PvP x4orce

thedude

That's all I see. Who said pay to win?

Unknown

While X Force is most certainly overpowered, he can hardly be considered as P2W given how much he sucked in the past which made acquiring his cover significantly easier than the effort you'd normally need to finish #1 in PvP or 1-2 on PvE. The big bad guys didn't have a stranglehold on his cover supply mostly because nobody thought he was ever going to be any good, so it's surprisingly equal for everyone!

Ebolamonkey84

I have only spent about $5 on this game for roster spots in the beginning. I've finally gotten my Xforce to 5/4/3 after 264 days through progressions rewards, daily rewards, and some lucky token pulls. There are many aspects of this game that could be considered P2W, but Xforce isn't one of them.

Xforce is beatable with quite a number of maxed 3* teams.

san

Ebolamonkey84 wrote:

I have only spent about $5 on this game for roster spots in the beginning. I've finally gotten my Xforce to 5/4/3 after 264 days through progressions rewards, daily rewards, and some lucky token pulls. There are many aspects of this game that could be considered P2W, but Xforce isn't one of them.

Xforce is beatable with quite a number of maxed 3* teams.

I beat Xforce quite regularly with my MNMags and 2* Storm as well... Nothing is unbeatable. Just difficult. Plus, you just know that the player will then see you as an easy target and retaliate.

thedude

Yeah xforce is beatable, but my point was that there's loads of maxed 4thors already, and my PvP is a sea of maxed xforce and 4thor teams. They have great synergy and can trash 3* teams on their own, let alone together.

More than ever, new players don't stand a chance

Professa D

As soon as I heard about 4or and especially after I got to playtest her out, I immediately started hoarding ISO and HP. Saved up enough to buy 4 covers for her so I have her at 5/2/4 lvl 220 with out paying any money. Planning on winning the last two covers through placement/progression. Haven't put any real money into this game in over 9 months. Got all my XF covers back when they were laughable garbage but couldn't NOT keep the cover.

Of course, hoarding was easier for me because I had a developed enough roster that I could compete and place t10 in most PvPs without buying a single shield (plus alliance t25) so I was able to save up HP pretty quickly. I can certainly understand the viewpoint of "the rich get richer" since those of us with more than 300 days have had a good advantage over the newer up and comers - although that gap has been diminishing as more and more players get enough 166s to compete. I mean, back in the day you could play character-specific lightning rounds to win covers for that character, so you could quite easily get to 13 covers rather quickly if you put in minimal effort. I couldn't imagine trying to start over now that the character/cover pool is so diluted while the number of people able to field 166s and above has steadily risen.

The pay to win argument doesn't seem to make sense to me because the amount of actual money it takes to "shortcut" the game is upwards of $1,000 when you factor in purchased ISO to level up characters. That's way beyond reasonable p2w in my opinion. They definitely do a good job of hooking you early and making it pay to play though since you quickly end up with more covers than you have slots for, but that's just the freemium business model: give em a taste then once they're hooked go for the cash! Wait, isn't that what crack dealers do? Oh snap.

Unknown

thedude wrote:

Yeah xforce is beatable, but my point was that there's loads of maxed 4thors already, and my PvP is a sea of maxed xforce and 4thor teams. They have great synergy and can trash 3* teams on their own, let alone together.

More than ever, new players don't stand a chance

I think they realize this. That's why PvE has become the mother of all grindfests.

Unknown

thedude wrote:

Yeah xforce is beatable, but my point was that there's loads of maxed 4thors already, and my PvP is a sea of maxed xforce and 4thor teams. They have great synergy and can trash 3* teams on their own, let alone together.

More than ever, new players don't stand a chance

No, that was not your point. Unless we have vastly different conceptions of what a "point" is. Your original post doesn't mention anything other than "Waaah waaah no fair xforce p2w waahhh someone give me my bottle and wipe my little bottom".

thedude

ark123 wrote:

thedude wrote:

Yeah xforce is beatable, but my point was that there's loads of maxed 4thors already, and my PvP is a sea of maxed xforce and 4thor teams. They have great synergy and can trash 3* teams on their own, let alone together.

More than ever, new players don't stand a chance

No, that was not your point. Unless we have vastly different conceptions of what a "point" is. Your original post doesn't mention anything other than "Waaah waaah no fair xforce p2w waahhh someone give me my bottle and wipe my little bottom".

Obviously I know what my point was and I am a regular top 10 finisher with a very good roster, including xforce and 4thor, so I don't need my bottom wiping thanks. I was expressing an opinion that I don't think this is necessarily a good move for the game as it might turn new players off.

