Is it really that hard getting cover rewards?

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RemoDestroyer
RemoDestroyer Posts: 277 Mover and Shaker
edited November 2014 in MPQ General Discussion
Is it really that hard to get the solo and alliance placement reward covers? There seems to be a lot of threads that have a lot posts talking about death brackets and alliance rewards being unfair. Maybe I'm just out of touch with most players but I don't find it difficult at all.

For solo rankings I regularly see screen shots from alliance members where scores for top 5 placement range from 1300+ to not much more than 700 in the same event. So depending on the bracket you enter several hundred might have to be spent on shields or nothing. Some of you may be wondering where these magical brackets are that can be won with under 1000 points but they exist in every event. It just depends on when you enter and who else is joining at the same time. I have also seen it is possible to regularly score over 1300 and remain F2P. Our current season point leader has 13769 points without Real Steel or shield sim.

For alliance placement we are regularly placing in the top 45-55. I'm part of a 20 member alliance ththat is F2P all the way. We also don't spend all our time grinding away. We all have a lot going on outside mpq. In the most recent Lord of Thunder pvp we finished 52nd with 17931 points and individual contributions ranging from 1497 to 617 points. 10th and 11th had 825 and 814 points which I think is a very reasonable median. We have scored over 19k before.

The game isn't perfect and problems have been and will be addressed. I just think all cover rewards are achievable with reasonable strategy that doesn't require spending real money or all of one's time.
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  • Nellobee
    Nellobee Posts: 457 Mover and Shaker
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    Short answer:yes.
    Remember that the forumites are not even remotely representative of the player base at large.
  • chaos01
    chaos01 Posts: 316 Mover and Shaker
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    Nellobee wrote:
    Short answer:yes.
    Remember that the forumites are not even remotely representative of the player base at large.

    I would add a +1 to this if I could. For transitioning players all rewards in PVP are relatively difficult. I am looking forward to the day when I can easily make top 100. Then top 50 etc.
  • lukewin
    lukewin Posts: 1,356 Chairperson of the Boards
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    Yes, if you are talking about 3* covers. I am in a Top 5 PVE alliance, because that is my strength. Roster isn't strong enough to reliably finish above 600 in PVP, which means I only get Top 100 cover, unless desirable cover (like Colossus) where more people play, which pushes me out. In PVE, I can get all the rewards. Unfortunately, the progression rewards are usually only 1 cover per event. The final rewards, I am usually able to get Top 5, if not Top 2, so that's 3 covers, and 1 for alliance. With only new covers being rewarded, I am getting all the new characters, with 4 covers, but normally nothing after that. For the effort I'm putting in (hours), the amount of 3* covers I'm getting is horrible. Add to that, all the event and heroic tokens I get award me 2*s. Not enough to discourage me from playing, but enough for me to notice.

    Top 100 Alliances in PVP = max of 20,000 people getting 1 Alliance cover.
  • Nellobee
    Nellobee Posts: 457 Mover and Shaker
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    lukewin wrote:
    Yes, if you are talking about 3* covers. I am in a Top 5 PVE alliance, because that is my strength. Roster isn't strong enough to reliably finish above 600 in PVP, which means I only get Top 100 cover, unless desirable cover (like Colossus) where more people play, which pushes me out. In PVE, I can get all the rewards. Unfortunately, the progression rewards are usually only 1 cover per event. The final rewards, I am usually able to get Top 5, if not Top 2, so that's 3 covers, and 1 for alliance. With only new covers being rewarded, I am getting all the new characters, with 4 covers, but normally nothing after that. For the effort I'm putting in (hours), the amount of 3* covers I'm getting is horrible. Add to that, all the event and heroic tokens I get award me 2*s. Not enough to discourage me from playing, but enough for me to notice.

    Top 100 Alliances in PVP = max of 20,000 people getting 1 Alliance cover.

    2000, not 20000. icon_e_smile.gif
  • I have to agree with you. The only money I ever spent on this game was to purchase roster slots. Any covers, shields, etc. I bought was all through HP I have collected and gather from events.

