Buying covers should be cheaper

Raffoon

Right now it costs 2500 HP to buy a 4 star cover. That means that you can spend 100 USD (20,000 HP) on the game and get 8/13 covers for a 4 star. (This is of course assuming that you've gotten at least one cover in each color)

I'm sorry, but in what world does 100 dollars for 61% of a character in a mobile/tablet game make sense?

Yes, there are people that go ahead and buy covers at this price. In fact, I've done it myself. It doesn't make it the right call in terms of gameplay, or in terms of D3 making money.

If D3 really wants to make money, they'll drop the prices. Yes, they'll make less money per sale of covers, but they'll sell soooooooooooooo many more covers.

A quick example using totally made up numbers just to illustrate the concept: If you cut prices for covers in half, and then 3 times as many people buy covers a result, you've increased your income to 150% of what it was before.

So.... More money for D3. More covers for the players. What's the downside here? Compensate people who have already bought covers if needbe, the same as with 20 man alliances.

rednailz

They'd be selling "3 times as many covers" for half the price, and would loose revenue from people spending money on heatlh packs and shields to grind for a 4* cover. If they cut the price of a 4* cover in half no one would really grind for them as much, since it would be more economically feasable to just buy the cover.

Then they might as well erradicate the 3* game since we'd all just be running thoress and xforce with the odd other charecter.

What would you have to do or work towards if you just bought all your 4* covers? To each their own.

MojoWild

I've never bought a cover and am doing just fine. Besides, I don't have enough iso for the covers I have now. And I'm not buying iso either.

Unknown

Raffoon wrote:

Right now it costs 2500 HP to buy a 4 star cover. That means that you can spend 100 USD (20,000 HP) on the game and get 8/13 covers for a 4 star. (This is of course assuming that you've gotten at least one cover in each color)

I'm sorry, but in what world does 100 dollars for 61% of a character in a mobile/tablet game make sense?

It is pretty ridiculous in real world terms.

But, a 5/1/5 4Thor just carried me to #1 in PVE with ease so I guess it has reciprocating value.

Raffoon

rednailz wrote:

They'd be selling "3 times as many covers" for half the price, and would loose revenue from people spending money on heatlh packs and shields to grind for a 4* cover. If they cut the price of a 4* cover in half no one would really grind for them as much, since it would be more economically feasable to just buy the cover.

Then they might as well erradicate the 3* game since we'd all just be running thoress and xforce with the odd other charecter.

What would you have to do or work towards if you just bought all your 4* covers? To each their own.

They've said before that health packs and shields are a minor part of their revenue.

Grinding and competing would still be cheaper than straight up buying, and so people would still do it.

For some people (most people), grinding and competing at a high enough level to consistently bring in 4* just isn't an option, whether that be because of roster or time constraints. If those people want to spend money, in amounts that still rival AAA videogame titles, to play with the shiny new toys/characters, why turn them away? This wouldn't trivialize the amount of effort or money required for these characters, it would simply make it more reasonable.

Edit: Regarding 3* characters, they would probably need to make their covers cheaper as well. This would help out by letting people transitioning to 3* transition more easily access characters that are just a few covers away from being usable for them.

They should also probably crank up the ISO, because nobody is going to spend money on covers when they can't level them.

rednailz

Raffoon wrote:

rednailz wrote:

They'd be selling "3 times as many covers" for half the price, and would loose revenue from people spending money on heatlh packs and shields to grind for a 4* cover. If they cut the price of a 4* cover in half no one would really grind for them as much, since it would be more economically feasable to just buy the cover.

Then they might as well erradicate the 3* game since we'd all just be running thoress and xforce with the odd other charecter.

What would you have to do or work towards if you just bought all your 4* covers? To each their own.

They've said before that health packs and shields are a minor part of their revenue.

Grinding and competing would still be cheaper than straight up buying, and so people would still do it.

For some people (most people), grinding and competing at a high enough level to consistently bring in 4* just isn't an option, whether that be because of roster or time constraints. If those people want to spend money, in amounts that still rival AAA videogame titles, to play with the shiny new toys/characters, why turn them away? This wouldn't trivialize the amount of effort or money required for these characters, it would simply make it more reasonable.

Edit: Regarding 3* characters, they would probably need to make their covers cheaper as well. This would help out by letting 3* transition people access 3* characters that are just a few covers away from being usable.

They should also probably crank up the ISO, because nobody is going to spend money on covers when they can't level them.

If they made 3* covers cheaper I wouldn't bust my hump to compete for the top 5 or top 25 then. I'd just buy them with HP.

Shelds and heatlh packs may be a minor income, but the point was that loss of revenue in those areas would effect the suggested increased revenue from making covers cheaper.

