

Working on Ragnarok gave us an opportunity to rethink how we were valuing Charged tiles. It’s clear that we’ve been undercosting them, and we felt it was important to go back and update Thor (Goddess of Thunder) using the new thinking.

Smite - Old - 10 AP
The gathering lightning strikes Mjolnir as Thor brings the hammer down onto her enemy. Deals 630 damage to the enemy and an additional 137 damage for each Charged tile on the board.
Level 2 - Deals 886 damage plus 183 per charged tile.
Level 3 - Deals 968 damage plus 219 per charged tile. Make 2 charged tiles.
Level 4 - Deals 1388 damage plus 320 per charged tile. Make 3 charged tiles.
Level 5 - Deals 1717 damage plus 365 per charged tile. Make 4 charged tiles.
MAX Level 5: Deals 3409 damage plus 725 per charged tile. Makes 4 charged tiles.

Smite - New - 10 AP
The gathering lightning strikes Mjolnir as Thor brings the hammer down onto her enemy. Deals 630 damage to the enemy and an additional 137 damage for each Charged tile on the board.
Level 2 - Deals 886 damage plus 183 per charged tile.
Level 3 - Deals 1023 damage plus 219 per charged tile. Makes 1 charged tile.
Level 4 - Deals 1324 damage plus 292 per charged tile. Makes 2 charged tiles.
Level 5 - Deals 2027 damage plus 365 per charged tile. Makes 3 charged tiles.
MAX Level 5: Deals 4025 damage plus 725 per charged tile. Makes 3 charged tiles.

Striking Distance - Old - 12 AP
Thor flings Mjolnir at an impossible speed towards her enemies, the impact dashing their plan of attack. Deals 356 damage to the enemy team and converts 1 enemy Strike, Protect, or Attack tile into a charged tile.
Level 2 - Deals 356 team damage. Turns 2 enemy Strike, Protect, or Attack tiles into charged tiles.
Level 3 - Deals 593 team damage. Turns 3 enemy Strike, Protect, or Attack tiles into charged tiles.
Level 4 - Deals 593 team damage. Turns 3 enemy Strike, Protect, Attack, or Countdown tiles into charged tiles.
Level 5 - Deal 1150 team damage. Turns 5 enemy Strike, Protect, Attack, or Countdown tiles into charged tiles.
MAX Level 5: Deals 2284 team damage. Turns 5 Strike, Protect, Attack, or Countdown tiles into charged tiles.

Striking Distance - New - 12 AP
Thor flings Mjolnir at an impossible speed towards her enemies, the impact dashing their plan of attack. Deals 356 damage to the enemy team and converts 1 enemy Strike, Protect, or Attack tile into a charged tile.
Level 2 - Deals 402 team damage. Turns 2 enemy Strike, Protect, or Attack tiles into charged tiles
Level 3 - Deals 402 team damage. Turns 3 enemy Strike, Protect, or Attack tiles into charged tiles
Level 4 - Deals 739 team damage. Turns 3 enemy Strike, Protect, or Attack tiles into charged tiles
Level 5 - Deals 1086 team damage. Turns 3 Strike, Protect, Attack, or Countdown tiles into charged tiles.
MAX Level 5: Deals 2157 team damage. Turns 3 Strike, Protect, Attack, or Countdown tiles into charged tiles.


Power Surge - Old - 9 AP
Thor raises Mjolnir to the sky, summoning a lightning storm to shock and stagger her foes. Stuns the enemy for 1 turn and converts 3 random Red, Blue, or Yellow basic tiles into Charged tiles.
Level 2 - Stuns for 2 turns. Makes 3 charged tiles.
Level 3 - Stuns for 2 turns. Makes 4 charged tiles.
Level 4 - Stuns for 3 turns. Makes 5 charged tiles.
Level 5 - Stuns for 4 turns. Makes 12 charged tiles.

Power Surge - New - 9 AP
Thor raises Mjolnir to the sky, summoning a lightning storm to shock and stagger her foes. Stuns the enemy for 1 turn and converts 2 random Red, Blue, or Yellow basic tiles into Charged tiles.
Level 2 - Stuns for 1 turn. Makes 3 charged tiles.
Level 3 - Stuns for 1 turn. Makes 4 charged tiles.
Level 4 - Stuns for 2 turns. Makes 4 charged tiles.
Level 5 - Stuns for 3 turns. Makes 5 charged tiles.

Ok, so you wanna change charge tiles. That's cool, that's cool, but what about her overall damage and power level? There is no mention of changing that at all, it's just a side effect of there were 12 charge tiles and now there's 5. So before what was 19 AP = 12,000 ish damage = 637 damage per AP. We need to maintain something at least close to that (both with and without charge tiles would be excellent). Smite needs it's damage boosted. You have to. If you cut out the heart of her mechanic you have to fix it with extra up front damage, and some added damage per charge tile wouldn't hurt.

Old Smite was only 349 damage per AP without blue. I propose split the difference and make level 270 5 covers read 5100 damage with 1025 damage per charge tile. That's 510 damage per AP base, and 538 damage per AP for Power Smite. And its only 10,225 damage so it doesn't kill XF in a single hit.