    However, I do find death brackets to be an issue. Being placed into a bracket where Top 25 needs like 1300 is very anti-fun. It puts much more stress and pressure from the competition on you than necessary. Also, with no way to know what bracket you get into and who is in it, it becomes more and more of a gamble.
  • RemoDestroyer
    RemoDestroyer Posts: 277 Mover and Shaker
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    lukewin wrote:
    Yes, if you are talking about 3* covers. I am in a Top 5 PVE alliance, because that is my strength. Roster isn't strong enough to reliably finish above 600 in PVP, which means I only get Top 100 cover, unless desirable cover (like Colossus) where more people play, which pushes me out. In PVE, I can get all the rewards. Unfortunately, the progression rewards are usually only 1 cover per event. The final rewards, I am usually able to get Top 5, if not Top 2, so that's 3 covers, and 1 for alliance. With only new covers being rewarded, I am getting all the new characters, with 4 covers, but normally nothing after that. For the effort I'm putting in (hours), the amount of 3* covers I'm getting is horrible. Add to that, all the event and heroic tokens I get award me 2*s. Not enough to discourage me from playing, but enough for me to notice.

    Top 100 Alliances in PVP = max of 20,000 people getting 1 Alliance cover.

    OK. Those are good points. I don't want it to seem like I'm trolling but my perception is the rewards structure is considered very unsatisfactory by the players which I don't totally agree with. The reward structure has been changed and very likely will be again to get a good balance of being challenging but not impossible. I do remember when I started playing mpq that PvE was easier and PvP sucked then at some point it flipped. I do feel like it should take a little time and effort to place in the top 5 and 25. I figured placing in the top 300 and a decent chance of winning 2* covers from versus matches would make it relatively easy to build a 2* roster. I've seen plenty of 2* and donor teams able to put up 675+ points which isn't too bad and should be good enough for top 100. It will take a little while to build a 3* character 1 or 2 covers at a time and could be frustrating. I did start playing almost when the game came out and didn't max my first 3* until about the time alliances came out. I will say tokens can't be counted on to build a roster as the odds for a 3* are abysmal.
  • RemoDestroyer
    RemoDestroyer Posts: 277 Mover and Shaker
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    I have to agree with you. The only money I ever spent on this game was to purchase roster slots. Any covers, shields, etc. I bought was all through HP I have collected and gather from events.

    However, I do find death brackets to be an issue. Being placed into a bracket where Top 25 needs like 1300 is very anti-fun. It puts much more stress and pressure from the competition on you than necessary. Also, with no way to know what bracket you get into and who is in it, it becomes more and more of a gamble.

    I agree death brackets are miserable and discourage me from competing for top 5. I have been fortunate that top 25 has always been reasonable. Another member of my alliance unfortunately has had bad luck and has been in brackets where 1k isn't good enough for top 25. I thought that was bad. I imagine 1300 for top 25 has to be rare and anti-fun is putting it nicely. We do have 2 or 3 members that enter brackets nearly every pvp where 700 is good enough for top 5. It's just a timing thing that they have figured out and it works for them. It doesn't work for me most times and probably not for most players but the opportunity is there.
  • RemoDestroyer
    RemoDestroyer Posts: 277 Mover and Shaker
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    Looks like I also need to learn how to form paragraphs.
  • lukewin
    lukewin Posts: 1,356 Chairperson of the Boards
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    lukewin wrote:
    Yes, if you are talking about 3* covers. I am in a Top 5 PVE alliance, because that is my strength. Roster isn't strong enough to reliably finish above 600 in PVP, which means I only get Top 100 cover, unless desirable cover (like Colossus) where more people play, which pushes me out. In PVE, I can get all the rewards. Unfortunately, the progression rewards are usually only 1 cover per event. The final rewards, I am usually able to get Top 5, if not Top 2, so that's 3 covers, and 1 for alliance. With only new covers being rewarded, I am getting all the new characters, with 4 covers, but normally nothing after that. For the effort I'm putting in (hours), the amount of 3* covers I'm getting is horrible. Add to that, all the event and heroic tokens I get award me 2*s. Not enough to discourage me from playing, but enough for me to notice.

    Top 100 Alliances in PVP = max of 20,000 people getting 1 Alliance cover.

    OK. Those are good points. I don't want it to seem like I'm trolling but my perception is the rewards structure is considered very unsatisfactory by the players which I don't totally agree with. The reward structure has been changed and very likely will be again to get a good balance of being challenging but not impossible. I do remember when I started playing mpq that PvE was easier and PvP sucked then at some point it flipped. I do feel like it should take a little time and effort to place in the top 5 and 25. I figured placing in the top 300 and a decent chance of winning 2* covers from versus matches would make it relatively easy to build a 2* roster. I've seen plenty of 2* and donor teams able to put up 675+ points which isn't too bad and should be good enough for top 100. It will take a little while to build a 3* character 1 or 2 covers at a time and could be frustrating. I did start playing almost when the game came out and didn't max my first 3* until about the time alliances came out. I will say tokens can't be counted on to build a roster as the odds for a 3* are abysmal.

