Seson 7 issue (complaint)

Unknown

Ok,
So many of us spent A LOT OF TIME grinding for our season reward...Lady Thor.
Here's the issue...SPOILER ALERT...complaint coming
My alliance/s, like many of you, were pushing for that top 100 spot...And we were there most of the way through...in the last 5 minutes, we fell out from riding the 90 mark to 103 (furious as all hell as you could imagine) BUT with the expansion to everyone to 20 slots, it is EXTREMELY COMPETITIVE, which is great, it should be...(here comes the but)- but first to clarify, I would be writing this missing the reward or not as I am not/will not throw the entire game, and its components under the bus. I love the game, but would like to add a piece of mind.

BUT...only a top 100 seems far too little for the season reward (IMO)... 150 or 200 seem a MUCH more reasonable approach. It is still very difficult to make the top 200 but where is the fun when you miss out on something that takes SO LONG to get to, then throw a huge factor chance as an alliance bump but only allow top 100 rewards ...and at the expense of a single cover, which lets be honest, at one cover lady thor is nothing more than useless (a weak 2*). PLUS, with giving more people a single cover as a reward, MORE PEOPLE WILL BUY ADDITIONAL FOR HER, (generating revenue which is big part of the point)...BUT what about the FUN aspect. I think I can speak for most of us that new characters are FUN to use, one cover or not. and announcing that she was coming two months ago, making her a season reward with one cover at top 100 with such a low reward rate, while immediately upping everyone to 20 alliance, really seamed to put a bad taste in my mouth.

Please note again, just wanted to add my two cents that a season reward should be a little higher say 200
(OR MAYBE FORCE SOME STRATEGY IN THE SEASON REWARDS AND HAVE A DIFFERENT COVER FOR 1-50, 51-100, AND 101-150 AS THE ALLIANCE WOULD HAVE TO PLACE IN A CERTAIN BRACKET TO RECEIVE THE COVER THEY DESIRE AND ROTATE THE NEXT MONTH/TIME)-could be kinda fun instead of all three at 1-10, 2 for 11-25 etc.
It also opens up a little bigger window for newer players to get something out of it before they stop playing for lack or hp/covers/etc. MORE CHARACTERS, MORE POSSIBILITIES, MORE COMBINATIONS, MORE STRATEGY, MORE REWARDS, = MORE FUN...imo...although maybe it's just me

AnywhoO, love the game, long time player and will continue to be, happy grinding to all!

Unknown

Um, it's season 7.

You've got a point though - the changes to alliances will have a big impact on Vs season competition for a lot of Alliances who previously were comfortable in 70th - 100th position. The top 50 pretty much remain the same but it's certainly possible for other alliances to gatecrash the top 100 now though.

The changes to alliances are far more severe in PvE though as a lot of established Alliances will struggle against alliances full of low level players who in many ways have an advantage in PvE. As if it wasn't hard enough to get top 20 for a 2nd individual cover, it's now going to be much harder to get Alliance top 100. I really, really think that 2nd covers ought to be expanded to top 50 PvE and Alliance covers to top 150 at least.

Unknown

HA, season 7 it is!...thats what I meant...

enter face palm and epic fail meme here...

Unknown

I don't know if much of it went on, but it seems wrong that with such a short time to go to the end of a season and with they opened the doors for anyone to create a 20-man Alliance for free and then populate it with whomever they want. Sure, it's always been possible to game the charts a little by moving people around at the last minute but this change removed some significant obstacles to shuffling - namely that you no longer have to be an existing 20-man Alliance commander to do it, and that as a commander relinquishing your post in your own Alliance (in which you may have invested significant amounts of HP) is now nothing more than letting go of a name. This is the kind of change that would have been better made in between seasons to limit the potential impact on the final standings.

(And yes, I'm only bitter because I didn't think of doing this for a T4or last sunday)

mohio

Obviously don't want to take anything away from your post but I've been saying this for a while. It seems inevitable that the devs will have to eventually increase the rank for alliance rewards since it is a static number where all individual ranked rewards are essentially percentages since there are brackets. As the game grows there are more and more alliances all the time and they are filling up with more and more competitive players. If nothing else than to keep the same percentages they should increase alliance rewards to at least top 125 if not 150.

MarvelMan

DrUnpleasant wrote:

The changes to alliances are far more severe in PvE though as a lot of established Alliances will struggle against alliances full of low level players who in many ways have an advantage in PvE.

I had this feeling that PVE would get changed, but I couldnt quite put my finger on it ti you wrote that. The imbalance in PVE that aggressively favors the intro player will break the new character releases. Even more so when they release Thoress since there will likely be quite a few beginner alliances that break into the top 100. That kicks those that are actually working on 4*s to the curb in favor of people working on 1*s, who get a cover they wont use for 4-6 months, if they have the HP for the roster slot otherwise they will sell it......which totally makes sense, right?

