Something fishy about recent PvE and PvP event characters

Unknown · June 2014

As the new healing changes rolled out this week, the PvE heroic tournament include GSBW as a permitted character, who at the same time had a featured PvP tournament.

The current heroic PvE event includes Daredevil and Punisher as the only widely available 3* characters. Daredevil has a PvP tournament soon, and the next up is Punisher.

This can't be a coincidence. It seems likely that certain people are watching how 3* double duty affects the number of consumables purchased over the next week.

bloafx69 · June 2014

I have to commend D3 because I've never seen a game company try so friggin' hard to make money. I honestly don't know why, they HAD to have been making tons of money before making all of these unpopular decisions.

Dang whales!!!!

Unknown · June 2014

You make a valid point, without viable healing they really should not have any heroes pulling double duty by being buffed in PVE and PVP

Unknown · June 2014

Conspiracy!

That is also shockingly logical.

Yeah, this sounds about right to me.

Unknown · June 2014

For what it's worth, I also think featuring buffed OBW in concert with plenty of goon fights is meant to convince us that the "true healing" concept hasn't totally ruined her.

via Imgflip Meme Maker

Unknown · June 2014

bloafx69 wrote:

I have to commend D3 because I've never seen a game company try so friggin' hard to make money. I honestly don't know why, they HAD to have been making tons of money before making all of these unpopular decisions.

Dang whales!!!!

They just had a sale. They should be pooping money at this point, so if it's purely for a short term cash grab, they timed it poorly.

However, I think it's the opposite actually. They just made a buttload of cash from the sale (or I'd assume they did anyway), so immediately after that, they put in changes that would lead to a short term reduction in sales. By the time the next sale is on (a July 4th one wouldn't surprise me in spite of having just done one), people will have adjusted or quit, or they'll be new enough to not remember how it used to be.

Keep in mind, many of these games are looking to monetize the players within the first couple of weeks, or even the first few days. They have a high turnover of players. There are players playing now who probably don't know that there used to be cover packs with a guaranteed featured hero. Or that after that went away, the featured rate was a lot better than now (4-6%, used to be like 25%).

Sure people will quit. People would have quit anyway, it'll just be some different people quitting. There will continue to be new players. New players who start knowing only True Healing™, and won't be building specifically to take advantage of OBW/Spidey. They'll be useful but not overpowered characters to them.

NorthernPolarity · June 2014

clean_cut_hippie wrote:

For what it's worth, I also think featuring buffed OBW in concert with plenty of goon fights is meant to convince us that the "true healing" concept hasn't totally ruined her.

via Imgflip Meme Maker

What is with you guys and thinking that obw is now completely "ruined"? Turns out that aggressive recon is still one of the best abilities in the game, and that the character is still the best 2* support in the game. True healing changes a lot of things, but it doesnt change obw as a staple in the 2* roster.

Unknown · June 2014

NorthernPolarity wrote:

What is with you guys and thinking that obw is now completely "ruined"? Turns out that aggressive recon is still one of the best abilities in the game, and that the character is still the best 2* support in the game. True healing changes a lot of things, but it doesnt change obw as a staple in the 2* roster.

I think it's an elaborate ploy to get other people to use say, Moonstone, and thus weakening the competition.

killerkoala · June 2014

j12601 wrote:

bloafx69 wrote:

I have to commend D3 because I've never seen a game company try so friggin' hard to make money. I honestly don't know why, they HAD to have been making tons of money before making all of these unpopular decisions.

Dang whales!!!!

They just had a sale. They should be pooping money at this point, so if it's purely for a short term cash grab, they timed it poorly.

However, I think it's the opposite actually. They just made a buttload of cash from the sale (or I'd assume they did anyway), so immediately after that, they put in changes that would lead to a short term reduction in sales. By the time the next sale is on (a July 4th one wouldn't surprise me in spite of having just done one), people will have adjusted or quit, or they'll be new enough to not remember how it used to be.

Keep in mind, many of these games are looking to monetize the players within the first couple of weeks, or even the first few days. They have a high turnover of players. There are players playing now who probably don't know that there used to be cover packs with a guaranteed featured hero. Or that after that went away, the featured rate was a lot better than now (4-6%, used to be like 25%).