If you disagree that's fine, but there's no need to be rude about it.

squirrel1120

Ebolamonkey84 wrote:

I have only spent about $5 on this game for roster spots in the beginning. I've finally gotten my Xforce to 5/4/3 after 264 days through progressions rewards, daily rewards, and some lucky token pulls. There are many aspects of this game that could be considered P2W, but Xforce isn't one of them.

Xforce is beatable with quite a number of maxed 3* teams.

What teams are good at beating Xforce? My go to pvp team consisting of hulk/bp can get their butt handed to them by a decently covered lvl 110 xforce when the are both soft capped at 153. Its made me seriously shy away from battles with him, and even if I need to work on the characters good at taking him down still, it'd be good to have that direction in my goals, cause auto-skipping any team costs time, iso, and usually just makes me give up after a bit since above 600 almost every team has him. Then your sitting there checking how many covers the bugger has etc... bleh.

Anyway, aside from Stormneto who would tank any decent unshielded score in a heartbeat, do I have anything I should go at him with?

155 Lcap 3/5/5/
153 BP 5/5/2 (I know his lack of black is a detriment, just the way his covers fell for me)
153 hulk 5/2/5
153 patch 4/5/3 (I expect 3x covers from pve, so with one cover purchase I could spec him literally any way after Monday)
150 Falcon 5/5/2
142 punpun 5/5/1
120 psyduck 4/4/4
120 torch 3/5/2
114 Ldaken 4/3/2
110 mostorm 5/4/4
104 sentry 4/5/2
94 spidey 5/5/3
94 ares/obw/tinycap/tinydaken/m.hawk/tiny torch/mn.mags/c.storm/tinythor/a.wolvie

The rest are undercovered and not worth focus currently. I mean hood has 12 covers, but only 2 blue so it seems feeding him iso atm would be pointless. Since hulk really isn't the deterrent he's being put up to be anymore, it'd be nice to get into a team I don't have to fear xforce with...

orbitalint

I don't have a usable xf yet but can hang with fully covered xf with 135 hulk and patch assuming hood isn't the partner. Yes I have to be careful but it is fast and I rarely think twice about going against an xf.

If you get your patch to at least 3+/x/5 and use hulk, I make quick work of an xf team with a +3 green boost. Collect 6 green, Berserker and let hulk tank a few matches. Anger does aoe and fuels enough green for another br or three to put any team out of commish. Only use health packs on hulk too. Just make sure he is in lead position to patch to tank off colors.

It is a quick enough combo that you can get a few matches in before shielding above 600. Not the greatest on d but no one really is.

Edit: any score above 600 is going to have you targeted regardless of whether you have xf. Staying unshielded at 600+ hoping people will skip from some scarecrow effect is pretty unrealistic but at least you can punch it out with all but the xf/4hor teams above 600.

squirrel1120

So hulk tanks r/g/black/blue/tu at equal level? Should be pretty easy for him to be out front most of the time... means not dropping any more levels of patch once he's covered after the pve... but I could be ok with that. I don't really want to go much above that until I can field a decent max level pvp team anyhow. Sounds worth a shot. The hulk/bp combo doesn't get many matches in without a healthpack for one or both. Even 2 star teams can smash them with some pretty significant damage, and I've certainly lost a few to those teams thinking I'd be ok to start the match with a 4k health hulk, only to find out 'not so much'.

orbitalint

squirrel1120 wrote:

So hulk tanks r/g/black/blue/tu at equal level?

Yup as long as hulk is in the center or left position, he'll tank most colors for patch. Purple/yellow are only ones i consistently see for patch. I made hulk one level above patch if you don't want to worry about positioning as much.

Though, makes tbti worthless but if you have enough red for it something went very wrong in the match . Best of luck with it.

Mikaveus

thedude wrote:

Yeah xforce is beatable, but my point was that there's loads of maxed 4thors already, and my PvP is a sea of maxed xforce and 4thor teams. They have great synergy and can trash 3* teams on their own, let alone together.

More than ever, new players don't stand a chance

The surgical strike ability needs revision because it is practically "game over" when landed. I have to believe a lot of players pay to win, especially when you see 270 level teams show up soon as his buff occurred. If people are that well off then good for them. If the point of the game is to have balanced characters and creative combinations, then X-force is definitely UNbalanced until that power is toned down. And for people who have reaped the benefits of X-force, I'm certainly not surprised that they feel strongly against that notion.

thedude wrote:

Obviously I know what my point was and I am a regular top 10 finisher with a very good roster, including xforce and 4thor, so I don't need my bottom wiping thanks. I was expressing an opinion that I don't think this is necessarily a good move for the game as it might turn new players off.

If you disagree that's fine, but there's no need to be rude about it.

