Fair Selling Price After Nerf... Please!

emaker27

The quote below comes from Al's blog at Demiurge.

"Give players an out – If players truly feel that your balance changes have made the durable no longer useful, then selling it for hard and soft currency should be a no-brainer. During the period after a balance change, we massively increase the sale price of characters.
When we made that sale-price change, there was only a small bump in the rate at which players sold those characters. Here’s a chart showing the number of people who sold those cards in the window surrounding the nerf... <snip>

Source: http://almnop.tumblr.com/post/863062742 ... ce-changes

If I was given all of the ISO for levels and HP for covers that I had invested into Spiderman, I would've 100% sold him without thinking twice, since I will never use him by choice again. The fact that the sale-price change was a tiny fraction of that, it wasn't a fair deal so I kept him. If Demiurge really believes that quote, it would stand to reason that a 1 to 1 fair price for what you invested for a nerfed character would also only produce a small bump of players selling it back. The upcoming Magneto nerf sounds like the next available spot to try this out.

This would accurately confirm what players really think since it would be in game; rather than just hearing what the vocal minority thinks through the forums or Facebook.

This is a serious post/plea for the company so they get a complete picture of the situation. Presently, it seems as if they created a favorable position for the company (unequal character investment value), and then justified themselves when players acted favorably for the company (very few characters sold).

emaker27

This seems like the perfect time to resurrect this thread...

Unknown

80k is just not enough. I want enough ISO to bring a character from their lowest level all the way to 166. Plus 2500 HP.

Unknown

A full refund of all ISo from base level to max and all hp, if any, spent on covers is in order. Even if you chose not to sell, a certain percentage should be automatically refunded considering how much they changed him. He's a new character now, and not even close to the one anyone paid for.

HailMary

emaker27 wrote:

If Demiurge really believes that quote, it would stand to reason that a 1 to 1 fair price for what you invested for a nerfed character would also only produce a small bump of players selling it back.

That's not at all what anything in the quote suggests.

Moreover, you're essentially saying "I want any use that I got out of a pre-nerf character to be completely free. Not only that, but after getting some use out of said pre-nerf character, I want to upgrade those covers to wild-card covers, redeemable for just about any other 3* cover in the game."

Why you think this is "fair" is utterly beyond me.

emaker27

HailMary wrote:

Why you think this is "fair" is utterly beyond me.

Good point. At the time I wrote that originally, I was very upset over the Spiderman change. But at a minimum we should be able to agree that the current selling price is too low. Finding a middle ground would be much better.

scottee

I think the current price is fine. You put all that iso into a character and got to use him for x weeks/months. If you get a full refund, then they should take away all the points you earned while using him.

Wonko33

I would like them to say ok you had 10 cmags covers- distribute them the way you want with the new powers

Raffoon

scottee wrote:

I think the current price is fine. You put all that iso into a character and got to use him for x weeks/months. If you get a full refund, then they should take away all the points you earned while using him.

OK, your logic is sound. However, I can logic too!

People invested in the ability to use cmags indefinitely. Since value has been taken from him, the Dev's should give everyone who has cmags leveled some amount of ISO and HP because they now have a character worth far less than what was sold to them. That's without having to sell him, they should get that ISO/HP to make up for the clear removal of value from their roster.

Also seems logical, no?

Unknown

A boss I had once told me that when you call to dispute a charge on your credit card with your credit card company, the key words to use to convince them to accept your dispute and process your claim without the typical push back are "I didn't get what I paid for."

I recently paid cash for approximately 9 C Mags covers. While I understand the changes that were made, and why, I imagine we should have to respect that some people who paid money for covers for the character will feel they didn't get what they paid for, given the total overhaul of the character, despite both parties of the transaction acting in good faith. I don't see the down side of refunding the covers and ISO to place on other character covers they have the ability to purchase other than it might be difficult in terms of logistics -- it's not a cash refund.

I don't see it happening, but I figured I'd mention it as a matter of principle. Another principle involved is the principle of universality -- applying the same standards to ourselves as we do to others. I can't think of any business (or bank) which would accept a transaction on terms that don't guarantee something close to a full refund (full repatriation of invested capital). This current selling/refund price amounts to about 10 cents on the dollar (based on my case and the numbers I see right now). That's less than what banks often demand to settle debtors facing bankruptcy.

One could say it's just a game, but it is a commercial transaction like any other and principles should and do matter, and should still apply universally, at least if we agree they are a good idea.

(for the record, I like MPQ )

Spoit

Sidenote, anyone have any data for the HP breakpoints for 2*s (or at least, how much you get for a maxed one)?

My 78 Daken is worth 22685/450
51 Mhawk is worth 8025/250
and my replacement mhawk at 31 is worth 2500/150

Raffoon

Spoit wrote:

Sidenote, anyone have any data for the HP breakpoints for 2*s (or at least, how much you get for a maxed one)?

My 78 Daken is worth 22685/450
51 Mhawk is worth 8025/250
and my replacement mhawk at 31 is worth 2500/150

For SCIENCE I have another data point for you. I put a blue cover onto Daken, and then I raised his level from 78 to his new max of 79. His selling price was exactly the same for both ISO and HP, unfortunately

Moral

Raffoon wrote:

scottee wrote:

I think the current price is fine. You put all that iso into a character and got to use him for x weeks/months. If you get a full refund, then they should take away all the points you earned while using him.

OK, your logic is sound. However, I can logic too!

People invested in the ability to use cmags indefinitely. Since value has been taken from him, the Dev's should give everyone who has cmags leveled some amount of ISO and HP because they now have a character worth far less than what was sold to them. That's without having to sell him, they should get that ISO/HP to make up for the clear removal of value from their roster.

Also seems logical, no?

In January D3 put out a list that said "be warned, these products are changing. There is no timetable but changes are coming."

Then months of posts are on the front pages of the forum asking, "when are the changes you promised coming?"

What exactly does that do to your 'indefinite use' argument?

Unknown

Spoit wrote:

Sidenote, anyone have any data for the HP breakpoints for 2*s (or at least, how much you get for a maxed one)?

My 78 Daken is worth 22685/450
51 Mhawk is worth 8025/250
and my replacement mhawk at 31 is worth 2500/150

The 2 stars are selling for half their iso, so for level 94 - 34,765. I have heard the hp for a 94 hawkeye is 550