C4rol passive giving ap to AI?

eddiditeddidit Posts: 85 Match Maker
Just as the title says while fighting God Emperor Doom whenever they made a yellow match Carol's passive triggered I gained 4 red but the AI also gained the yellow AP from the match as well as blue, green, and black ap. I don't see any description to explain this. 

Comments

  • MoosePrimeMoosePrime Posts: 331 Mover and Shaker
    Is that the AP the Doombots generated?
  • eddiditeddidit Posts: 85 Match Maker
    Do they normally generate ap at the end of the round, I always thought they generate at the beginning. 
  • eddiditeddidit Posts: 85 Match Maker
    I also want to point out that this happened when multiple times in a round the strongest color was matched through cascades. 
  • MoosePrimeMoosePrime Posts: 331 Mover and Shaker
    I don't know about the in turn timing of the AP generation.

    That node had one Doombot was making blue and green, and the other making yellow and black.
  • eddiditeddidit Posts: 85 Match Maker
    That's so weird if they generate at the end of a turn cause then it allows them to spam ap if a cascade happens. 
  • abmorazabmoraz Posts: 572 Critical Contributor
    eddidit said:
    That's so weird if they generate at the end of a turn cause then it allows them to spam ap if a cascade happens. 
    Without delving too deep into "how the sausage is made".... This is most likely just a visual glitch and not a functional one.

    To explain why: From a programming perspective, there are 2 parts to playing the game on your device: the game engine and the display engine.  They way they work (in a VERY high level manner) is that the game engine figures out every thing that happens UNTIL it runs into an event that requires input from a player.  It calculates all of that in milliseconds.  That could includes, but is not limited to, AI moves, cascades, passive powers, AI active powers, knock-out effects, attack tile damage, countdowns/repeater tiles, etc...  This also means that if the player's team is paralyzed for multiple rounds that all of the events the AI does are calculated at once.

    The game engine does all this, as said before, in milliseconds.  The engine then sends a list of what happened to the display engine.  They display engine goes "Ok, lock-out any player input until we do all this", then proceeds to animate everything that happened.  Once it has finished all of the display renderings, it unlocks the player input and allows you to make a move.

    I wager what is happening in your case, is that the display command to "update opponent AP" is getting combined with the previous update.  To explain further:

    What should be happening is:
    1. Start AI turn
    2. Update AP (passive AP update for Doombots)
    3. Animate GED's move
    4. Fire Carol's Passive in response (because this happens as a response, it gets inserted into the stack immediately)
    5. Update HP bars for damage (Carol's passive attack
    6. Update AP bars (Carol's passive attack)
    7. Update HP bars for damage (GED's match, now runs after Carol's interrupt)
    8. Update AP bars (GED's match)
    What I suspect happens is that the code to update the AP value and animate it has a check in it that says something like "If an update already appears, just combine that one with this one and paint the screen once".  This is fairly common in programming as it saves resources.  So I guess what I'm saying is that, while it is possible that they are generating AP twice, it's more likely that the new game and display engine is combining some of the updates to save resources and it makes the outcome a bit... confusing.

    /this combination of actions is similar to why to can sometimes still get hit in PvP after shielding.  The hit has already occurred, but the server side hasn't told your game device yet because it is batching the updates together to save bandwidth.

  • eddiditeddidit Posts: 85 Match Maker
    abmoraz said:
    eddidit said:
    That's so weird if they generate at the end of a turn cause then it allows them to spam ap if a cascade happens. 
    Without delving too deep into "how the sausage is made".... This is most likely just a visual glitch and not a functional one.

    To explain why: From a programming perspective, there are 2 parts to playing the game on your device: the game engine and the display engine.  They way they work (in a VERY high level manner) is that the game engine figures out every thing that happens UNTIL it runs into an event that requires input from a player.  It calculates all of that in milliseconds.  That could includes, but is not limited to, AI moves, cascades, passive powers, AI active powers, knock-out effects, attack tile damage, countdowns/repeater tiles, etc...  This also means that if the player's team is paralyzed for multiple rounds that all of the events the AI does are calculated at once.

