Liljoeyjojo said: mpiter said: By the way, you will not find much use of Karnak and Sabretooth because other 4* meta are much faster than them. Try to champ C&D instead. This pair is a very useful black and yellow feeder to solve puzzles and in other niche situations although Domino is also a good black provider. Outside the meta, they are the character I use the most often for those special situations.I do not think that Karnak and Sabretooth deserve the meta qualification. They do not have any use in PVE and they are very easy targets in PVP. I love the Karnak+Chavez pair that some people still use in PVP. You can always kill Karnak in less than 4 turns, then most of the time Chavez before she can use her passive. I never use them. I've been playing a lot more competitively in PVP, and thats where Karnak and Sabretooth shine. Not for PVE, and not for climbing in PVP necessarily, and may not be scariest on defence in PVP, but they are the key to part of the rock/paper/scissors dynamic of the meta that you see in 4* PVP, and they allow some of the fastest clears of a node when hitting certain opponents.
mpiter said: By the way, you will not find much use of Karnak and Sabretooth because other 4* meta are much faster than them. Try to champ C&D instead. This pair is a very useful black and yellow feeder to solve puzzles and in other niche situations although Domino is also a good black provider. Outside the meta, they are the character I use the most often for those special situations.I do not think that Karnak and Sabretooth deserve the meta qualification. They do not have any use in PVE and they are very easy targets in PVP. I love the Karnak+Chavez pair that some people still use in PVP. You can always kill Karnak in less than 4 turns, then most of the time Chavez before she can use her passive. I never use them.
Karnak as I understand is a great pairing with Chavez for certain matchups, especially Polaris/Sabretooth or Polaris/Medusa where bringing any strike/special tile users is dangerous. Karnak can take out a Polaris or Medusa in 4 turns and reduces the risk of special tile effects which is important.
Sabretooth is just the fastest and best way to clear Polaris/Grocket nodes, or any nodes with Grocket. I have a 3/1/0 Sabretooth and even that knocks out Polaris/Grocket really really quickly. Can't wait to champ him.
I have heard Cloak and Dagger is great and will work on them eventually, but I think ive got PVE mostly sorted with Polaris/Grocket/Juggs, and PVP is where Karnak and Sabretooth can be really effective in certain match ups.
Theghouse said: Don't let any silly comments calling Sabertooth bad dissuade you. He is an excellent Rocket hunter, as it seems like you already know.
4* Beast and Morbius are also going to be players in the heavy special tile meta that exists in 4* land. You mentioned that you're keeping up with champing the new releases, but if you end up short on one of those two after their event rotation ends, I would move them to the front of the list to focus on before any other middle tier characters.
mpiter said:I quote a part of the comment I had written : "Sabretooth is not good. He is very weak against any team that does not produce special tiles." In other words, yes a good R&G hunter, but easy meat in defense in PVP and too slow in PVE in comparison to the meta to be useful.Let's talk about FACTS now. I have just started the current PVP event Please Stand By with obligatory SW5. I firstly beat the first three teams with 1* companions to have three team corresponding to my MMR. Then I passed one team 37 times to end up seeing the first 40 teams the game proposed to me for a total of 80 characters (the two complements of SW5). I also wrote down the character levels of any Grokit, or Polaris + R&G4/BRB/Medusa team to be sure to avoid counting several times the same team. Here are the results of the character occurrences in decreasing order out of 80 occurrences:Polaris: 15R&G and Kitty: 10 (both)R&G and Kitty: 10 (sorry to repeat, it is to have correct automatic numbering)Rogue: 5Medusa and Deadpool5: 4SameDrax, Carol, Px5,: 3SameSameHulk Main Event, AC, BRB, OML: 2Sabretooth: 0The rest appeared once or never. Rogue and Drax can be taken away because they were boosted. I rarely seem then when they are not boosted.