    I agree with you that the rewards structure is considered very unsatisfactory by the players. I think people expect too much, too soon. Most of the vets that have decent 3* rosters have been playing around a year or so, have bought covers, shieldhop, or are in competitive alliances that grant them a cover, each PVP. I've been playing less than half a year, so although I'd like to have more covers, it's unrealistic for me to expect it.

    I am a loooooong ways off from being able to compete for Top 25 in PVP. No need to shoot for Top 50 in PVP, only a 500 ISO and 25 HP difference in rewards, Top 50 is not worth the effort. I look forward to the day when I don't have to worry about being bumped from the Top 100. I think one of the problems is, the amount of time that's required to go from a decent 1* roster to a decent 2* roster is significantly shorter than the amount of time it takes to go from a decent 2* roster to a decent 3* roster. 2* covers drop pretty frequently in lightning rounds, and are more abundant in progression rewards, so I had max covered and max leveled 2*s in a decent amount of time. I have been slowly cruising along the plateau that is the road to 3* land, which is made even longer by constant new characters being introduced. I've got a deep 3* roster, so variety isn't a problem, but usefulness is.

    I still consider myself a 2* player, and not really a 2* to 3* transitional player (only because there is no other category, is why I am in the 2* to 3*), because I don't have enough covers to reliably use 3*s to do anything competitive for a decent amount of time. It's fun to play around with the low level, low covered 3*s when I begin my PVP climb against low opponents, but a lot of times, the only thing my deep 3* roster is good for, is being able to tank with a lot more characters. Tanking really doesn't help me, because I have a deep enough roster to switch up characters to climb to the 166 wall. I thought tanking helped, but I think I did well the one time, b/c I had a decently covered featured character.
  • chaos01
    chaos01 Posts: 316 Mover and Shaker
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    OK. Those are good points. I don't want it to seem like I'm trolling but my perception is the rewards structure is considered very unsatisfactory by the players which I don't totally agree with. The reward structure has been changed and very likely will be again to get a good balance of being challenging but not impossible. I do remember when I started playing mpq that PvE was easier and PvP sucked then at some point it flipped. I do feel like it should take a little time and effort to place in the top 5 and 25. I figured placing in the top 300 and a decent chance of winning 2* covers from versus matches would make it relatively easy to build a 2* roster. I've seen plenty of 2* and donor teams able to put up 675+ points which isn't too bad and should be good enough for top 100. It will take a little while to build a 3* character 1 or 2 covers at a time and could be frustrating. I did start playing almost when the game came out and didn't max my first 3* until about the time alliances came out. I will say tokens can't be counted on to build a roster as the odds for a 3* are abysmal.

    The main problem for a transition player is that if you don't finish top 100 you get a cover that you don't need. I am sure all transition players have the 2 star cover for 100-300 so it basically amounts to 250 ISO.
  • nimvin
    nimvin Posts: 81
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    I posted elsewhere but I'll repost here since it seems relevant. I would like to see covers become wildcards that I can choose to place in whichever color of a character I want to. That will help transitioning players and vets who need a respec. I had 7 red HT before I got a black and another red before I got a green. Thats very frustrating when you are trying to build your character up lol.
  • DrStrange-616
    DrStrange-616 Posts: 993 Critical Contributor
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    lukewin wrote:
    I have been slowly cruising along the plateau that is the road to 3* land, which is made even longer by constant new characters being introduced. I've got a deep 3* roster, so variety isn't a problem, but usefulness is.

    This sums it up for me. I've been playing for about 3 months. I have 37 roster spots filled. 23 of those are low-covered 3*s. It's possible to win a 3* cover in events, but getting covers I need is another story. The constant addition of new characters makes it really hard to find covers for the really useful stalwarts. I know it's not supposed to be easy, nor do I want it to be, but there are days when I think it might take me two or three months to get a cover or two for a character I really want to level and, even then, I have to get lucky.

    Granted, I don't really have another reference point, but for me, getting cover rewards is hard(ish). icon_e_smile.gif
  • very difficult
  • RemoDestroyer
    RemoDestroyer Posts: 277 Mover and Shaker
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    lukewin wrote:
    I have been slowly cruising along the plateau that is the road to 3* land, which is made even longer by constant new characters being introduced. I've got a deep 3* roster, so variety isn't a problem, but usefulness is.

