22€ Character Tax per month

supergarvsupergarv Posts: 371 Mover and Shaker
So, I just figured out if I actually continue to play after maybe unretiring with a possible UI update (/rant1) that this game has too many characters if you play efficiently and only want to spend a reasonable amount of money.

I just reached the magic threshold of 300 characters after 2164 days and that without an unreasonable collection:

- Only 1 1* for DDQ
- A full 2* and 3* farm with only one max-champed and a rotation (yes I sold my trophy bagmen)
- „Only“ 15 4* max-champed (so 14 farm dupes), all other 4‘s collected
- All 5*s

If I want to keep up the optimum char rewards from the game (which is a marathon, not a sprint) I‘ll have to buy 2x slots each month for the new bi-weekly releases.

4000 HP cost ~30€ (actually 5800HP are 44€). I usually spend 200 HP on daily deal tokens, and I spend about 300 HP on average a day on PVP shields (thats NOT much; default events I use the 8h and 3h shields, only midweek PVP a 24hr). So total of 30x200 + 30x300 = 15.000 HP. Thats about spending 90% of the game‘s HP income for me, so it leaves me at about a surplus of 1000 HP per month, that I occasionally spend on vaults. In the 2164 days I spent about 2200€ on the game. Not much, but not little. I consider that an ok amount of money for the entertainment the game provides.

But now coughing up 3000 HP would amount to ~22€ a month. Just to be able to use the stuff I „earn“ by putting much time into pvp and pve.

So, my questions would be:

- Is my sleepy math off somewhere? Am I not properly keeping track of HP income?! Should I just let go of daily deals and vaults?

- Is that a „fair deal“ to other players and am I just too „high-end“ and should let it go?

- How about lowering the cost to a reasonable amount of 1k, given the sheer amount of new char releases? 
- Or how about making VIP include two monthly roster slots to keep up with the game? Currently VIP only yields 700HP (~5€).

Curious to hear thoughts of people who crossed that threshold long ago. 

Comments

  • supergarvsupergarv Posts: 371 Mover and Shaker
    I think I overestimated my 300HP/day PVP average. Usually only 2-3 shields per event.
    I‘ll cut back on daily deals maybe and keep better track of it.
    Still I think VIP shoild probably include 2 slots a month (maybe not „free HP to spend“ but actually giving 2 slots). However that might be hard to implement as a „reward“.

    To me 4k a month seems rather pricey to offset, given I only cash in on LTs twice a year to push my 4*s forward.
  • KolenceKolence Posts: 823 Critical Contributor
    No spending HP on boosts in pve?

    If I try to place a bit better with my baby champs, I'll usually spend more gold than I'm earning from events and champ rewards.

    313 slots. 
    Very similar composition to what @supergarv described, only I think I have fewer 370's.
    And I still have 2 champ bagmen... :) 
  • Daredevil217Daredevil217 Posts: 3,172 Chairperson of the Boards
    Kolence said:
    No spending HP on boosts in pve?

    If I try to place a bit better with my baby champs, I'll usually spend more gold than I'm earning from events and champ rewards.

