Are we supposed to be able to play PvP + PvE?

Unknown

I was messing around in Deadpool event, and due to either a bad board or a horrible mental lapse I got totally slapped by PvE all star Juggernaut. So I put my 3 health packs and won the next time, and told myself good thing I don't need Punisher. I thought about starting on the Children of the Atom event, but figure starting with only 2 health packs might turn out to be pretty stupid and since I don't care about Colossus I'll just take my chances later. And then I thought, what if I did care? Then I probably should be making a thread about how there's a health pack conspiracy out there. Sure, I think people probably care too much about the game, but on the other hand I don't think totally not caring about your placement like I do is the right way. We shouldn't expect most people to be almost maxed covered in everything and have nothing to play for, and even max covered players certainly can care a lot about how well they place. There's a trend to try to get rid of the cheese in this game, which I'm all for, but without the cheese, do we need to open group threapy session for PvE Juggernaut victims or PvP Sentry (or whoever else happens to be overpowered) victims? After all in a game without cheese a lot of people will get wiped out by a particularly nasty enemy setup and you have about two complete wipeouts before you're done. And good luck if you're trying to juggle PvP and PvE events, which often have overlapping key characters (e.g. if X is featured in PvP, there's a good chance X is also a member of the heroic roster or a boosted character of a PvE event).

Sure, I like being able to pick to focus on something, but I also remember when HT was a heroic roster and a PvP event featured character. That was a time where if HT goes down you can forget about participating in the other event because both events heavily leaned on HT to do all the heavy lifting unless you want to try to fight level 200 stuff without HT or put a loaner HT against the PvP hordes. Unlimited sustained play is probably bad for the game, but expecting people to not care when 2 wipeouts stops your session might be asking too much. I've been playing with more reasonable teams and it's a lot of fun, but there are also plenty of frustration where your fun teams turns into a complete wipeout, and the only reason I don't mind this is that I don't really need any cover in the game so I don't mind trying out stuff.

Maybe what we need is a new kind of mode where you can still get rewarded for trying out new stuff, but I have no idea what that is. Right now, you can have fun or you can have progress, but you can't have both. Fun teams just don't progress very far.

Trisul

Phantron wrote:

you can have fun

PvE-focused?

Phantron wrote:

or you can have progress

PvP-focused?

I'm guessing this is somewhat intentional. A player solely committed to PvP will probably do better in PvP than someone doing both. Lots of games follow this, loosely (WoW comes to mind).

Unknown

When there are normal PVP events where only 1 character is boosted, I typically don't have a hard time doing both due to the whole "roster diversity" thing but yea, right now its annoying. Storm/MMN is probably the best team in both PVP and PVE right now so doing both at the same time isn't entirely feasible.

Phaserhawk

I've been hoping for a survior mode. No Health Packs, no boosts, you can pick 6-10 TU's from guys you don't bring into Survivor mode, you pick 6 guys and run the gauntlet, you cannot level up guys once locked in. Example you start with a lvl 150 Punisher, but while playing PvE you level him up, fine..but because you started tournament at lvl 150 he is still 150. The farther you go the better the prizes. There is no healing in between and you are limited to one true healer our of your 6 Ares/Patch/Wolvie/X-Force/Deadpool/Daken the catch on this is you must field a 3 person team if possible, if not then 2, if not then 1, so you could have Daken taking on all. You can do scaling based off of the roster coming in.

The survivor mode would last 2-3 days just to give people time to play. If you lock in your 6 and lose you can play again, but you cannot use the same 6 characters until the next survivor mode. There is no challenge against other players or alliances, it would be a progression system much like SHIELD simulator in terms of prizes. The catch......you cannot claim your prizes until the event is over or you cash out. If you ran 6 guys but got knocked out on lvl 10, you could take your 9 prizes and be done with the survivor mode until the next one "cash out" or you could try again but you would forsake the prizes already won to try and go higher and would have to rewin the prizes.

Unknown

While the last heroic was going on (the one that introduced Colossus), because the PVE was using up all my health packs, I pretty much abandoned the PVP (Falcon being needed for both didn't help), getting my lowest score in both of them in ages. Given how frequently there's needed character overlap, I suspect they want some people who might normally place very highly in both to have to pick one from time to time.

Given that I suspect we're getting a Colossus PVP starting tomorrow, and a PVE (that introduces a new character) with Colossus-essential nodes starting tomorrow or Saturday, I think this may continue.

GrumpySmurf1002

Diversity! (That's their argument)

Someone at the stage where I am, scaled for 2*, but have all my soft capped 3*s to use as well, and any boosted 1*s. It's a lot easier to manage health across multiple events when I can basically split my roster in two, and still have depth.

I have no idea what you do once the transition is done. Part of me doesn't care to even find out.