Nighthawk81

Remember that Goddess is a 4*. She is supposed to be really hard to achieve. I am not saying this because I run with an alliance that worked hard and achieved that goal. I am saying it because I was where you are, once upon a time. And I worked really hard to get where I am. Perseverance is the key.

Unknown

Nighthawk81 wrote:

Remember that Goddess is a 4*. She is supposed to be really hard to achieve. I am not saying this because I run with an alliance that worked hard and achieved that goal. I am saying it because I was where you are, once upon a time. And I worked really hard to get where I am. Perseverance is the key.

absolutely agree with you.
Not saying I got "screwed" or anything like that. the "last minute" alliance shift should have been done IN BETWEEN SEASONS, NOT IN MIDDLE OF THE SEASON. TOP 100s got bumped out as no one can go back and try for those extra few points to gain more in their over all total NOT KNOWING THAT IT WOULDNT BE ENOUGH WITH A CURVE BALL AT THE END OF THE SEASON AND ABSOLUTELY NO WAY TO "GO BACK" AND GET THOSE PLACEMENT POINTS TO ALTER SUCH A HUGE REWARD. I mean we are talking a month of grinding to only lose out at the buzzer because of a dev change. (See below comparison) Simply put, now with everyone moving to 20 alliances the competition is EXTREME, and we all already put TOO MUCH TIME INTO THIS GAME (lets all just be honest Opening up a slightly larger rewards will not affect anyone in the top 75s... but would allow for the ever growing community a chance to get in on the action. PVE and Season alliance rewards would not HURT anyone to open them up a little bit, if anything, it would encourage more people to play, and continue to play.
(comparison below)
Think professional football...
If a play off team could go trade for an allstar on a non play off team at the end of the play offs to help boost their chances for a superbowl win, it defeats the integrity of the game...this is what happened here. Thats why there is a trade deadline 1/3rd of the way through to prevent game changing/ season rewards. We just had NO IDEA IT WAS COMING until it was too late

It was a really bad move on develpers side to do during season, much less the end of the season. Sorry DEV's, but it is true. Im not one to criticize you guys as thus far I am extremely happy with you guys and your involvement and considerations. But it was a swift kick in the pants to many of us.

GrumpySmurf1002

Looking at the bottom of the Season 7 rankings: viewtopic.php?f=20&t=18737

There's only a couple of alliances I don't immediately recognize as consistent top 100-ish, and that doesn't even necessary mean the others are new.

I would agree that 150 for alliance rewards is probably overdue, but not because of this change. As someone else said, this will hit harder (maybe) in PvE. There wasn't an army of 20000 pt season scorers hanging around in 5 person alliances.

Unknown

I agree with the Smurf. The 20 man alliance thing isn't really going to shake up the top 100 that much. Maybe because I'm in closer to a top 50 alliacne but I just don't see the new kids, apart from maybe 5-10 alliances that try really really hard, throwing together winning teams. It is MUCH easier to recruit if you are already in the top 100.

HailMary

thaBURNIN8OR wrote:

My alliance/s, like many of you, were pushing for that top 100 spot...And we were there most of the way through...in the last 5 minutes, we fell out from riding the 90 mark to 103 (furious as all hell as you could imagine) BUT with the expansion to everyone to 20 slots, it is EXTREMELY COMPETITIVE, which is great, it should be...(here comes the but)- but first to clarify, I would be writing this missing the reward or not as I am not/will not throw the entire game, and its components under the bus. I love the game, but would like to add a piece of mind.

BUT...only a top 100 seems far too little for the season reward (IMO)... 150 or 200 seem a MUCH more reasonable approach. It is still very difficult to make the top 200 but where is the fun when you miss out on something that takes SO LONG to get to, then throw a huge factor chance as an alliance bump but only allow top 100 rewards ...and at the expense of a single cover, which lets be honest, at one cover lady thor is nothing more than useless (a weak 2*). PLUS, with giving more people a single cover as a reward, MORE PEOPLE WILL BUY ADDITIONAL FOR HER, (generating revenue which is big part of the point)...BUT what about the FUN aspect. I think I can speak for most of us that new characters are FUN to use, one cover or not. and announcing that she was coming two months ago, making her a season reward with one cover at top 100 with such a low reward rate, while immediately upping everyone to 20 alliance, really seamed to put a bad taste in my mouth.

I think expanding the alliance reward tiers is a good idea that should be (and likely is being) considered as the playerbase expands. But, the arguments you're using are puzzling.