I agree $20 for 1 4* cover is pretty stupid, but I'm playing devil's advocate, I don't see it happening, or not happening until there's a huge drop in player base, which I expect to be happening shortly if not as we speak.

SnowcaTT

I think the costs are fine - if they increase HP that is available. Everywhere costs are increasing (many more characters means many more slots needed to be opened, much more ISO needed to level) - resources need to scale up to meet those costs.

slidecage

shocked they never tried to sell complete covers

Say like (just making prices up) a 3 star cover would cost 100 bucks to max. Sell the 3 star complete maxxed for 150 (that way you dont have to hope you pull the covers you can buy it prepaid) im sure some suckers would buy them

SymmeTrey

I agree with SnowcaTT that the prices are fine but the in-game flow of HP could use a buff. Currently, it seems to be tuned around very established players who rarely need slots and who are earning HP in both PVE and PVP. But, for those in the first 6 months or so, it's brutal.

Personally, I think the Progression & Event rewards could use a 50% or even 100% buff relative to HP and probably ISO as well. It wouldn't break anything but would ease strain considerably.

CNash

Cover prices are high because they give you exactly what you want. If they were cheaper, it would impact token sales.

rednailz

slidecage wrote:

shocked they never tried to sell complete covers

Say like (just making prices up) a 3 star cover would cost 100 bucks to max. Sell the 3 star complete maxxed for 150 (that way you dont have to hope you pull the covers you can buy it prepaid) im sure some suckers would buy them

Funny you should mention. If it wasn't for security issues and the game being linked to my google, I would consider selling my account for some real world scratch.

I could see people buying already leveled charecters for more money. It exists in nearly every other type of game.

rednailz

SymmeTrey wrote:

I agree with SnowcaTT that the prices are fine but the in-game flow of HP could use a buff. Currently, it seems to be tuned around very established players who rarely need slots and who are earning HP in both PVE and PVP. But, for those in the first 6 months or so, it's brutal.

Personally, I think the Progression & Event rewards could use a 50% or even 100% buff relative to HP and probably ISO as well. It wouldn't break anything but would ease strain considerably.

I would like to see progression rewards go higher. Average finishing score for top 100 )depending on the event) is nearly double the score of the last progression reward. Progression rewards are to cheap in general.

Unknown

well i got 2 4 star covers today. one from the event thick of thieves and one from a heroic pack. that is so lucky. i just may have to get rid of a junk cover to get the other 4 star or wait to the 5th to when i get money.

Raffoon

SnowcaTT wrote:

I think the costs are fine - if they increase HP that is available. Everywhere costs are increasing (many more characters means many more slots needed to be opened, much more ISO needed to level) - resources need to scale up to meet those costs.

If they raised the HP available inside the game, then they'd also need to raise the amount of HP bought with each dollar, or else they would devalue the worth of buying HP with real world dollars (For example if X dollars gives you Y hours worth of HP, Y would decrease with that proposed change).

If they increased both the HP earned and the amount of HP bought per dollar, it's effectively the same as reducing the HP cost of everything. So, I think that we want the same thing, but we're just going at the problem from opposite sides?

SnowcaTT

Raffoon wrote:

SnowcaTT wrote:

I think the costs are fine - if they increase HP that is available. Everywhere costs are increasing (many more characters means many more slots needed to be opened, much more ISO needed to level) - resources need to scale up to meet those costs.

If they raised the HP available inside the game, then they'd also need to raise the amount of HP bought with each dollar, or else they would devalue the worth of buying HP with real world dollars (For example if X dollars gives you Y hours worth of HP, Y would decrease with that proposed change).

If they increased both the HP earned and the amount of HP bought per dollar, it's effectively the same as reducing the HP cost of everything. So, I think that we want the same thing, but we're just going at the problem from opposite sides?

You're right, they would have to bring up the amount of HP in the packs to buy as well. You can use that for more than covers though (and many buy it more for boosts to earn covers rather than covers themselves).

I'm trying to point out that lowering costs to buy covers won't do any good if you don't also lower the cost to actually be able to level those characters. It may be easier to boost all resources (since you can just go x.20 everywhere, whatever metric they want to use) rather than try to re-balance by figuring out new costs of leveling.

Eddiemon

Raffoon wrote:

I'm sorry, but in what world does 100 dollars for 61% of a character in a mobile/tablet game make sense?

It doesn't, that's sort of the point.

The game allows you to buy an advantage, but the model is supposed to be based on winning your way to a more powerful cast of heroes.