Unknown

PvP/PvE isn't inherently more serious or fun though PvP is probably inherently more P2W due to shields. I run X Force in PvP instead of Sentry and I consider that to be fun. Sure X Force is powerful but if I want a boring team I got Sentry too. On the other hand I run more boring teams for PvE because that's the category I concentrate more on so I don't want to take too many chances, at least not against PvE superstars like Daken or Juggernaut. Not surprisingly my PvP team doesn't progress anywhere as far as the equivalent PvE team. I'm not expecting to get as far with X Force compared to Sentry, but what I'm saying is that people who can afford to go for more 'fun' generally can only do so becasue they've an overwhelmingly powerful roster so they don't care about placing horribly because they're just going to sell 3 3*s covers back for 1500 iso8 anyway. But that's way above what you can expect from the average player.

I hate to constantly bring Hearthstone since I don't even like that game but Arena is a good example of what I'm talking about. You can do it casually for fun, or you can draw something really good and put on your hardcore face to win 25 games. For that matter you could always have your hardcore face on and try to win as many as possible, though there's enough variation in Arena that just having a hardcore face on all the time is rarely enough for great results. This game is missing something that can transition from fun to hardcore. In a Hearthstone Arena you might start out building a fun deck and then maybe you start winning a few games and you say hey I got a good chance to win more games for some great stuff and put on your hardcore face. You can also go the other way around with your hardcore face on and yet you lose a bunch of games and then just mess around your final game. In MPQ there isn't a node that's anything like that. You're either hardcore or you are not. You're not going to start a PvP event with Mohawk Storm as your main attacking plan and somehow claw your way to the 1000s. From looking at the PvP matchups I see that a lot of people with great roster don't mind throwing out an interesting team here and there, but there has to be some possible hint of a payoff for this. Even if your Mohawk Storm gets a lucky streak of ultra high point opponents that you were able to beat, it doesn't matter because eventually people are going to queue you up and take all your points away. Even if you somehow did hit 1000 and switch your team, your team is likely seen by a lot of people so expect massive point losses unless you're shielded, but if you're going to play to 1000 with Mohawk Storm and shield you probably should've just started with Sentry instead of hoping for the improbable.

Trisul

Yeah, this is the reason that the devs should be more proactive about balancing, and especially for PvP. Promoting roster diversity is good for the overall health of the game, it drives sales, it delays the game becoming stale, etc. League of Legends is a good example of this proactive approach.

Trisul

Ben Grimm wrote:

Given that I suspect we're getting a Colossus PVP starting tomorrow, and a PVE (that introduces a new character) with Colossus-essential nodes starting tomorrow or Saturday, I think this may continue.

Colossus is essential for the current PvE. I've never seen a character be essential for two PvE's in a row... has that happened before?

(I would expect Punisher to be the next major essential character. Usually the placement reward character is the next essential.)

lukewin

I prioritize based on what rewards I want. I don't think anyone can successfully play both. I'm finishing out the Deadpool event before I keep trying to go with the Children of the Atom. A lot easier to do when the end times are staggered.

homeinvasion

I lean on Ldaken and Patch hard.

I get through a PVE as undamaged as I can then head over to PVP world, where all your dreams can come true.

they definitely need to diversify the game modes but the current ones are:

PVE: you can guarantee 3 covers if you live in the USA, good for a decent (diminishing) amount of ISO

Lightning Rounds: Shameless Iso8 grab.

PVP: terrible for Iso good for Covers.

HairyDave

Trisul wrote:

Ben Grimm wrote:

Given that I suspect we're getting a Colossus PVP starting tomorrow, and a PVE (that introduces a new character) with Colossus-essential nodes starting tomorrow or Saturday, I think this may continue.

Colossus is essential for the current PvE. I've never seen a character be essential for two PvE's in a row... has that happened before?

I'm pretty sure It has.

Unless I'm getting events mixed up She-Hulk was required two events in a row and I'm pretty sure Steve was too way back when (although I think one of those was a Simulator sub).

Edit: Looks like I was wrong - Jenny wasn't back-to-back but it was two events in two weeks (DA Heroic that introduced Marvel and Unstable ISO-8 two weeks later)

Polares

I have a very long roster of characters, not all of them are maxed, but I can play a lot If I want to, but I don't have the strength of will to play PvE and PvP at full at the same time (well, and the time needed, becuase you need a lot of effort).

Two events ago, Blue Fury was the reward for 1-2 players in PvE so I decided to play hard and win it (in a 7 day long event). In the middle of the event a PvP appeared where Captain Marvel was the reward, I don't have her maxed yet so I considered playing both events at full. I started the PvP late to maximize my chances but after tresspassing the 300 points max I decided I couldn't help myself to keep playing both events at full. In the end I won the Blue Fury, but I lost all the Captain Marvel covers.

I think we need to change PvE extructure. It has been said in a lot of threads that we should not compete against each other in PvE events, so when there is a new PvP that interests you, you can maximize your chances in it without losing the chances in the current PvE.