Regardless of where the alliance reward tiers are, there will always be alliances who were pushed out of Top ___ in the final minutes, because everyone near a desirable reward threshold is pushing hard to stay above it. Your alliance failed to do so. Other alliances with very similar scores succeeded. That's it. Your Season score simply happened to be near the T100 cutoff. Changing the tier sizes will simply pass the manic last-minute jockeying down the line.

I have no idea what you're trying to say with your assessment of the single GT cover. You're clearly upset that your alliance missed it, but then you try to dismiss its value by calling it "nothing more than useless" to justify handing out more of them. The GT cover is either valuable to get upset over, or it's worthless enough to hand out like candy. It can't be both. Personally, I agree that it is valuable enough that missing it by a hair should be quite annoying, and expanded alliance reward tiers should be looked at.

The last-minute change to expand all alliances to 20-man alliances likely had zero effect on T100 standings. Keep in mind that there are 30,000+ alliances out there now. If there was really an effect on T100, do you think you'd only drop 13 places? If any significant proportion of the new 20-man alliances were able to compete well enough to matter for T100, you likely would've seen your alliance ranking plummet by far more. Maintaining a T100 alliance, as you very well know, takes work. It no longer merely requires having a 20-man alliance. Sure, it'd've been better to enable alliance auto-expansion after the Season ended, but that has nothing to do with your alliance missing the GT cover.

Unknown

HailMary,
First, I am a little butt-hurt missing out, and it was definitely not for lack of effort But I'm over it It's not like it was a once in a lifetime thing. I am just a little concerned with how the alliance thing went down and could potentially as others have mentioned, affect the rewards which in turn also concerns me about the rewards available... But its all simply food for thought to help keep a pleasurable experience. I just want to reiterate that my intention is not to bash the devs or whine about no thor, I'll/ we will all get her soon enough..."she will be mine...oh yes, she will be mine" -Wayne's World for those non movie buffs out there:)

Allow me to clarify,
A single gThor cover is desirable at all levels. Collectors and players alike. and in in the future, will be very useful...but until more covers are available, (or people dumping serious $$ and hp into her current yellow only self) she is virtually "useless"

In reference to it being "useless" she is not a required player (as she is a 4*) and therefore not a necessity for any event and will not restrict anyone's ability to play certain PVEs or PVPs. A single (yellow) cover is virtually useless on my (and many veteran players) rosters with such high level 3 and 4 *s. Her damage is virtually useless in battle until higher levels as well has her health and would not be used other than an extra body on a roster. UNLESS you are newer player with a small roster and no higher level player, then her cover could be helpful. and a higher reward bracket could allow newer players on strong alliances to get her. BUT many of us are well beyond the likes of 700s damage and charge tiles that make no other "CURRENT" (punn intended) effect on game play...hense why I used the term "useless" perhaps the better phrase would be "low lever of impact"...currently...but soon enough, she will dominate.

Unknown

I haven't been subtle about it, but I still disliked the fact that 4* Thor was an alliance only reward. I would love to see the 4* covers show up in the season rewards somehow. Either as the final progression or a top 25 or 50 reward. Which actually brings me to the question: Is the season bracketed, or are you just competing with everybody who plays?

Unknown

Fievel wrote:

I haven't been subtle about it, but I still disliked the fact that 4* Thor was an alliance only reward. I would love to see the 4* covers show up in the season rewards somehow. Either as the final progression or a top 25 or 50 reward. Which actually brings me to the question: Is the season bracketed, or are you just competing with everybody who plays?

Seasons are bracketed and once a character is fully released, they become part of the traditional reward structure - see Nick Fury.

HailMary

thaBURNIN8OR wrote:

HailMary,
First, I am a little butt-hurt missing out, and it was definitely not for lack of effort But I'm over it It's not like it was a once in a lifetime thing. I am just a little concerned with how the alliance thing went down and could potentially as others have mentioned, affect the rewards which in turn also concerns me about the rewards available... But its all simply food for thought to help keep a pleasurable experience.

Yeah, I get it. I think the alliance reward tiers could use some expansion, and I'd totes be annoyed if I'd just missed the T100 threshold. :-/

I'm just saying that "some alliances will get pushed out of/not quite make it to Top ___ at the end" is something that will be true regardless of where the reward thresholds are set.

Fievel wrote:

I haven't been subtle about it, but I still disliked the fact that 4* Thor was an alliance only reward. I would love to see the 4* covers show up in the season rewards somehow. Either as the final progression or a top 25 or 50 reward. Which actually brings me to the question: Is the season bracketed, or are you just competing with everybody who plays?

The individual Season rewards are bracket-based, with 5000 players per bracket.