If you could just drop hundred bucks and have the best set of covers in the game then what is the actual game anymore? You skipped building a roster, levelling, transition or climbing the ranks. What's there to keep you playing now?

So spend a bit of money on cover slots, maybe splurge on a token or that one cover you are desperate for. But don't be looking to buy whole characters from scratch, the payment model is designed to dissuade you from that.

Unknown

Eddiemon wrote:

If you could just drop hundred bucks and have the best set of covers in the game then what is the actual game anymore? You skipped building a roster, levelling, transition or climbing the ranks. What's there to keep you playing now?

I dunno, I have seen this argument (or variants of it) a lot, and it always somehow have failed to convince me.
There are currently players who have maxed their rosters. We could even say that from a strictly utilitarian point of view, your roster is maxed when you have Xforce and 4Thor maxed. And still they keep playing and show no signs of stopping. We have seen many many threads about quitting the game, but non of those was because the game had suddenly become to easy or boring as they had all the characters maxed.
The constant flow of events and new characters keep the game fresh of course, but I'd say the most important factors are alliances and the desire to compete against others. Imagine the crazy case where overnight each and every player had all their roster maxed, we would still keep playing the game, although PvP would reach new level of boring.

So I'd say as much building a roster is indeed a quite important part of the game, there are many other factors keeping the players going. And even if we had a 50 or even a 100% discount on the prices of covers, we would still be far from a situation where everyone can insta-max. If anything the game in its current state is way too difficult/frustrating/unfair/time consuming/expensive, take your pick. I know it's designed to be, but the devs are walking a very fine line here between totally worth it/going to throw my phone through the window.

SnowcaTT

Eddiemon wrote:

If you could just drop hundred bucks and have the best set of covers in the game then what is the actual game anymore? You skipped building a roster, levelling, transition or climbing the ranks. What's there to keep you playing now?

Lots of folks earned their X-force, bought their Thor, and are working on getting everything else.

Indeed, the game seems to have trended that way - if you want to collect the 4*'s you almost have to pay to get one first. $100 is usually the price, if you get a 1/1/1 from seasons you would find a 5/5/1 X-force or a 5/1/5 Thor very usable.

Xenoberyll

Compared to what Console titles with tons of complexity mobile games are ridiculously expensive. 60 Bucks for a Console/PC game is just a tiny fraction of what you can pay for MPQ. That's an overall problem in the business though.

For MPQ it would be great to have 3 and 4 Star character covers with a HP value if you're selling them. I'd love if a 3 or 4 star would give you 10% hp needed to buy one. So for every 10 covers you don't need you could buy 1 that you do need.

SnowcaTT

Xenoberyll wrote:

Compared to what Console titles with tons of complexity mobile games are ridiculously expensive. 60 Bucks for a Console/PC game is just a tiny fraction of what you can pay for MPQ. That's an overall problem in the business though.

It's the whole idea of microtransactions. It's certainly difficult to justify dropping $100 on any game - but it is much easier to do it a buck at a time over time.

On dollars payed per hour played, this game is possibly the highest ratio ever for me (I put in something like $20 + $10 as a newbie to get roster spots). But it doesn't look like "value" for me to put money in for anything other than possibly HP, I'm debating buying my Thor (Hey DP3 - I certainly won't if I can't earn ISO - lightning rounds later today will show me if that is possible...seed teams better be there...), it could help me along continual play here, and be worth it in the long run.

However, I could take a shot of physical games I found deals on over the holidays, stacked up on my desktop - AC4, Diablo 3 + expansion, FC4, Skyrim. That's almost $100 sitting on there, and unless Diablo pulls me in like #1 did or I start do play Skyrim mods forever, combined they won't hit the time I've already played on MPQ - but they will be more memorable. I don't drop $60 on games for the same reason - value per game allows you to play more if you don't mind playing first.

MPQ same way - if you don't mind being "first" to the newest character, you can probably get them eventually (4*'s are iffy with current rates). Their goal is find the balance of value where people will buy their resources - I'm sure that's why ISO is on sale right now and not HP, it's a test to see where ISO sells at.

Zen808

The problem is that the cheaper it gets to buy a 4* character, the more expensive the game gets. If it only cost $60 to cover-max X-force or 4Thor, why wouldn't you? They are far and above better than any 1-2*, and they'd give you a huge advantage early on, especially if you're smart enough to keep their levels in line with the rest of your team.

Eventually, the game will reach a tipping point, where so many people have a maxed 4* on their roster that if you don't have one, you're way behind the curve. By making he power-characters cheaper, they're almost forcing you to buy them.

The reason I like the game is that you can literally do very well in it as a free-to-play player. This is because paying to win is so prohibitively expensive that only a small percentage of players will do it.