    313 slots. 
    Very similar composition to what @supergarv described, only I think I have fewer 370's.
    And I still have 2 champ bagmen... :) 
    I don’t. When I Hulkoye it’s +2 R/Y, +2 TU. The occasional Britty I just go +2 blue. I’ll spend Iso all day on boosts (wish we could buy more at once). Near the end if I’m queuing up a tough battle or want to make sure I win, I’ll occasionally toss out a +2 all, but they usually replenish before Id need to spend HP on them. 
  • supergarvsupergarv Posts: 371 Mover and Shaker
    Oh right. I buy Healthpacks maybe once or twice a week. And +2 All Boosts on PVE Challenge node 1-2 times a week (the rest from my „income“ of boosts)
  • shardwickshardwick Posts: 1,801 Chairperson of the Boards
    I'm a $2 a month player with 289 roster slots and currently 27k hp. I spend 300 hp on each pvp event and will spend hp when necessary on health packs or boosts. I used to spend hp on shards but haven't really done that in a while since most of the 5s that I really care about are now fully covered or champed. My only real guilty pleasure are those special vaults that have 5* shards and supports in them. Outside of that I don't really spend a whole lot. Oh and I'll spend hp for shields in lightning rounds because I mean 50 hp for two heroics for getting t25-50 is a pretty good deal. 
  • BadBad Posts: 1,003 Chairperson of the Boards
    235 slots. Im missing only 6 5*s, 2 of them shardable already.
    Only 2 1*s.
    Farming all 3* except LR.
    Usually Im never buying vaults unless there are good 5* shards. I find Im never in need of HP as my HP income exceeds new characters. 
    Being in alliance of active players it is a good burst too.
    Being usually the top scorer in my alliance helps to keep the good work. 
  • ZalastaZalasta Posts: 81 Match Maker
    They should add a roster spot to the VIP rewards. Those desperately need to be updated anyway. VIP was enticing when I was transitioning to 4 star land, but once there it lost a lot of its shine. Now in 5 star land, the only interest is the LTs, but not for the cost.  Maybe they should rework VIP rewards by shield rank.
  • GrimSkaldGrimSkald Posts: 2,060 Chairperson of the Boards
    supergarv said:
    So, I just figured out if I actually continue to play after maybe unretiring with a possible UI update (/rant1) that this game has too many characters if you play efficiently and only want to spend a reasonable amount of money.

    I just reached the magic threshold of 300 characters after 2164 days and that without an unreasonable collection:

    - Only 1 1* for DDQ
    - A full 2* and 3* farm with only one max-champed and a rotation (yes I sold my trophy bagmen)
    - „Only“ 15 4* max-champed (so 14 farm dupes), all other 4‘s collected
    - All 5*s

    If I want to keep up the optimum char rewards from the game (which is a marathon, not a sprint) I‘ll have to buy 2x slots each month for the new bi-weekly releases.

    4000 HP cost ~30€ (actually 5800HP are 44€). I usually spend 200 HP on daily deal tokens, and I spend about 300 HP on average a day on PVP shields (thats NOT much; default events I use the 8h and 3h shields, only midweek PVP a 24hr). So total of 30x200 + 30x300 = 15.000 HP. Thats about spending 90% of the game‘s HP income for me, so it leaves me at about a surplus of 1000 HP per month, that I occasionally spend on vaults. In the 2164 days I spent about 2200€ on the game. Not much, but not little. I consider that an ok amount of money for the entertainment the game provides.

    But now coughing up 3000 HP would amount to ~22€ a month. Just to be able to use the stuff I „earn“ by putting much time into pvp and pve.

    So, my questions would be:

    - Is my sleepy math off somewhere? Am I not properly keeping track of HP income?! Should I just let go of daily deals and vaults?

    - Is that a „fair deal“ to other players and am I just too „high-end“ and should let it go?

    - How about lowering the cost to a reasonable amount of 1k, given the sheer amount of new char releases? 
    - Or how about making VIP include two monthly roster slots to keep up with the game? Currently VIP only yields 700HP (~5€).

    Curious to hear thoughts of people who crossed that threshold long ago. 

