krakenoon said: The point I was trying to make is that anyone not in 5land before the restructuring has had the goalposts moved. Yes, overall there are “more” rewards, but anyone not reaping the benefits of a roster featuring numerous champed 4*s are not able to keep up rostering costs without paying or playing way too much. Before the restructure, players could ride out filling their roster with a variety of methods.Now, it could be argued that with dilution now moving into the 5* tier, the 2000 HP rostering cost will catch up to vets sooner, it is still an obstacle anyone looking to roster all non-limiteds will eventually have to face.Also, I don’t see how the only viable method of getting specific 5* shards is roughly the same rewards.
jp1 said: krakenoon said: The point I was trying to make is that anyone not in 5land before the restructuring has had the goalposts moved. Yes, overall there are “more” rewards, but anyone not reaping the benefits of a roster featuring numerous champed 4*s are not able to keep up rostering costs without paying or playing way too much. Before the restructure, players could ride out filling their roster with a variety of methods.Now, it could be argued that with dilution now moving into the 5* tier, the 2000 HP rostering cost will catch up to vets sooner, it is still an obstacle anyone looking to roster all non-limiteds will eventually have to face.Also, I don’t see how the only viable method of getting specific 5* shards is roughly the same rewards. Actually for me, it has been a net loss. As I mentioned I was hitting 47X before the changes and now while grinding harder I am barely getting baby champs. Sure, I’ll get half a cover once a year for a classic that will likely never result in any of them getting champed. Yes, I can also “sharget” a five now, with worse results than the previous bonus system.
Vhailorx said: jp1 said: krakenoon said: The point I was trying to make is that anyone not in 5land before the restructuring has had the goalposts moved. Yes, overall there are “more” rewards, but anyone not reaping the benefits of a roster featuring numerous champed 4*s are not able to keep up rostering costs without paying or playing way too much. Before the restructure, players could ride out filling their roster with a variety of methods.Now, it could be argued that with dilution now moving into the 5* tier, the 2000 HP rostering cost will catch up to vets sooner, it is still an obstacle anyone looking to roster all non-limiteds will eventually have to face.Also, I don’t see how the only viable method of getting specific 5* shards is roughly the same rewards. Actually for me, it has been a net loss. As I mentioned I was hitting 47X before the changes and now while grinding harder I am barely getting baby champs. Sure, I’ll get half a cover once a year for a classic that will likely never result in any of them getting champed. Yes, I can also “sharget” a five now, with worse results than the previous bonus system. But there are more 5*s being released, so you have to account for that. 455 is 18 covers. 470 is 33 covers. 18 * 12 5*s released a year at the current pace is 216 5* covers (plus the classic characters shards that you can also get in 40% of events).33 * 8.67 5*s released on the old pace is ~286 covers. So if the pve changes really do account for the entirety of that gap, you have lost about 1.3 5* covers a week with the new system.For me under the old system, if I regularly played pve to max prog, I could get 8-10 covers for most 5*s while they were in LTs, and it was pretty easy to stop at one token cover for any given 5* and roll those covers over to later LT pools. Under the new system, I am earning 5* covers at about the same rate, or maybe a tiny bit more. But since some of those rewards are in shards, it's harder to roll progress over to high value LT pools. I am also earning a ton more 4* covers though, and those champ rewards would probably make a difference in my math if I were more diligent about champing and applying all those extra levels right away. As is, shard levels for my 4* roster have more or less become my new piggy bank, just waiting to be applied when I decide I really want to chase a particular character and need to squeeze every last token, HP and CP.