    The game engine does all this, as said before, in milliseconds.  The engine then sends a list of what happened to the display engine.  They display engine goes "Ok, lock-out any player input until we do all this", then proceeds to animate everything that happened.  Once it has finished all of the display renderings, it unlocks the player input and allows you to make a move.

    I wager what is happening in your case, is that the display command to "update opponent AP" is getting combined with the previous update.  To explain further:

    What should be happening is:
    1. Start AI turn
    2. Update AP (passive AP update for Doombots)
    3. Animate GED's move
    4. Fire Carol's Passive in response (because this happens as a response, it gets inserted into the stack immediately)
    5. Update HP bars for damage (Carol's passive attack
    6. Update AP bars (Carol's passive attack)
    7. Update HP bars for damage (GED's match, now runs after Carol's interrupt)
    8. Update AP bars (GED's match)
    What I suspect happens is that the code to update the AP value and animate it has a check in it that says something like "If an update already appears, just combine that one with this one and paint the screen once".  This is fairly common in programming as it saves resources.  So I guess what I'm saying is that, while it is possible that they are generating AP twice, it's more likely that the new game and display engine is combining some of the updates to save resources and it makes the outcome a bit... confusing.

    /this combination of actions is similar to why to can sometimes still get hit in PvP after shielding.  The hit has already occurred, but the server side hasn't told your game device yet because it is batching the updates together to save bandwidth.

    That actually makes a lot of sense, thanks for explaining. 
  • TPF AlexisTPF Alexis Posts: 3,774 Chairperson of the Boards
    eddidit said:
    Do they normally generate ap at the end of the round, I always thought they generate at the beginning. 
    Minions do actually generate AP at the end of their Turn. Take your time on a DDQ node some time and watch their AP bar carefully.
  • abmorazabmoraz Posts: 572 Critical Contributor
    eddidit said:
    abmoraz said:
    eddidit said:
    That's so weird if they generate at the end of a turn cause then it allows them to spam ap if a cascade happens. 
    Without delving too deep into "how the sausage is made".... This is most likely just a visual glitch and not a functional one.

    To explain why: From a programming perspective, there are 2 parts to playing the game on your device: the game engine and the display engine.  They way they work (in a VERY high level manner) is that the game engine figures out every thing that happens UNTIL it runs into an event that requires input from a player.  It calculates all of that in milliseconds.  That could includes, but is not limited to, AI moves, cascades, passive powers, AI active powers, knock-out effects, attack tile damage, countdowns/repeater tiles, etc...  This also means that if the player's team is paralyzed for multiple rounds that all of the events the AI does are calculated at once.

    The game engine does all this, as said before, in milliseconds.  The engine then sends a list of what happened to the display engine.  They display engine goes "Ok, lock-out any player input until we do all this", then proceeds to animate everything that happened.  Once it has finished all of the display renderings, it unlocks the player input and allows you to make a move.

    I wager what is happening in your case, is that the display command to "update opponent AP" is getting combined with the previous update.  To explain further:

    What should be happening is:
    1. Start AI turn
    2. Update AP (passive AP update for Doombots)
    3. Animate GED's move
    4. Fire Carol's Passive in response (because this happens as a response, it gets inserted into the stack immediately)
    5. Update HP bars for damage (Carol's passive attack
    6. Update AP bars (Carol's passive attack)
    7. Update HP bars for damage (GED's match, now runs after Carol's interrupt)
    8. Update AP bars (GED's match)
    What I suspect happens is that the code to update the AP value and animate it has a check in it that says something like "If an update already appears, just combine that one with this one and paint the screen once".  This is fairly common in programming as it saves resources.  So I guess what I'm saying is that, while it is possible that they are generating AP twice, it's more likely that the new game and display engine is combining some of the updates to save resources and it makes the outcome a bit... confusing.

    /this combination of actions is similar to why to can sometimes still get hit in PvP after shielding.  The hit has already occurred, but the server side hasn't told your game device yet because it is batching the updates together to save bandwidth.

    That actually makes a lot of sense, thanks for explaining. 
    And... the 191 update yesterday changed some of that... so this is outdated now.  The display_engine no longer locks out player input while rendering its actions...


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