    So I have 48 dupe 4* at the moment, and my roster slot total is 304 (otherwise all the characters, including all 5* at the moment.)  The big difference is I have probably about 1/3 to 1/2 of my 3* duped.  I track the "last featured" data on my spreadsheet, and every so often I sell off the max champ for the dupe 3* that has had it's PVP longest ago - the only place the higher level 3* makes any difference at all is when they're featured in PVP.  I've been caught with a less-than-maximum 3* only a handful of times, and I was caught out with a very low 3* only once that I can think of - they featured 3* Falcon both a week ago and about four weeks prior.  TBH it was only a pain when dealing with iHulkoye teams as it meant he crumbled more quickly, otherwise I didn't really notice the difference, particularly when running my own iHulkoye.
    I have sold 3 4*s so far - CM (she hit 350, I decided even if I do use her from time to time, that's high enough,) X-Force Wolverine (I don't use him for nearly anything, and he's already a feeder,) and IMHB (Same.)  In the latter two cases I sold them a bit over 300.  I haven't sold anyone else yet - I only have 3 dupes over 300 (Peggy, Miles, and Deadpool,) and I can foresee using any of them in the right circumstances.  Otherwise I'm considering it -it seems clear they're not going to "grandfather" any more feeders in, and though a higher level 4* does make a decent difference in PVP when they're featured, there are so many 4* and they're featured so rarely...
    Anyway, I guess what I'm saying is don't be afraid to sell your max champs when the dupe is high enough that you feel comfortable fielding them when they're featured in PVP - that will probably help with your income a lot since you'll cut 10-20 roster slots at least.
    Incidentally, for "daily deals" I only do the ones 100hp in general.  I don't do the 200hp since there's little functional difference between the pulls and it's twice as much.  The only 200hp daily deals I do are when there's a 5* involved, because hey, a chance (however small) to pull a 5* is probably worth the extra 100hp, and it has come up... twice I think? 
  • Punter1Punter1 Posts: 485 Mover and Shaker
    I've babysat my ISO income when I was trying to catch up 4*s ages ago after a hiatus.  

    I've babysat my CP income when I was hoarding more

    I've never babysat HP and I'm not concerned by the flip to 2k roster slots that is imminent for me.  

    F2P player - current 295 roster slots, full 2 & 3* farm, only a handful of dupe 4*s, but more coming.

    Some dirty math....

    PVP - SCL10, hit 1k these days, the jump to 1200 I've been chickening out on, 1x 24H shield.  T100 mostly in a T50 alliance.  NET -30HP/event = -90/week

    PVE - SCL10 - lazy 5 clears, T100 mostly in a T50/25 Ally = 335HP/event (Infinite Pursuit used for the sums) + 95HP/day on subs if T50 (maybe 50%) so per week = 335*2 + 95*7/2 = ~1000HP

    Roster spend (in theory) = 4000HP/month for 2x new characters = 1000/wk

    So I'm close to break-even from events before adding in DPD, season and of course champ rewards.  I spend 100HP on about 50% of vault daily rewards, skipping those with less exciting 4s & never spend HP on health or boosts (that's what DP tokens are for).   My HP is always increasing - I bank enough that every so often I can buy a 40pk or similar.  

    There was a time when I kept a spreadsheet... I tracked HP, ISO & CP daily.  I marked in big HP spends (roster slots and 40pks), but not daily deals or shields.  Over the 3 years my HP daily income ignoring the big spends was 260 on average, so add some shields and daily deals and maybe closer to 500/day, this was before SCL10 , but I was more active PVP, shield hopping and using 3+ shields/event.
  • supergarvsupergarv Posts: 371 Mover and Shaker
    Punter1 said:


    PVP - SCL10, hit 1k these days, the jump to 1200 I've been chickening out on, 1x 24H shield.  T100 mostly in a T50 alliance.  NET -30HP/event = -90/week


    You‘re off by 10x - that would be 900/week. You‘ll probably gain that though with the champ rewards and ddq that you meantioned, I tend to agree.

    Anyhow. Its weird that at 300 spots you have to pay more instead of less. It only „punishes“ veterans, as stated above, and I find that a weird effort on those that are your most loyal customers, erm, players.
  • Punter1Punter1 Posts: 485 Mover and Shaker
    edited 29 March 2021, 19:42
    supergarv said:
    Punter1 said:


    PVP - SCL10, hit 1k these days, the jump to 1200 I've been chickening out on, 1x 24H shield.  T100 mostly in a T50 alliance.  NET -30HP/event = -90/week


    You‘re off by 10x - that would be 900/week. You‘ll probably gain that though with the champ rewards and ddq that you meantioned, I tend to agree.