jp1 said: Vhailorx said: jp1 said: krakenoon said: The point I was trying to make is that anyone not in 5land before the restructuring has had the goalposts moved. Yes, overall there are “more” rewards, but anyone not reaping the benefits of a roster featuring numerous champed 4*s are not able to keep up rostering costs without paying or playing way too much. Before the restructure, players could ride out filling their roster with a variety of methods.Now, it could be argued that with dilution now moving into the 5* tier, the 2000 HP rostering cost will catch up to vets sooner, it is still an obstacle anyone looking to roster all non-limiteds will eventually have to face.Also, I don’t see how the only viable method of getting specific 5* shards is roughly the same rewards. Actually for me, it has been a net loss. As I mentioned I was hitting 47X before the changes and now while grinding harder I am barely getting baby champs. Sure, I’ll get half a cover once a year for a classic that will likely never result in any of them getting champed. Yes, I can also “sharget” a five now, with worse results than the previous bonus system. But there are more 5*s being released, so you have to account for that. 455 is 18 covers. 470 is 33 covers. 18 * 12 5*s released a year at the current pace is 216 5* covers (plus the classic characters shards that you can also get in 40% of events).33 * 8.67 5*s released on the old pace is ~286 covers. So if the pve changes really do account for the entirety of that gap, you have lost about 1.3 5* covers a week with the new system.For me under the old system, if I regularly played pve to max prog, I could get 8-10 covers for most 5*s while they were in LTs, and it was pretty easy to stop at one token cover for any given 5* and roll those covers over to later LT pools. Under the new system, I am earning 5* covers at about the same rate, or maybe a tiny bit more. But since some of those rewards are in shards, it's harder to roll progress over to high value LT pools. I am also earning a ton more 4* covers though, and those champ rewards would probably make a difference in my math if I were more diligent about champing and applying all those extra levels right away. As is, shard levels for my 4* roster have more or less become my new piggy bank, just waiting to be applied when I decide I really want to chase a particular character and need to squeeze every last token, HP and CP. I think you aren’t accounting for HP loss or the fact that champ rewards are worse all around which has a large impact on a fully developed roster. Otherwise, I don’t know what to tell you, under one system I wasn’t just champing the five, I was adding a significant amount of champ levels (in itself a waterfall effect to champ the next and so on) and now I am not. Sure, it isn’t the case for everyone, and for those who are benefiting from the new system I am sincerely happy. Rewards across the board need to scale with shield levels I think, in order to compensate.
DAZ0273 said: So today is the day of the big Bish bosh, right? I am intrigued to see how neutered he and Captain no longer Worthy are gonna be.
Vhailorx said: They didn't mention the change to Bishop's yellow. Now it requires 6 friendly protect tiles, and converts tiles to blue basics rather than straight up generating blue. So they really did nerf everything about his ap gen.As for worthy, I wonder if he is will have some niche uses as a means of absorbing match 4s in cl10. But the problem is that match3 damage (let alone power damage) will eat him alive against 650s, so I doubt it will be very reliable.Seems like both characters are dead to the meta now.
Spudgutter said: Vhailorx said: They didn't mention the change to Bishop's yellow. Now it requires 6 friendly protect tiles, and converts tiles to blue basics rather than straight up generating blue. So they really did nerf everything about his ap gen.As for worthy, I wonder if he is will have some niche uses as a means of absorbing match 4s in cl10. But the problem is that match3 damage (let alone power damage) will eat him alive against 650s, so I doubt it will be very reliable.Seems like both characters are dead to the meta now. To absolutely no one's surprise lol
Vhailorx said: I don't recall the last time a 4* was significantly nerfed (maybe the 'buff' to Mr. F?), but was the resale price 6k?Is 6k HP enough to justify selling a champ? I think the answer is clearly yes if you already have a dupe. But if you only have one copy of the character and no shards, what does everyone think? To me it is a tiny bit tempting, but not an easy 'yes.' HP is harder to get these days and 6k is several months worth of roster slots. But getting 15-30 covers for a vintage 4* is still a fair bit of work (assuming you had a baby champ). It will hurt on the off chance that a character's PVP rolls around. But that is pretty low odds, and the amount of non-essential usage I get for non-meta 4*s is absolutely trivial these days.
Michael1957 said: Vhailorx said: I don't recall the last time a 4* was significantly nerfed (maybe the 'buff' to Mr. F?), but was the resale price 6k?Is 6k HP enough to justify selling a champ? I think the answer is clearly yes if you already have a dupe. But if you only have one copy of the character and no shards, what does everyone think? To me it is a tiny bit tempting, but not an easy 'yes.' HP is harder to get these days and 6k is several months worth of roster slots. But getting 15-30 covers for a vintage 4* is still a fair bit of work (assuming you had a baby champ). It will hurt on the off chance that a character's PVP rolls around. But that is pretty low odds, and the amount of non-essential usage I get for non-meta 4*s is absolutely trivial these days. Is the offer of 6K HP permanent or a limited time offer ?
Vhailorx said: Michael1957 said: Vhailorx said: I don't recall the last time a 4* was significantly nerfed (maybe the 'buff' to Mr. F?), but was the resale price 6k?Is 6k HP enough to justify selling a champ? I think the answer is clearly yes if you already have a dupe. But if you only have one copy of the character and no shards, what does everyone think? To me it is a tiny bit tempting, but not an easy 'yes.' HP is harder to get these days and 6k is several months worth of roster slots. But getting 15-30 covers for a vintage 4* is still a fair bit of work (assuming you had a baby champ). It will hurt on the off chance that a character's PVP rolls around. But that is pretty low odds, and the amount of non-essential usage I get for non-meta 4*s is absolutely trivial these days. Is the offer of 6K HP permanent or a limited time offer ? Limited time. Usually ~4 weeks immediately following a berf