Attack trigger & until end of turn effects need rework

Tilwin90Tilwin90 Posts: 638 Critical Contributor
So I know there has been quite a bit of a discussion around about the "badly designed" attack trigger effects in Ixalan.
The issue with this approach is that not only it complicates board states way too much (I get creature order matters, but no need to go overboard), but also makes certain cards look much more overcosted rather than its proposed translation, not to mention awkward.
Now, I've compiled a neat little list here of cards that should really be revised, and the proposed reworking:

Belligerent Brontodon - this one is actually correct as it triggers on each creature attacking. But if a creature cannot attack because of 0 power, it does not get to trigger the effect. This is a huge flaw, that in paper magic would actually work properly.
Proposed translation: Creatures you control have "At the beginning of your combat step, this creature's power becomes equal to its toughness until end of turn".

Captain Lannery Storm - Once again, translated from paper magic where it finds the treasure on attack.
Proposed translation: At the beginning of your combat step, find a Treasure. [...]

Goring Ceratops - If it's your last creature, its ability is pointless.
Proposed translation: At the beginning of your combat step, other creatures you control gain double strike until end of turn.

Glorifier of Dusk - why does it gain Vigilance until end of turn? It's pointless during one's turn, effective only on opponent's turn. (again, different from paper magic... way different!)
Proposed translation: Activate 2 white: Glorifier of Dusk gains vigilance until the beginning of your next turn. You lose 1 life. [...] (gonna leave aside the loss of life remark regarding MTGPQ as it's actually damage all the time)
I guess it would also gain flying until the beginning of your next turn too, for some extra synergy.

Tilonalli's Skinshifter - Although I get some interesting interaction here, I wish it were not impacted by already happened combat damage, so beginning combat sounds more appropriate. Especially since the difference between paper magic and MTGPQ is that when a creature is dealt damage, its toughness is actually decreased, hence the +Y is much less effective.
Proposed translation: At the beginning of your combat set, Tilonalli's Skinshifter gets +X/+Y, where X is the power and Y is the toughness of the first other creature you control.

Surprisingly small list... But I guess these adjustments would still make some of us happy. Hope I didn't miss any of the cards, but I guess if I did people will jump in the comments.

Thank you for reading all this.

Comments

  • DaedaleDaedale Age Unconfirmed Posts: 7 Just Dropped In
    sometimes ago, effect like that ones were triggered all at once before the first creature attacks.

    I don't know why they update that but many créature became useless if not in first position:
    Consul's Lieutenant
    When this creature attacks, if it had Renowned, your other creatures gain +1/+1 until the end of your turn.
  • DBJonesDBJones Posts: 803 Critical Contributor
    Changing Belligerent Brontodon the way you suggest would actually make it worse overall, because it would weaken your creatures' when they take damage or if they start with higher attack than toughness. The second could be a reasonable drawback, but the first would be really annoying. Fixing the way attack triggers work in general would be nice though.
  • Tilwin90Tilwin90 Posts: 638 Critical Contributor
    edited March 2018
    @DBJones The current description also suggests the same. For a negative X value (more power than toughness) it would end up doing the same. Of course it's possible to always include "Whenever this creature attacks, if its power is less than its toughness, it becomes equal to its toughness until end of turn."
    Quite wordy, but that's because they didn't choose the paper magic wording (which of course in my opinion is preferable - "Each attacking creature you control assigns combat damage equal to its toughness rather than its power.")
  • DBJonesDBJones Posts: 803 Critical Contributor
    True, I more wanted to bring up the way persistent damage effects this card, which isn't a thing in paper. If your creatures take damage, this card then makes them weaker, which is counter to enrage, the dino-specific ability. If regenerate were more common in this game (I think every enrage dino should have it, at the very least) this would be less of an issue. Regenerate is rare in paper because it's a more powerful mechanic there, besides the dinos, I think rare+ creatures with defender/reach/vigilance/berserker should generally have some regenerate.
  • Tilwin90Tilwin90 Posts: 638 Critical Contributor
    edited March 2018
    DBJones said:
    True, I more wanted to bring up the way persistent damage effects this card, which isn't a thing in paper. If your creatures take damage, this card then makes them weaker, which is counter to enrage, the dino-specific ability. If regenerate were more common in this game (I think every enrage dino should have it, at the very least) this would be less of an issue. Regenerate is rare in paper because it's a more powerful mechanic there, besides the dinos, I think rare+ creatures with defender/reach/vigilance/berserker should generally have some regenerate.
    There's more balancing to consider actually here...
    - I agree that Belligerent Brontodon would be more powerful if it considered "base toughness" actually (which would mean card printed toughness * (1+ number of reinforcements)). But then again, I guess buffing its toughness also makes it more interesting (and there are cards that can permanently give +0/+X to cards...), or effects that "Heal" other than regenerate (though those are very rare, only one I think in the form of Tainted Remedy?)
    - The thing with damage is that although damage is not "erased" at the end of turn, but remains permanent in MTGPQ, there is no choice in combat either. So defenders/vigilance/reach creatures feed dinos quite nicely, while in paper magic you can always choose to avoid blocking an Enrage creature if it's the smarter thing to do. So given that, it's more of an apples and pears situation, and Oktagon should consider more than just a blah translation. Heck, even the card draw dino is underwhelming in MTGPQ when compared to paper magic...

    N.B.: The issue of the thread still remains useless and less impactful effects being triggered on "creature attacking" instead of "beginning of combat".
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