Please, please, PLEASE reverse this contract on Thor's head and don't kill our favorite female character in the middle of Marvel's Women of Marvel month.

I'd like those changes especially the buff smite base damage, i vouch for that. The new smite isn't quite enough of a boost, heck even Lcap and Cyclops red do more than the new smite still...

Phaserhawk

I was even thinking about it last night. They could have gotten rid of the stun completely and left the 12 charged tiles and while I wouldn't have liked it, it still would have been better than what happened, but I then thought of another angle and possibility.

I think the problem is moreso the charged tiles, the more I think about it, the more I realize that it is the bigger core of the problem. I do like charged tiles don't get me wrong, but I think 3x is too much and they would have been better at 2x. In fact the more I think about it, that probably would have been the better fix, to make charged tiles 2x instead of 3x

CaptainFreaky

God yes - for the love of humanity!!! Please just turn MNM to and leave the ability otherwise unchanged! And Mystique can then also be left unchanged. She's already underpowered overall in 3* land due primarily to health - no need to change her if MNM Polarity Shift is moved to

If Winfinite was the stated reason for the change, then this fixes it elegantly.

I suspect an unstated reason for the change was they saw data that 99% of people were using MNM+CStorm to clear Deadpool Daily 2* missions. But since it's unstated, I will go with what they said: If you want to stop Winfinite, then simply change his ability so that Mystique can't feed it.

If you BELIEVED the feedback we all gave you on IF purple, then also listen to us all on this change as well!!!

Phaserhawk

CaptainFreaky wrote:

God yes - for the love of humanity!!! Please just turn MNM to and leave the ability otherwise unchanged! And Mystique can then also be left unchanged. She's already underpowered overall in 3* land due primarily to health - no need to change her if MNM Polarity Shift is moved to

If Winfinite was the stated reason for the change, then this fixes it elegantly.

I suspect an unstated reason for the change was they saw data that 99% of people were using MNM+CStorm to clear Deadpool Daily 2* missions. But since it's unstated, I will go with what they said: If you want to stop Winfinite, then simply change his ability so that Mystique can't feed it.

If you BELIEVED the feedback we all gave you on IF purple, then also listen to us all on this change as well!!!

It's because of Xavier, pure and simple. Mags allows Xavier to do tons of damage and create lots of AP. All you need is him. Have a yellow strongest, get yellow, use it to generate a crud ton of blue, which will trigger Xavier to create yellow for Mags, who then makes more match 5 blues. You could have done this.

MnMags/Fury/Xavier.

Get 9 yellow, match blue 5, gain 4-8 yellow back but you also have blue now, rinse and repeat all of a sudden you have a board filled with Fury tiles. The fact of the matter is once Xavier shows up any charaacters that can easily make match 5 become very lethal. If you have a random creator like IF, Thor, Ms. Marvel, etc, you can't always guarentee it, but with Mags you can. BWGS is going to fall next, trust me.

Unknown

Phaserhawk wrote:

BWGS is going to fall next, trust me.

Well they are handing her out in several places right now. That does seem to be the timing they manage to find for pulling the rug out from people. ~defeated sigh~ Women of marvel month indeed.

Unknown

TLCstormz wrote:

IN WHAT UNIVERSE DOES IT MAKE SENSE TO NERF ONE OF THE ONLY CHARACTERS IN THE 2* LAND THAT YOU CAN USE FOR STRATEGIC COMBOS?????????

I mean.......did they not even think of how badly this will hurt 2* players? What other life saving combos can we do BESIDES MNM and cStorm?

I am so totally shocked at this incompetence, I almost don't believe it's real.

1) The combo is not broken. I've tried it several times. It is not hard to get a match 5 with 3 blue tiles.

2) Players in the past had stated that all tile selection abilities (GSBW and MMN) should be changed to random. Therefore, I am happy that they did not do just that.

3) If that is the only combo you are doing (a) sounds boring and (b) there are a lot of others. OBW with Daken and/or A Wolvie. M Hawkeye with Marvel and/or Thor. I use OBW/Thor/Marvel as my A team for survival nodes in DPDQ. In PVE it depends who you are playing, I'd probably still choose OBW/C Storm/MMN for goon nodes. against doom, I'd probably through in Daken and/or A Wolvie to do some tanking.

4) The exciting thing is the mmn red generation. His red is greater but cost so much AP, if you cant get that going..or maybe pair with torchling.

Unknown

Phaserhawk wrote:

CaptainFreaky wrote:

God yes - for the love of humanity!!! Please just turn MNM to and leave the ability otherwise unchanged! And Mystique can then also be left unchanged. She's already underpowered overall in 3* land due primarily to health - no need to change her if MNM Polarity Shift is moved to

If Winfinite was the stated reason for the change, then this fixes it elegantly.

I suspect an unstated reason for the change was they saw data that 99% of people were using MNM+CStorm to clear Deadpool Daily 2* missions. But since it's unstated, I will go with what they said: If you want to stop Winfinite, then simply change his ability so that Mystique can't feed it.

If you BELIEVED the feedback we all gave you on IF purple, then also listen to us all on this change as well!!!