Sure people will quit. People would have quit anyway, it'll just be some different people quitting. There will continue to be new players. New players who start knowing only True Healing™, and won't be building specifically to take advantage of OBW/Spidey. They'll be useful but not overpowered characters to them.

they did sale so that when they look at the books especially right before end of heroic juggs with new sub par 3*character release. they can see a boost in revenue cause of the sale and "idiots" desperate for shiney new character, they can say "see "true healing" helped sales" and pat themselves in the back, but next quarter when they see the money dry up cause of this and i'll say it "a d *ck move". i'd be too late most people would have moved on to something else.

killerkoala · June 2014

Phantron wrote:

NorthernPolarity wrote:

What is with you guys and thinking that obw is now completely "ruined"? Turns out that aggressive recon is still one of the best abilities in the game, and that the character is still the best 2* support in the game. True healing changes a lot of things, but it doesnt change obw as a staple in the 2* roster.

I think it's an elaborate ploy to get other people to use say, Moonstone, and thus weakening the competition.

nope. using a "c" team means you are going to lose points in PvP, you just play your 5 matches if your lucky to play that many then and pray that no one attacks you till you are ready to play again.

Cragger · June 2014

killerkoala wrote:

you just play your 5 matches if your lucky to play that many then and pray that no one attacks you till you are ready to play again.

That assumes that everyone plays on a data enabled mobile device. This is not the case for all players. Unless you count getting 5-10 matches a day as acceptable.

Unknown · June 2014

NorthernPolarity wrote:

clean_cut_hippie wrote:

For what it's worth, I also think featuring buffed OBW in concert with plenty of goon fights is meant to convince us that the "true healing" concept hasn't totally ruined her.

via Imgflip Meme Maker

What is with you guys and thinking that obw is now completely "ruined"? Turns out that aggressive recon is still one of the best abilities in the game, and that the character is still the best 2* support in the game. True healing changes a lot of things, but it doesnt change obw as a staple in the 2* roster.

Look, I'm not despondent over the change. In fact, it generally benefits me since I have a 44 character roster and have gotten over the 3* transition hump. I'll confess to a little poorly considered hyperbole, but it's unfair to not recognize that it's a significant blow to the character. Aggressive recon may be one of the best abilities in the game, but AGD was one of the most IMPORTANT, particularly for 2* players.

NorthernPolarity · June 2014

clean_cut_hippie wrote:

NorthernPolarity wrote:

clean_cut_hippie wrote:

For what it's worth, I also think featuring buffed OBW in concert with plenty of goon fights is meant to convince us that the "true healing" concept hasn't totally ruined her.

via Imgflip Meme Maker

What is with you guys and thinking that obw is now completely "ruined"? Turns out that aggressive recon is still one of the best abilities in the game, and that the character is still the best 2* support in the game. True healing changes a lot of things, but it doesnt change obw as a staple in the 2* roster.

Look, I'm not despondent over the change. In fact, it generally benefits me since I have a 44 character roster and have gotten over the 3* transition hump. I'll confess to a little poorly considered hyperbole, but it's unfair to not recognize that it's a significant blow to the character. Aggressive recon may be one of the best abilities in the game, but AGD was one of the most IMPORTANT, particularly for 2* players.

But it isnt an unfair blow to the character because shes still a top tier 2* character relative to all of the other 2* characters. The main issue i had with your original post (and a ton of similar posts on the forum) is that this isnt about a character being overnerfed, its about prologue healing keeping 2*s players more competitive with 3* players, and that being taken away from people. You need to focus on that since what youre complaining about (character balancing) just isnt the cause of the main problem that is going on right now, which is how to allow 2* to still be able to progress into 3* reasonably.

Unknown · June 2014

NorthernPolarity wrote:

clean_cut_hippie wrote:

NorthernPolarity wrote:

clean_cut_hippie wrote:

For what it's worth, I also think featuring buffed OBW in concert with plenty of goon fights is meant to convince us that the "true healing" concept hasn't totally ruined her.

via Imgflip Meme Maker

What is with you guys and thinking that obw is now completely "ruined"? Turns out that aggressive recon is still one of the best abilities in the game, and that the character is still the best 2* support in the game. True healing changes a lot of things, but it doesnt change obw as a staple in the 2* roster.

Look, I'm not despondent over the change. In fact, it generally benefits me since I have a 44 character roster and have gotten over the 3* transition hump. I'll confess to a little poorly considered hyperbole, but it's unfair to not recognize that it's a significant blow to the character. Aggressive recon may be one of the best abilities in the game, but AGD was one of the most IMPORTANT, particularly for 2* players.