    This sums it up for me. I've been playing for about 3 months. I have 37 roster spots filled. 23 of those are low-covered 3*s. It's possible to win a 3* cover in events, but getting covers I need is another story. The constant addition of new characters makes it really hard to find covers for the really useful stalwarts. I know it's not supposed to be easy, nor do I want it to be, but there are days when I think it might take me two or three months to get a cover or two for a character I really want to level and, even then, I have to get lucky.

    Granted, I don't really have another reference point, but for me, getting cover rewards is hard(ish). icon_e_smile.gif

    For some of us hard(ish) is an understatement. There's a member of my alliance that has been playing from the beginning and has a 5/1/5 Hood. He just got the first blue cover a couple weeks ago in the event before the last Unholy Outlaw PvP. I've been playing daily since launch and still missing a blue Doom cover and would be missing more if I didn't use HP I won to buy them.

    But as far as event rewards I don't think it should be too hard to get at least one 3*. And I feel once you start winning 3* covers it gets easier to win more. Maybe the expectations or expected time frame to be able to get 4 covers each event needs to be managed or set up better.
  • It is difficult for me. Most recent 3* cover I got from PvP was a single red LThor and that required me to play like a maniac in the last 4 hours because I didn't have the HP to shield to stay in top 100 with my ~600 score. And I don't even remember when I got a 3* cover in PvP before that, so I don't think I should be in death brackets or my MMR should be very high. I'm buying slots with my HP for now and I don't have the HP income of top scoring alliances. I have 44 slots currently next one costing 600.
  • Square
    Square Posts: 380 Mover and Shaker
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    I don't think so. I've been playing under six months, and have an X-Force with 13 covers, and a Lazy Cap with 13. I have another 3* with 12, a few more with 11, 10, 9. I have a lot of 3* that are steadily getting stronger, all through PVE and PVP rewards, plus some lucky covers from random covers.

    If the covers came easily, people just wouldn't play. I think when I have a strong roster in 2-3 months, I'll feel that I earned it. I put in some time, and come in top 25 in all PVPs, so I've gotten 20-30 3* covers in Season 7. That seems totally reasonable, a solid pace. I also think the set colours is for the best. My X-Force is 5/3/5, and of course I want it 5/5/3, but that gives me something to work on in the future. Getting every cover I need will probably be the point when I quit the game.

    For the people frustrated that they aren't getting enough covers, how fast should you be getting them?
  • _RiO_
    _RiO_ Posts: 1,047 Chairperson of the Boards
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    Square wrote:
    For the people frustrated that they aren't getting enough covers, how fast should you be getting them?

    Faster than once every month, which is kind of what you're stuck at if you've got a transitioning roster; PvE scales you out of competition, PvP hits you with the 166 wall and shards you into harder brackets that require you to pass that wall for a reliable top-100 finish. The best way to raise covers is playing PvP and praying you'll finish just dangling at the bottom of the top-100. If you're playing from an unfavored timezone, you're just boned - period.
  • fmftint
    fmftint Posts: 3,653 Chairperson of the Boards
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    There is no answer to this problem, players with star.pngstar.pngstar.png rosters say it's fine, players with out say it's too slow. Any change will upset the other camp
  • fmftint wrote:
    There is no answer to this problem, players with star.pngstar.pngstar.png rosters say it's fine, players with out say it's too slow. Any change will upset the other camp
    sat
    If you look more deeper , The problem due to in balance of character power. If most 3 star is close in performance there wont be too slow in process. Now we are only looking for Lthor, Hood, Sentry...anymore? ok X-factor....
  • RemoDestroyer
    RemoDestroyer Posts: 277 Mover and Shaker
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    Square wrote:
    I don't think so. I've been playing under six months, and have an X-Force with 13 covers, and a Lazy Cap with 13. I have another 3* with 12, a few more with 11, 10, 9. I have a lot of 3* that are steadily getting stronger, all through PVE and PVP rewards, plus some lucky covers from random covers.

    If the covers came easily, people just wouldn't play. I think when I have a strong roster in 2-3 months, I'll feel that I earned it. I put in some time, and come in top 25 in all PVPs, so I've gotten 20-30 3* covers in Season 7. That seems totally reasonable, a solid pace. I also think the set colours is for the best. My X-Force is 5/3/5, and of course I want it 5/5/3, but that gives me something to work on in the future. Getting every cover I need will probably be the point when I quit the game.

    For the people frustrated that they aren't getting enough covers, how fast should you be getting them?

    That's pretty good. If you were to buy those covers with real money it would cost well over a stark salary. To get that kind of value in 3 weeks of play after having only been playing 2-3 weeks is not bad. There are a lot of players that do even better. So either hp is way overvalued or covers are undervalued.