Do you think there's power creep in MPQ?

Unknown

That's great. Tell me more about how you still use Spiderman.

GothicKratos

Lerysh wrote:

That's great. Tell me more about how you still use Spiderman.

That's a bad example. He's not used because of his kit becoming obsolete within the meta - not being of power creep.

I would say Human Torch is a prime example. Punisher is a prime example. Mohawk Storm is a decent example. Black Panther is a good example. Iron Man Model 40 is a prime example (though he was never really "good"). Psylocke is a good example (even though when she came along Punisher was basically better at what she did already). Grey Suit Widow is a good example.

Unknown

Lerysh wrote:

That's great. Tell me more about how you still use Spiderman.

Re-read my post.

Nope.

Didn't even mention Spiderman.

Isolated characters not being powerful has nothing to do with power creep.

Like Kratos said, there are a hand full of examples where power creep could be argued. IM40 and GSBW, obviously, should have lower AP costs on their abilities.

But for the game on a whole, the power creep is relatively low, considering what they could have done, which would be just release Xforce-level character every 2 weeks.

atomzed

GothicKratos wrote:

Lerysh wrote:

That's great. Tell me more about how you still use Spiderman.

That's a bad example. He's not used because of his kit becoming obsolete within the meta - not being of power creep.

I would say Human Torch is a prime example. Punisher is a prime example. Mohawk Storm is a decent example. Black Panther is a good example. Iron Man Model 40 is a prime example (though he was never really "good"). Psylocke is a good example (even though when she came along Punisher was basically better at what she did already). Grey Suit Widow is a good example.

I assume you mean that characters like pun and psylocke are victims of power creep, and they ought to be buffed.

My worry is that with such perceptions, buffing such characters only leads to greater power creep and becomes a vicious cycle.

In this regard, I am more like ominus and believe it's healthier to nerf the top dog than buffing characters.... Though I do know that nerfing comes with its own problems (community back lash being the greatest problem), I think it's generally for the greater good.

Unknown

You guys don't seem to understand the concept of power creep.

Power creep doesn't affect every character. It just means that, as a whole, people need to do more damage/do damage quicker/have a harder time engaging against characters in general now than they used to.

My answer to this is a definite no. Patch and hulk are old characters that are rarely thought of as "op", and yet there is no team in the game that duo can't beat. This was the case long ago as well - except that now battles last long enough that that combo is viable again.

If anything, the death of Sentry made the entire game much slower. XF GD is fast, sure, but it's not really comparable. You can totally starve an xforce and allow a GD to fire off blue, use the charged tiles to fuel your own characters and beat the tar out of the team, even if you're not using maxed 4*s.

Anyone who doesn't think this is the case simply wasn't around for the Age of Sentry. People, we used to be annoyed at the point counter because it was too slow. Think about that for a while. Most fights were over in 20-40 SECONDS.

GothicKratos

atomzed wrote:

GothicKratos wrote:

Lerysh wrote:

That's great. Tell me more about how you still use Spiderman.

That's a bad example. He's not used because of his kit becoming obsolete within the meta - not being of power creep.

I would say Human Torch is a prime example. Punisher is a prime example. Mohawk Storm is a decent example. Black Panther is a good example. Iron Man Model 40 is a prime example (though he was never really "good"). Psylocke is a good example (even though when she came along Punisher was basically better at what she did already). Grey Suit Widow is a good example.

I assume you mean that characters like pun and psylocke are victims of power creep, and they ought to be buffed.

I don't really have a dog in this race, I was just pointing out that that was a poor example. I pretty much agree with you, in 80 out of 100 cases, buffing characters just exacerbates power creep.

Spoit

People are conflating power creep with their stated intent to do a 3->4* transition.

Compare what's happening now to what theoretically existed in the early game, ignoring the whole thorverine, cstorm, and rags (and loki) sideshow. Back then, GSBW and IM40 weren't quite as execrable (though still weren't really setting the world on fire), and ares was actually a solid choice on a team, even against 3*s.