Unknown

HailMary wrote:

thaBURNIN8OR wrote:

HailMary,
First, I am a little butt-hurt missing out, and it was definitely not for lack of effort But I'm over it It's not like it was a once in a lifetime thing. I am just a little concerned with how the alliance thing went down and could potentially as others have mentioned, affect the rewards which in turn also concerns me about the rewards available... But its all simply food for thought to help keep a pleasurable experience.

Yeah, I get it. I think the alliance reward tiers could use some expansion, and I'd totes be annoyed if I'd just missed the T100 threshold. :-/

I'm just saying that "some alliances will get pushed out of/not quite make it to Top ___ at the end" is something that will be true regardless of where the reward thresholds are set.

^yes, BUT those of us that are top 75-90 ish alliances kinda got the shaft as it was late in the game with no opportunity to get back those lost points from extra pushes early on. THIS PARTICULAR time is my only complaint. next season it is expected as we all know going in that there is no cushion, THERE IS ONLY PLAY PLAY PLAY! when good screening and recruiting could have pushed out consistent top 100s because of the alliance shift THIS TIME, next time, tough ****, we al know what were getting into..ok on to a new thread, plenty more to talk about...

Devs that read any of this, take it for what its worth.

and again, happy grinding to you all!

acescracked

Hey thaBURNIN8OR, great suggestion and I'm all for it. However, a little difficult to read your posts since your keyboard is malfunctioning. Your posts randomly switch from lowercase to uppercase and back.

Unknown

acescracked wrote:

Hey thaBURNIN8OR, great suggestion and I'm all for it. However, a little difficult to read your posts since your keyboard is malfunctioning. Your posts randomly switch from lowercase to uppercase and back.

haHAhaHahaHaha, yeah, I noticed that...my APOLOGIES:) ill take it into the "comPUTEr store"

SnowcaTT

In a steady alliance of mostly 3* transitioners that has been around the 75 range of every season, I'm not to worried about new alliances bumping us out. You have to have a full contingent of steady scorers all season long, it's tough enough to find anyone at the end of a season to meet minimum requirements if you fall a bit short. All the folks with great rosters/scores in five-man teams would have to find each other - but that would have already been pretty easy if they had a great roster/score, there was no reason they should have been in a five-man team.

My concern is more that the season competition is so fierce. I score 600+ in every PVP and 1500+ in simulator every season (7500+ each season), and I'm near the bottom of my alliance score which is around the bottom 1/4th of season scores. If there are so many alliances, so many players, and so many steady scorers - I do agree (and have stated for a few seasons) the rankings need to be extended to 50 for two covers/150 for alliance ranks.

It's much nicer to let your alliance mates have a life and say miss ONE pvp without squashing the alliance season score chances.

Unknown

There’s no way the 20 member cap was the reason you missed the top 100.
As a commander of a 50-75 ranked PVP alliance, I can attest that it is difficult finding people who can consistently score 700 per PVP who don’t think they deserve to be in a top 10 alliance.

There are, in general, 3 types of players in this game.
Casual: They’ll only shield at the last 3 hours and haven’t bought a single cover. They are good for maybe 550 to 700 points 99% of the time. If they really want a reward, they’ll push to 800 once every blue moon. That’s basically the limit for people who are only shielded for 3 hours.
Hardcore: They’ll buy shields, buy covers and score 1000+ points per PVP. But consequently, they aren’t interested in staying on a transitioning alliance for more than maybe 1 season, just to solidify their numbers for their bid to join a top 25 alliance.
Hard-casual: A combination of the two. They buy covers and shields and go hard for 1100 to 1300…about half the time. The other half of the time, they will score the minimum for your alliance, which is generally 600 to 800, depending on where your alliance stands. They can score elite numbers, but they can’t join a top 25 alliance because they are so inconsistent. They will, guaranteed, make their commander rip his/her hair out in frustration at their lack of consistency and reliability.


There are, of course, exceptions if you form a personal bond with the person. I’m a 1300-1500 point scorer who has stayed in a fringe top 100 alliance for the last 3 seasons because they tricked me into being a commander (half joking…)


The point of my post: Expanding the alliances to 20 members had zero impact on you not making the top 100.
Not only is there that fact that assembling 20 hardworking, contributing members is extremely difficult, but more so, being able to do that in one week would be near impossible. People who were able to contribute 7k or more were not going to join a startup alliance in hopes that 18 other 7k+ people just decide to give that same start up alliance a shot too.
The alliances that beat you out were, guaranteed, already 20 member alliances at the beginning of the season.

The reason the top 100 was so competitive this season is because everyone really really wanted Lady Thor.

The fact of the matter is people work very very hard to assemble top 100 alliances, and if you expanded the alliance reward to the top 200, that only dilutes our efforts.