It's because of Xavier, pure and simple. Mags allows Xavier to do tons of damage and create lots of AP. All you need is him. Have a yellow strongest, get yellow, use it to generate a crud ton of blue, which will trigger Xavier to create yellow for Mags, who then makes more match 5 blues. You could have done this.

MnMags/Fury/Xavier.

Get 9 yellow, match blue 5, gain 4-8 yellow back but you also have blue now, rinse and repeat all of a sudden you have a board filled with Fury tiles. The fact of the matter is once Xavier shows up any charaacters that can easily make match 5 become very lethal. If you have a random creator like IF, Thor, Ms. Marvel, etc, you can't always guarentee it, but with Mags you can. BWGS is going to fall next, trust me.

This sounds like more of a reason to revisit or "nerf" xavier instead rather than remove a capability that exists in multiple characters because a new ability allows for some overpowered gameplay techniques. But this is the same company that nerfed Hood because of Thoress, so seems like more of the same unfortunately.

Phaserhawk

Xiphoen wrote:

Phaserhawk wrote:

CaptainFreaky wrote:

God yes - for the love of humanity!!! Please just turn MNM to and leave the ability otherwise unchanged! And Mystique can then also be left unchanged. She's already underpowered overall in 3* land due primarily to health - no need to change her if MNM Polarity Shift is moved to

If Winfinite was the stated reason for the change, then this fixes it elegantly.

I suspect an unstated reason for the change was they saw data that 99% of people were using MNM+CStorm to clear Deadpool Daily 2* missions. But since it's unstated, I will go with what they said: If you want to stop Winfinite, then simply change his ability so that Mystique can't feed it.

If you BELIEVED the feedback we all gave you on IF purple, then also listen to us all on this change as well!!!

It's because of Xavier, pure and simple. Mags allows Xavier to do tons of damage and create lots of AP. All you need is him. Have a yellow strongest, get yellow, use it to generate a crud ton of blue, which will trigger Xavier to create yellow for Mags, who then makes more match 5 blues. You could have done this.

MnMags/Fury/Xavier.

Get 9 yellow, match blue 5, gain 4-8 yellow back but you also have blue now, rinse and repeat all of a sudden you have a board filled with Fury tiles. The fact of the matter is once Xavier shows up any charaacters that can easily make match 5 become very lethal. If you have a random creator like IF, Thor, Ms. Marvel, etc, you can't always guarentee it, but with Mags you can. BWGS is going to fall next, trust me.

This sounds like more of a reason to revisit or "nerf" xavier instead rather than remove a capability that exists in multiple characters because a new ability allows for some overpowered gameplay techniques. But this is the same company that nerfed Hood because of Thoress, so seems like more of the same unfortunately.

They reworked Hood's yellow because of charged tiles, not Thoress, and honestly...I love Hood's yellow.

TLCstormz

The_Valeyard wrote:

TLCstormz wrote:

IN WHAT UNIVERSE DOES IT MAKE SENSE TO NERF ONE OF THE ONLY CHARACTERS IN THE 2* LAND THAT YOU CAN USE FOR STRATEGIC COMBOS?????????

I mean.......did they not even think of how badly this will hurt 2* players? What other life saving combos can we do BESIDES MNM and cStorm?

I am so totally shocked at this incompetence, I almost don't believe it's real.

1) The combo is not broken. I've tried it several times. It is not hard to get a match 5 with 3 blue tiles.

2) Players in the past had stated that all tile selection abilities (GSBW and MMN) should be changed to random. Therefore, I am happy that they did not do just that.

3) If that is the only combo you are doing (a) sounds boring and (b) there are a lot of others. OBW with Daken and/or A Wolvie. M Hawkeye with Marvel and/or Thor. I use OBW/Thor/Marvel as my A team for survival nodes in DPDQ. In PVE it depends who you are playing, I'd probably still choose OBW/C Storm/MMN for goon nodes. against doom, I'd probably through in Daken and/or A Wolvie to do some tanking.

4) The exciting thing is the mmn red generation. His red is greater but cost so much AP, if you cant get that going..or maybe pair with torchling.

But you do not play EXCLUSIVELY with a 2* roster, so................

Unknown

I'm in favor of most of the new character changes aside from 4* Thor. I put quite a bit of cash into boosting her solely for that Power Surge ability. I can understand reducing the stun a turn and pulling away 3 or 4 additional charged tiles but taking 7 away is overly nerfing her. I cant see myself even really using her anymore in pvp so thats a couple hundred bucks down the drain. I would really like D3 to reconsider what a Legendary Character should represent. It takes so much time and money to boost them its not fair to us who have invested so much in them to just strip away everything that makes the character fun to use. I appreciated the challenge of facing an opponent's max Thor and now it's so severely weakened I am more afraid to face 3* Iron Fist and Luke Cage combos. With all due respect, I think it was a bad decision to nerf her blue ability so badly. Now, to the real point at hand. Can someone shoot me, say, 812,400 ? Thanks

Taganov

Just here to add my voice/thumb the OP. Really think the suggestions there warrant review.

I get the 4Thor change, but completely agree it's too much. Can't imagine what anyone was thinking with the Mystique nerf.