And even though NP is going to yell at me, I still maintain that a little bit of power creep is actually a good thing, as it keeps the meta from stagnating too much. E.g. gold bagman was already starting to be transitioned out of usage by many people even months before his nerf, because he was tedious as all getout compared to the new flavor of the month teams

GuntherBlobel

I really like some of the most recent characters, but should we revisit this now? A few weeks after this thread started I think the Power Creep began.

konannfriends

i dont see why squirell girl always gets thrown in the mix with the rest of the low tiers.

i will say i wisht they would get rid of the conditional purple. and just make it a raw damage dealer. lets say 3340 fully covered and maxed

SnowcaTT

If I was D3, I certainly would think the best way to make money would be to release powerful characters (IF, KK) as new ones - ones that are in the top 25% (10%?) of 3* characters. Then players would want these - and pay for the covers right? They probably learned from SG, when some say they don't even want to keep her on the roster, likely very few paid for covers.

Then to make even more money, I'd make sure the best covers (KK green, IF purple) were the hardest to get in the introductory PVE. And I'd blame "RNG" when they are again the hardest to get in the following PVP. And when they don't show up in any following PVP (Grocket yellow, Mystique purple, SG green, Gamora black....). Possibly I'd delay as long as possible in putting those covers in DDQ.


I don't mind them trying to make money, they are a company. I get it. But when they say things like "players like new characters more than buffing old characters" and then the power creep makes older characters more and more obsolete - I don't think that's good for long-term play.

konannfriends

SnowcaTT wrote:

If I was D3, I certainly would think the best way to make money would be to release powerful characters (IF, KK) as new ones - ones that are in the top 25% (10%?) of 3* characters. Then players would want these - and pay for the covers right? They probably learned from SG, when some say they don't even want to keep her on the roster, likely very few paid for covers.

Then to make even more money, I'd make sure the best covers (KK green, IF purple) were the hardest to get in the introductory PVE. And I'd blame "RNG" when they are again the hardest to get in the following PVP. And when they don't show up in any following PVP (Grocket yellow, Mystique purple, SG green, Gamora black....). Possibly I'd delay as long as possible in putting those covers in DDQ.


I don't mind them trying to make money, they are a company. I get it. But when they say things like "players like new characters more than buffing old characters" and then the power creep makes older characters more and more obsolete - I don't think that's good for long-term play.

wait devs actually think we like new characters instead of them taking old ones and making them good? this seems poll worthy.
i myself would love for them to take one of my useless 3 stars (Pyslocke,Gsbw,she hulk)

spydoorman

onimus wrote:

For 3 stars:
Nope.

In the last 6 months these are the 3 stars that have been released. Let me know if I've forgotten any:
Squirrel Girl 21/01/2015
Luke Cage 07/01/2015
Gamora 04/12/2014
Rocket & Groot 25/11/2014
Mystique 09/11/2014
Blade 28/10/2014
Dr Octopus 31/09/2014
Colossus 15/09/2014
Beast 01/09/2014

Luke Cage is a defensive stud, yes.
Blade is a serviceable support if you don't have Daken.
Mystique has a tiny tiny niche as part of the “winfinite” combo with Marvel Now Magneto.
And Rocket and Groot is generally considered “good enough to level.”

Iron Fist. Elite even after nerfing. And I threw Gamora some levels, she is serviceable enough.

Unknown

spydoorman wrote:

onimus wrote:

For 3 stars:
Nope.

In the last 6 months these are the 3 stars that have been released. Let me know if I've forgotten any:
Squirrel Girl 21/01/2015
Luke Cage 07/01/2015
Gamora 04/12/2014
Rocket & Groot 25/11/2014
Mystique 09/11/2014
Blade 28/10/2014
Dr Octopus 31/09/2014
Colossus 15/09/2014
Beast 01/09/2014

Luke Cage is a defensive stud, yes.
Blade is a serviceable support if you don't have Daken.
Mystique has a tiny tiny niche as part of the “winfinite” combo with Marvel Now Magneto.
And Rocket and Groot is generally considered “good enough to level.”

Iron Fist. Elite even after nerfing. And I threw Gamora some levels, she is serviceable enough.

She is not.

Now, if she ever gets featured the way patch and lthor are.right now, maybe she's usable. Though she's using green and black, and those are not colors a mediocre character wants to mess with.