Unknown

Ben Grimm wrote:

Given that I suspect we're getting a Colossus PVP starting tomorrow, and a PVE (that introduces a new character) with Colossus-essential nodes starting tomorrow or Saturday, I think this may continue.

If they release a new character this Friday/Saturday - i.e. only one week after the last one was released - and keep that up that is 600+ HP a week on rooster slots alone and the chances of you pulling the 3* covers you need will be awful after a couple of months.

Unknown

Polares wrote:

I have a very long roster of characters, not all of them are maxed, but I can play a lot If I want to, but I don't have the strength of will to play PvE and PvP at full at the same time (well, and the time needed, becuase you need a lot of effort).

Two events ago, Blue Fury was the reward for 1-2 players in PvE so I decided to play hard and win it (in a 7 day long event). In the middle of the event a PvP appeared where Captain Marvel was the reward, I don't have her maxed yet so I considered playing both events at full. I started the PvP late to maximize my chances but after tresspassing the 300 points max I decided I couldn't help myself to keep playing both events at full. In the end I won the Blue Fury, but I lost all the Captain Marvel covers.

I think we need to change PvE extructure. It has been said in a lot of threads that we should not compete against each other in PvE events, so when there is a new PvP that interests you, you can maximize your chances in it without losing the chances in the current PvE.

I agree the structure should changed. Maybe we should have event tasks to get the character, like they did in Avengers Alliance. (beat moonstone 3 times, earn 2000 iso, use storms wind storm 5 times. This will also be good for the heroics and save on endless and mind numbing grinding. This will also reward the long term players who have full rosters who end up finishing outside the top 100 because they are facing lvl 300 ldaken/juggernaut teams. they could have 30 tasks on a 7 day event and 15 for a 2 day event.

i'm all for feedback, i am not a idea man so let me know what you think. It cant be much worse than it is now. I understand more players would get the reward and this way you can realistically only win one cover but in my eyes its fairer if everyone who plays has an equal chance (Europeans).

Also i believe us Europeans will be happy knowing we can actually get a cover and get a good nights sleep, instead of waking up every 3 hours just to get 1 cover.

Unknown

homeinvasion wrote:

I lean on Ldaken and Patch hard.

I get through a PVE as undamaged as I can then head over to PVP world, where all your dreams can come true.

they definitely need to diversify the game modes but the current ones are:

PVE: you can guarantee 3 covers if you live in the USA, good for a decent (diminishing) amount of ISO

Lightning Rounds: Shameless Iso8 grab.

PVP: terrible for Iso good for Covers.

If you don't mind me asking Homeinvasion, how are Lightning rounds an Iso8 grab? As a still transitioning 2-3 player (250 days played) I find myself needing increasing amounts of Iso8 as I occasioanlly get new 3 star covers. However not having done many LR's before they never looked that appealing to me. You get 500 iso for the progression but apart from that I can't see anything else? Or is it a case that they pop up regually and it's a nice way to rack up 10+ wins (another reason I haven't done any!) for the 70-140 iso?

The amount of time I've been playing this game you'd think I'd know! Hahahaha!

Unknown

Sumilea wrote:

Ben Grimm wrote:

Given that I suspect we're getting a Colossus PVP starting tomorrow, and a PVE (that introduces a new character) with Colossus-essential nodes starting tomorrow or Saturday, I think this may continue.

If they release a new character this Friday/Saturday - i.e. only one week after the last one was released - and keep that up that is 600+ HP a week on rooster slots alone and the chances of you pulling the 3* covers you need will be awful after a couple of months.

They've been incredibly consistent about the every-other-PVE thing on new characters. if they do introduce a new character in the net PVE, I'd expect it to be a longer one than the last two, and we might not have it in hand until next weekend. Just a guess though.

At the same time, if I had to guess who it is, I'd guess the 2* Warbird/Ms. Marvel that we know is coming.

simonsez

Rhythm wrote:

how are Lightning rounds an Iso8 grab?

If you play each one to around 300 points, between battle wins, progression awards, and tokens, you'll probably end up with around 4-5k iso each time. And since they run 24 LRs each week, it can add up pretty fast.

y2fitzy

I'm not good enough to hit 300, I just play to 100. Join early and plough through five seed teams, you'll hit 100 in 10 minutes or so. Easy ISO that quickly adds up

Unknown

I don't know how I'd play both PVE and PVP if I didn't have Daken and Patch maxed.

They make the early stages of PVP really easy. I got to 600 before I even had to use a health pack.

Same for PVE. For everything but the devil dinosaur match, I didn't really need many health packs unless the enemy got off an unlikely big hit attack. And even then, unless they did it near the end of the match, Patch and Daken are near full health by the time I beat them.

So, to answer your question, we are.

I just don't know how people do when they don't have the characters that I do.