Good job laying down THAT point.

squirrel1120

orbitalint wrote:

squirrel1120 wrote:

So hulk tanks r/g/black/blue/tu at equal level?

Yup as long as hulk is in the center or left position, he'll tank most colors for patch. Purple/yellow are only ones i consistently see for patch. I made hulk one level above patch if you don't want to worry about positioning as much.

Though, makes tbti worthless but if you have enough red for it something went very wrong in the match . Best of luck with it.

Thanks, most other replies to this question in other places have been very vague.

TBTI rarely goes off before a match ends for me. That might have something to do with patch only coming out when I'm still climbing through 2*'s at the very beginning though, as he was about worthless against ANY 3* team. Zerker rage just self-hurt too much to use except as a finisher, and 3 yellow wouldn't keep him going through even match damage afterward, nevermind the onslaught of powers that'd get dropped on him because matches went too long due to not using his own. I've tried him with hulk before, and while he'd win matches, it wouldn't be as elegant as both would need healthpacks almost every fight or two.

orbitalint

Yeah, 5 yellow for patch is crucial to make it sustainable and light on the health packs. Otherwise, both him and hulk would need them some matches. I can usually let patch heal in match after any previous game. Don't even think about his health anymore tbh. I'm a 4/4/5 patch guy myself because 3 in green doesn't always trigger anger and 5 seems like I'd eat health packs for hulk faster.

Also, just took out a max xf, dp team just now using the combo. Hulk needed a recharge but came out with the victory. Makes me smile since I soft cap my guys at 135 for pve.

Unknown

My only major complaint with x force is that if the ai gets one cascade into either of his relevant abilities, he is fully capable of wiping your entire team over the course of only one more turn even against many 166 characters. And that doesn't even require him to be high level, just have the 5 covers. Most characters a bad cascade costs you one character, with x force, it costs you the match unless you're rolling with a very select crew of characters. I still fight him, I still beat him, but I lose more often than I'd like simply because the character is numerically the best in the game in the hands of the ai in terms of his black and green.

Unknown

nightmanflock wrote:

My only major complaint with x force is that if the ai gets one cascade into either of his relevant abilities, he is fully capable of wiping your entire team over the course of only one more turn even against many 166 characters. And that doesn't even require him to be high level, just have the 5 covers. Most characters a bad cascade costs you one character, with x force, it costs you the match unless you're rolling with a very select crew of characters. I still fight him, I still beat him, but I lose more often than I'd like simply because the character is numerically the best in the game in the hands of the ai in terms of his black and green.

Green costs you one guy. Black can cost you the game depending on what color it is, and of course sometimes the green cascades into the black or something else and costs you the game anyway.

Unknown

That was exactly my point, was the high cascade value of both moves which can and will cost you the game at least occasionally.

loroku

Ebolamonkey84 wrote:

I have only spent about $5 on this game for roster spots in the beginning. I've finally gotten my Xforce to 5/4/3 after 264 days through progressions rewards, daily rewards, and some lucky token pulls. There are many aspects of this game that could be considered P2W, but Xforce isn't one of them.

Sorry, but this example doesn't disprove anything. I'm not saying the OP is right, but unless you are one of the top 1% of players who have been playing this long, it IS impossible to max him out anymore without paying. The fact that you got ahead long ago when it was still possible doesn't mean anything because no one else can ever do this. Ever.

Unknown

loroku wrote:

Ebolamonkey84 wrote:

I have only spent about $5 on this game for roster spots in the beginning. I've finally gotten my Xforce to 5/4/3 after 264 days through progressions rewards, daily rewards, and some lucky token pulls. There are many aspects of this game that could be considered P2W, but Xforce isn't one of them.

Sorry, but this example doesn't disprove anything. I'm not saying the OP is right, but unless you are one of the top 1% of players who have been playing this long, it IS impossible to max him out anymore without paying. The fact that you got ahead long ago when it was still possible doesn't mean anything because no one else can ever do this. Ever.

You can piggyback your way on the 1300 progression covers without having a super strong roster, though that may change next season with the shield changes. If you didn't take advantage of the crazy score inflation that likely won't be around much longer then it is indeed quite hard to max him out, but you do get 1/1/1 from progression rewards which solves the biggest problem with the 4*, which is getting a cover at all. I know I started with close to 0 HP when Thor came out and I've about 9000 right now and that's including still buying roster slots for every 3* character come out that I usually don't need, so that's about half way there starting from 1/1/1 and I have more than that. Saving 75 HP or 150 HP for the shield you didn't need in PvP and picking up another 50 or 100 HP on a sub in PvE adds up to a lot over time.