Theghouse said:4* Beast and Morbius are also going to be players in the heavy special tile meta that exists in 4* land. You mentioned that you're keeping up with champing the new releases, but if you end up short on one of those two after their event rotation ends, I would move them to the front of the list to focus on before any other middle tier characters.
mpiter said: Theghouse said: Don't let any silly comments calling Sabertooth bad dissuade you. He is an excellent Rocket hunter, as it seems like you already know. I love when people write offending comments with words such as silly, stupid, or brainless without backing up their opinions with facts.I quote a part of the comment I had written : "Sabretooth is not good. He is very weak against any team that does not produce special tiles." In other words, yes a good R&G hunter, but easy meat in defense in PVP and too slow in PVE in comparison to the meta to be useful.Let's talk about FACTS now. I have just started the current PVP event Please Stand By with obligatory SW5. I firstly beat the first three teams with 1* companions to have three team corresponding to my MMR. Then I passed one team 37 times to end up seeing the first 40 teams the game proposed to me for a total of 80 characters (the two complements of SW5). I also wrote down the character levels of any Grokit, or Polaris + R&G4/BRB/Medusa team to be sure to avoid counting several times the same team. Here are the results of the character occurrences in decreasing order out of 80 occurrences:Polaris: 15R&G and Kitty: 10 (both)R&G and Kitty: 10 (sorry to repeat, it is to have correct automatic numbering)Rogue: 5Medusa and Deadpool5: 4SameDrax, Carol, Px5,: 3SameSameHulk Main Event, AC, BRB, OML: 2Sabretooth: 0The rest appeared once or never. Rogue and Drax can be taken away because they were boosted. I rarely seem then when they are not boosted.Take away the 5* of the list and we can safely assume that Polaris, R&G, and Medusa are the base of the 4* meta, the first two being the real meta. Kitty is the first 5* to complement the meta at intermediate level, though at a higher one, iHulkoye is better as DAZ0273 pointed to.I meet Sabretooth from time to time in PVP. This drawing of 40 pairs was not his best shot. But he is VERY far behind Polaris, R&G, and Medusa in my MMR. I did not expect him to appear more than once, or twice if he was lucky. Anyone claiming the opposite has obviously not played during the last three months or is unable to face FACTS.So, I repeat, do not invest in Sabretooth before champing the 4* meta. If he was any good in comparison to the meta trio, we would meet him much more often. Furthermore, there are other 4* non-meta with more uses than him in niche situations.4* Beast and Morbius are also going to be players in the heavy special tile meta that exists in 4* land. You mentioned that you're keeping up with champing the new releases, but if you end up short on one of those two after their event rotation ends, I would move them to the front of the list to focus on before any other middle tier characters. Beast and Morbius are unlikely to be characters in the heavy special tile meta that exists in 4* land. They are too slow for PVE and too slow and fragile for PVP. This was the case of all 4* anti-special characters such as Sabretooth or Kraven.Beast has been available for weeks and many people have championed him. Nobody uses him in PVP because he is too easy to handle. Just control his black and kill him in less than 4 turns. He is just fodder in defense. Polaris had already been intensively used when she had been available as long as Beast now. Even though Morbius is better than Beast, I do not think that he will be heavily used because R&G gives a better start.No characters define the meta, only teams. Which Beast-based team or Morbius-based team would be more efficient than Polaris + R&G in PVE or in PVP?Do not forget that the AI is unable to correctly handle a character who needs a special strategy. The only teams that can enter the meta are those who passively do a lot of brainless damage from the beginning of a fight. That is why the 4* meta was a few years ago composed of R&G, Gamora, and Medusa. Gamora was superseded by Juggernaut for his team damage, and then Medusa was replaced by Polaris. Just brainless heavy damage without thinking, the only thing the AI can do. The same can be said for Grokit who had dominated the meta till iHulkoye. Quick brainless heavy damage very difficult to avoid.
DAZ0273 said: This is such a great time to have 4* MMR, I envy you. I think the 4's have been so varied and good recently.