    Nope, that's per week.  Income in an event of 160 Prog + 30 placement + 80 Alliance placement = 270 - Spend 300 on 1 shield = net -30 x 3 events/ week = -90HP/week from PVP

    The placement is conservative - a decent number I'm T50 and Ally T25, which adds 10 & 20Hp, so means I'm breakeven

    Don't disagree, but HP is their money source, and HP is still fairly liberally sprinkled through all regular activities.  This is why I've stuck with the game so long, I can get everything I want out of the game with $0.
  • AkoniAkoni Posts: 493 Mover and Shaker
    I've found that how you play greatly effects what resources are most valuable. I started off highly valuing HP since ISO was so easy to collect. I farm, btw. Once the milestones dropped, my ISO hoard was depleted in 24 hours due to the number of champs I had. As I  approach 300 slots with 40,000+ HP, I don't really pay much attention to HP anymore. I am really ISO starved, so for me, I think I'll be able to handle a few 2k slots (not happily), but getting enough to continue champing to keep my farm going is the problem. I can't wait for more of my 3s and 4s to get up in levels so I can sell my maxed characters.
  • fractalvisionsfractalvisions Posts: 73 Match Maker
    Maybe this is a naïve question (I'm a casual player who's spent a grand total of 80¢ on the game so only spend HP on roster slots and sell max champed dupes), but what's the benefit of the daily deals? Aren't they just heroics? Do you not get plenty of those anyway? What am I missing?
  • SekiliciousSekilicious Posts: 344 Mover and Shaker
    Maybe this is a naïve question (I'm a casual player who's spent a grand total of 80¢ on the game so only spend HP on roster slots and sell max champed dupes), but what's the benefit of the daily deals? Aren't they just heroics? Do you not get plenty of those anyway? What am I missing?
    I think it is once you have enough roster spots then HP starts to pile up. Spending on daily deals gives a small chance at a 4* and some shards for 100 HP, which is pretty valuable when building your 4* roster. But you are correct, if you don't have all the 4* (and maybe 5*) rostered and a sustainable 2 and 3* farm then all hp should go to roster spots. 
  • Punter1Punter1 Posts: 485 Mover and Shaker
    Maybe this is a naïve question (I'm a casual player who's spent a grand total of 80¢ on the game so only spend HP on roster slots and sell max champed dupes), but what's the benefit of the daily deals? Aren't they just heroics? Do you not get plenty of those anyway? What am I missing?
    Daily deal is only "worth" it in my opinion on vaults, I used to buy every vault daily deal, now I'm a bit more picky.  Vaults have a limited pool of rewards, so each time you pull, your odds get slightly better to pull the 4* and LL token. So by buying the daily deal, you're upping you token count pulled from the vault for limited cost.  

    Daily deal on Heroics isn't worth it.  Though maybe for those that spend a lot and are a wash in HP it's just something to buy!
  • GrimSkaldGrimSkald Posts: 2,060 Chairperson of the Boards
    Punter1 said:
    Maybe this is a naïve question (I'm a casual player who's spent a grand total of 80¢ on the game so only spend HP on roster slots and sell max champed dupes), but what's the benefit of the daily deals? Aren't they just heroics? Do you not get plenty of those anyway? What am I missing?
    Daily deal is only "worth" it in my opinion on vaults, I used to buy every vault daily deal, now I'm a bit more picky.  Vaults have a limited pool of rewards, so each time you pull, your odds get slightly better to pull the 4* and LL token. So by buying the daily deal, you're upping you token count pulled from the vault for limited cost.  

    Daily deal on Heroics isn't worth it.  Though maybe for those that spend a lot and are a wash in HP it's just something to buy!

    Well, it's a pull and 100hp for the vanilla heroic token is so low compared to everything else I take it.  But I do make more HP than I spend on roster slots and shields, so the extra HP goes to whatever I feel like - the heroic and vault pulls, at 100 hp each, are seriously cheap.  I do like to indulge in a 40 pack with a 5* every so often, since theoretically a 5* is worth any amount of "heroic" pulls as they're only available via CP/LTs.
  • jreddjredd Posts: 1,330 Chairperson of the Boards
    i'm replacing my 3* dupes with the new releases. it'll keep me under 300 for a bit. 
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