But it isnt an unfair blow to the character because shes still a top tier 2* character relative to all of the other 2* characters. The main issue i had with your original post (and a ton of similar posts on the forum) is that this isnt about a character being overnerfed, its about prologue healing keeping 2*s players more competitive with 3* players, and that being taken away from people. You need to focus on that since what youre complaining about (character balancing) just isnt the cause of the main problem that is going on right now, which is how to allow 2* to still be able to progress into 3* reasonably.

I used the wrong word, or rather I didn't put enough explanatory words around it. Consider myself chastened. She is ruined for the purposes that she was being previously used. In truth I was more focused on posting an amusing meme than being the poster boy for this side of this tired discussion.

NorthernPolarity · June 2014

Yeah, the entire forum kind of feels like a tired discussion at this point. Apologies for being overbearing/nitpicky. I think these kind of times just bring out the worst in me. Reading pages and pages of hate/quit threads just eventually gets into my head, especially those with extremely poor reasoning and justification (which im not saying your post was). I should probably just lay off general discussion for a while and watch more of the wire or something like that.

Unknown · June 2014

NorthernPolarity wrote:

I should probably just lay off general discussion for a while and watch more of the wire or something like that.

No harm, no foul. I've been reading your posts for months now, and know where you're coming from. Of course watching more of The Wire is NEVER a bad plan.

mohio · June 2014

The Wire is amazing, so if you haven't seen it all the way through yet, what are you doing here? Go watch!

As for the OBW thing; I agree with NP that she's still top tier (for 2* obv) and the best 2* support, plus like the only viable Blue/Purple user in all of 2* until they do their magic with MHawkeye. NP,I don't get your comment on 2* players keeping up with 3* players by prologue healing though. From my experience in 2* land OBW heal was useful just to keep my Thor/Wolvie (never did have a usable Ares) at/near max health so I wouldn't have to waste time in prologue or risk running out of health packs when I got cascaded to oblivion. Were 2* players "keeping up" by healing the guys they were using in PvE? Also when you're a 2* player and you have a decent score in PvP, you don't have time to prologue heal cause another Ares/OBW player or a 3* player who tanked is just going to kill you while you're off healing. Anyway, just didn't understand the comment as I really don't see how Prologue heal was ever an issue outside of healing guys used in PvE cause your scaling got too high and they're dealing way too much damage.

Unknown · June 2014

I agree that having characters pull double-duty in heroic PvE and featured PvP puts a painful squeeze on healing, especially after the recent massive healing nerf.

However, I think that was probably an unintended side effect, or at a minimum, not the primary goal. Heroic PvE is limited to an 8-man roster, and unless you are pretty far along in your progression, you may well be missing one or more of those characters, or might not have enough covers on some of the characters to be able to field much of a team. For missing 1* and 2* characters, that's less of an issue, since PvP nodes hand out those covers like candy (of course, if you have a less-developed roster, you might still be screwed by not having enough roster spots for everyone, but that's its own topic). For missing 3*s, the only way you are likely to pick up additional covers in any useful quantity is to have that character featured in a PvP tournament.

I believe there have been back-to-back heroics before, but in the past, it's been a "Round 1"/"Round 2" of the same heroic twice. I like limited-roster events every once in a while, because I think they do get people to see the value of certain uncommon character interactions, but they can be frustrating when you don't have enough of the available characters to push as hard as you'd like.

TL;DR Featured PvP is how you get missing 3*s in the middle of a Heroic PvE.

Unknown · June 2014

I think who the pvp/pve double duty for 3* characters is also an incentive to level up them because they are buffed and usable in both pvp and pve

Unknown · June 2014

Neither Daredevil nor Punisher are essential characters in this round of the heroic.

The essential characters in PVEs have often been linked to PVPs. Maybe you think it's to get people to buy health packs (the least efficient monetization I could ever possibly imagine) or maybe it's because the devs prefer that characters can be seen as useful.

I pumped ISO into DD because I saw he had both a PVP tournament and a buff in PVE. It gives me an incentive to make him useful if I'm going to use him. Had he only been featured in one, like say, M Hawkeye always is, he'd sit at the back of my roster doing nothing.

Having them pull "double duty" allows newer players (and older players) to see the utility in a character and make them useful.

Maybe you'll have a point if Punisher is the essential character when Army of One is run, but if it's DD during Army of One then again, your argument is pointless as there's no need to use them.

Something fishy about recent PvE and PvP event characters

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